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BBC Matrix H

fizzywiggs41

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Hi Folks.
Did anyone on this thread manage to download the Matrix H encoded Queen BBC sessions from 1977?
Or perhaps the SQ encoded Queen At Golders Green in 1973?
I might get lucky, miracles do happen! :-D


Try Queen -On Air. (CD)
I believe the 77 tracks are the H broadcast.


Additionally some of the earlier tracks may indeed be SQ encoded.
 

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I do have the On Air release, but it is my understanding that the 1977 BBC sessions are not Matrix H encoded on that release.
Can you please tell me your source that implies they are?
Thanks.
 
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tadploe

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Regarding On Air Golders Green 1973, I have tried SQ decode and there is certainly some difference between the four resulting channels.
Thanks for prompting me to take another look at it.
I used Ogre Battle for the test this time, here's the resulting screen grab from Audacity (any comments are welcome).
 

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Brice

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Hello,

I haven't contributed to this thread before. I'm simply here to let you know that there is a new version of Stereo Lab available from today (3.1.14) which includes a quadraphonic decoder for BBC Matrix H (HJ) material. This will also work reasonably well for UMX, BMX, UD-4 discs.


In the interests of full disclosure, I am one of the partners of Pspatial Audio.


Stereo Lab is available is available in a free demo version, so you can experiement with the Matrix H decode.

Best wishes,

Richard
 

tadploe

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Thank you for the links, I have requested a demo version.
 

fizzywiggs41

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I do have the On Air release, but it is my understanding that the 1977 BBC sessions are not Matrix H encoded.
Can you please tell me your source that implies they are?
Thanks.

Well I knew it was John Peel that originally was the dj for the live tracks, and I had read that the month jived for the broadcast , so.......
Out of my collection, supplied to me from a great h/hj collector in Britain at the time, the Queen broadcast was one I did not have.
and I had the belief originally that these were actual album tracks , not live , but that opinion went to the wayside
a year or two ago.
I did capture (again from my incredible collector's source) the intro to "We Will Rock You" sped up version when Jonathan King introduced Kid Jensen on New Years day 78 , only about 40 secs though.

On that I base my conclusion that these were the live Queen H tracks .
Also keep in mind some H and HJ tracks received rebroadcasts.....2nd and sometimes 3rd rebroadcast.


Of historic note some 90 plus posts on BBC quad H and quad HJ can be found at this link.
 

fizzywiggs41

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I do have the On Air release, but it is my understanding that the 1977 BBC sessions are not Matrix H encoded.
Can you please tell me your source that implies they are?
Thanks.






Well I knew it was John Peel that originally was the dj for the live tracks, and I had read that the month jived for the broadcast , so.......
Out of my collection, supplied to me from a great h/hj collector in Britain at the time, the Queen broadcast was one I did not have.
and I had the belief originally that these were actual album tracks , not live , but that opinion went to the wayside
a year or two ago.
I did capture (again from my incredible collector's source) the intro to "We Will Rock You" sped up version when Jonathan King introduced Kid Jensen on New Years day 78 , only about 40 secs though.

On that I base my conclusion that these were the live Queen H tracks .
Also keep in mind some H and HJ tracks received rebroadcasts.....2nd and sometimes 3rd rebroadcast.


Of historic note some 90 plus posts on BBC quad H and quad HJ can be found in the matrix threads page2 above ambisonic.
 

Simon A

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Ground Control to Major Fizz. You seem to be stuck in a Quantum Vortex Loop... Suggest you forego consumption of lunar mushroom for time being...
 

fizzywiggs41

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Ground Control to Major Fizz. You seem to be stuck in a Quantum Vortex Loop... Suggest you forego consumption of lunar mushroom for time being...


Ya sorry about that.
My neice showed me how to obtain a link with my tablet recently.......and f and double f......I could not get it to post from my clipboard .

