Moving to All Digital Files: Can Someone Post a How-To?

[Eggplant]

Discs, discs, discs ... hundreds of ‘em.

The days of holding a 12” album cover in my hands while listening are long gone.
I never do that with today’s little miniatures.
So what good are they?

1) They’re a complete pain in the ass. The actual discs themselves. This format, or that one, my Sony plays SACD’s but only with analog out, and not Blu-Rays, while my Pioneer plays both but only single discs ... switch the AMP to analog for this CD, back to CD for Blu-Ray, but not DVD cuz that’s for the changer ...

And then there’s searching, searching, and not always finding, the one I want to listen to. And hoping it still plays.

2) They’re a complete pain in the ass. The sleeves, I mean. Super-jewels and regular jewels crack and cloud. And then there’s cardboard ... God help you with that.

3) Several of my discs no longer play. Some are burned dts CD’s, but many are SACD’s — usually Elton John titles. Finding your out-of-print favorite suddenly won’t play is no fun at all.

Plus, face it — this is 2018, the era of touchscreens.
I don’t use discs for anything.
Don’t even own a PC.
Just iPhone and iPad.
And a car.

It’s embarassing, but mostly I am too lazy to find my CD copy to play. I just open Google Music and click on it.

So I think all this would be better if I moved everything to some digital medium accessible by iPhone.
I know there are folk here who know all about FLAC’s and RAID’s and software and apps that rip and convert.
My knowledge of such things has gotten old with me.

Can someone who knows the current state of this stuff give me a primer?

In the recent DISCussion of Oppo’s demise several posters raised this subject.
I agree it’s probablly inevitable.

One caveat — and you won’t like it:
Don’t tell me to get a PC.
That is not happening.
I’ve had quite enough of bluescreen bloatware for several lifetimes.
If it can’t be done with iOS apps, I’ll have to pass.

Much thanks in advance.

 

[quicksrt]

Yes I think you should pass especially in regards to quad and surround. That is never going to be quite right on an iPod, iPad or iPhone.

I would get into books and movies I missed previously. Stick with CDs on a laptop, nothing wrong with that.

 

[dr. simple]

Well, if you don’t want to use a computer, you’re going to have to go the way of streaming services: Spotify, Amazon Music, Apple Music. If you want to OWN your collection and be in control of what is and what might not be available to you at any given time, you only have two choices: physical discs, or a computer on which to store the data from the physical discs. (And for the sake of completeness, forget about any multichannel with an iPhone or iPad.)

So if you still want to control your collection without the physical discs, when you concede that a computer is necessary, THIS is the definitive source of information: https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/converting-mch-discs-101-overview.22384/

 

[salsdali]

in the end all you'll need are external drives or cloud to store the info so that fits your criteria

but I know of no way to get that info from a disc to an external drive or cloud without a PC to do the copying

 

[winopener]

Dr. Simple said it perfectly.
Take also into account that:
1) nowadays PC are much more stable than in the past (everyone who's over 50 had their share of BSOD) and you can do everything even with a low-cost decent tv-box, no need for big $$$$
2) it's a lot easier to do in now, well and quickly, and hard disk space is cheaper than ever
3) any Recordable media (cd or dvd) will fail, it all depends WHEN. Some sooner, some later, no one will survive in the very long term.
4) why pressed media (blu-ray, sacd or whatever) are failing, such as the DSOTM bluray, is still unclear, but it is a further push to move everything into digital files.

 

[dr. simple]

The real shame about this thread is that, in my opinion, Eggplant is really missing out. Since I’ve ripped ALL my discs - CDs, SACDs, DVDAs, DVDs, DTS CDs, BDs - to my server, finding and playing anything and everything through my 5.1 system is easier than ever, using my iPhone or iPad as a remote control. My smart TV in the family room has access as well via the Plex app, and played through a 5.1 system (albeit not in full resolution due to Plex). As many of you who have done this already know, going from a stereo track from a CD to a quad mix from an SACD to a 5.1 mix from a BD is one of the coolest conveniences of having a media server.

Special thanks once again and always to Garry (HomerJAU) for all the help he’s given me and so many others on this forum.

 

[skindzier]

PC is definitely the best way to do it in my opinion.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

If it can’t be done with iOS apps, I’ll have to pass.

As others have said, If you are gonna take a hard stand with that comment, its going to be a pass for you.

There is no way around the need for a PC to do the ripping process. The good news is the "ripper" doesn't need to be anything extravagant. An inexpensive laptop with a portable Blu-ray burner will rip everything that comes on an optical disk except SACDs. All the ripping/conversion software can be accumulated for free, or at least cheaply. In addition, for SACDs you will need one of the Oppo/Pioneer/Sony players that are capable of doing SACD rips (you can find this info in other places on the forum). I believe you will also need a network of some kind.

Its not clear in your post if you are looking to digitize analog sources like LP's and such. I've never ripped LPs myself, but to do that you will need an ADC (Analog to Digital converter) along with a turntable and a way to get a line level output from it. The right laptop may be able to digitize those for you as well. Someone with more knowledge on this aspect may want to jump in and provide a better answer for this.

Once something is ripped you have to store it somewhere. You are going to amass a lot of data in the form of ripped audio files and the amount of storage needed can be considerable depending on the size of the library. You can do that with a stand alone