But I gave it a hellll , of a good try, guy.
 

tadploe

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Thanks for your reply and info.
It seems the complete 1977 BBC session may have been broadcast in Matrix H by Jonathan King on Jan 2nd.
 

fizzywiggs41

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Thanks for your reply and info.
It seems the complete 1977 BBC session may have been broadcast in Matrix H by Jonathan King on Jan 2nd.

So your saying Queen was broadcast then ?
I have his quad show from then and it contains a variety of album cuts from 77 by various artists , not Queen , his were all Album tracks, not live.


AGAIN I refer you to the matrix h hj threads in the matrix lp etc section. There are 2 or 3 threads you should peruse.




The mod responsible for this thread should remove it and place it in with the matrix quad album threads.
Ambisonic is not quad.
 

tadploe

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I have looked again at your posts on those threads, and you mention four Queen tracks are played on January 2nd.
Those do indeed appear to be News Of The World "album tracks", and not from the 1977 BBC sessions.
Those same four "album tracks" are listed here - See Jonathan King Rules on Jan 2nd.
http://www.eclipse67.com/bbch.htm

I can find no indication of any other 1977 Queen session Matrix H broadcast.
I have also checked through a lot of Alan Freeman's Matrix H broadcasts and all I found was We Will Rock You (slow/fast) from session 6 (broadcast on November 26th 1977).
Although that broadcast featured Phil Manzanera in Matrix H, the Queen session track was not part of the quad sequence.
The complete Queen session tracks were played on the John Peel show on November 14th 1977, but that was not a quad broadcast.
https://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/269f4495585b479fac04862c2e83c74b
So perhaps it's just a myth that they were ever actually broadcast in Matrix H.
 
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Soundfield

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So perhaps it's just a myth that they were ever actually broadcast in Matrix H.

Yes, sadly, there’s a lot of such myths out there about what the BBC broadcast in quad. Most of them are based on misunderstandings (often arising from the material on Transcription Services discs which are not a catalogue of UK broadcasts despite what some people seem to think), hearsay, or are often just assumptions that “surely such and such must have been broadcast in quad”! The definitive Radio Times Genome Project has largely come to the rescue recently thank goodness – and basically if it isn’t in that database it really never happened!
 

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Quadraphonic search:

And:

Never heard of "Triphony" before:

BBC in quad
Our first-ever Experimental Broadcast in Quadraphony with Radio 2 (for Stereo listeners only) With your front two speakers bringing you Radio 2 on VHF Stereo (88-91 MHz), and another Stereo Receiver driving your two back speakers and tuned to Radio 3 on VHF Stereo (90-92.5 MHz), you will be able to hear this programme in Quadraphony. If you only possess one Stereo Receiver, tune this to Radio 2 on VHF Stereo, and tune a Mono Receiver (preferably VHF) to Radio 3. placing this behind you: you will then be able to hear this programme in Triaphony, or, if you prefer, Triphony. Introduced by Jimmy Kingsbury Technical direction BOB HARRISON Producer RAYMOND RAIKES Quad's 'surround sound'. p 5
 

Soundfield

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Quadraphonic search:

And:

Never heard of "Triphony" before:

BBC in quad
Our first-ever Experimental Broadcast in Quadraphony with Radio 2 (for Stereo listeners only) With your front two speakers bringing you Radio 2 on VHF Stereo (88-91 MHz), and another Stereo Receiver driving your two back speakers and tuned to Radio 3 on VHF Stereo (90-92.5 MHz), you will be able to hear this programme in Quadraphony. If you only possess one Stereo Receiver, tune this to Radio 2 on VHF Stereo, and tune a Mono Receiver (preferably VHF) to Radio 3. placing this behind you: you will then be able to hear this programme in Triaphony, or, if you prefer, Triphony. Introduced by Jimmy Kingsbury Technical direction BOB HARRISON Producer RAYMOND RAIKES Quad's 'surround sound'. p 5
Just to show my age - I heard that one off broadcast at the time (just after midnight as I recall!). I only had access to one stereo receiver at the time and so indeed had to listen triphonically! There was a complicated diagram in the Radio Times that explained how to set everything up - but it probably put most people off! Raymond Raikes was a great radio drama producer at the time and was always at the forefront of new production techniques - but I don't think this was his greatest work. It was all a bit weird and was not well received (pardon the pun) by critics - not surprising given everyone was trying to work out what to do with the new medium I guess. Understandably, it would be several years before the BBC got its act together (both technically, taking the time to develop a mono/stereo compatible matrix system and artistically in how to record properly for the medium) and was actually in a position to start broadcasting in quad routinely (at least for a year or so!)
 

fizzywiggs41

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Yes, sadly, there’s a lot of such myths out there about what the BBC broadcast in quad. Most of them are based on misunderstandings (often arising from the material on Transcription Services discs which are not a catalogue of UK broadcasts despite what some people seem to think), hearsay, or are often just assumptions that “surely such and such must have been broadcast in quad”! The definitive Radio Times Genome Project has largely come to the rescue recently thank goodness – and basically if it isn’t in that database it really never happened!

I would not put a lot of stock into the BBC RADIO TIMES as being totally accurate.

I have some H and HJ broadcasts that were indicated as stereo but they are clearly quad , the dj never lies, and thank goodness my old friend sought to record them when he did .
 
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Soundfield

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I would not put a lot of stock into the BBC RADIO TIMES as being totally accurate.
I've taken the Radio Times every week for about fifty years (!) and I would put an enormous amount of store by it. Agreed, there are very occasional errors but it is as near 100% reliable as makes no difference. They are the oldest programmes listings in the world and since starting in 1923 they've had a fair bit of practice in getting these things right! Their Genome project is an extraordinary undertaking and a resource of enormous value - can you imagine any other broadcaster doing such a thing?
 

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I received the following reply from the BBC today regarding the Alan Freeman Matrix H broadcast on January 28th 1978:

The session material used in the programme was as follows:
The Rods (repeat of 12/11/77 – “Life on the Line”)
Queen (repeat of 03/12/77 – “It’s Late” and 10/12/77 – “Melancholy Blues”)
John Martyn – “Small Hours”
Graham Parker and the Rumour – “Watch the Moon Come Down”
Rezillos – “Top of the Pops”
Siouxsie and the Banshees – “Love in a Voi

Tracks by the following artists were also played:
The Edgar Winter Group (“Frankenstein”/“Bull Fight and Toreador’s Song” - part of theme tune with “At the Sign of the Swinging Symbol”? It’s played at beginning and end, and is only a few seconds each time)
Manfred Mann’s Earth Band
Bob Dylan
XTC
Bill Bruford
Starcastle
Rush
David Sancious
Santana
Pink Floyd
George Harrison
Hot Snax
Jimi Hendrix
Hank C. Burnette
Roxy Music

I hope this helps,

Kind regards
 

Old Quad Guy

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I received the following reply from the BBC today regarding the Alan Freeman Matrix H broadcast on January 28th 1978:

The session material used in the programme was as follows:
The Rods (repeat of 12/11/77 – “Life on the Line”)
Queen (repeat of 03/12/77 – “It’s Late” and 10/12/77 – “Melancholy Blues”)
John Martyn – “Small Hours”
Graham Parker and the Rumour – “Watch the Moon Come Down”
Rezillos – “Top of the Pops”
Siouxsie and the Banshees – “Love in a Voi

Tracks by the following artists were also played:
The Edgar Winter Group (“Frankenstein”/“Bull Fight and Toreador’s Song” - part of theme tune with “At the Sign of the Swinging Symbol”? It’s played at beginning and end, and is only a few seconds each time)
Manfred Mann’s Earth Band
Bob Dylan
XTC
Bill Bruford
Starcastle
Rush
David Sancious
Santana
Pink Floyd
George Harrison
Hot Snax
Jimi Hendrix
Hank C. Burnette
Roxy Music

I hope this helps,

Kind regards
Wow, that's a heck of a list. Quad Siouxsie and the Banshees and Graham Parker and the Rumour, if that's what it was, in addition to the usual suspects.
 
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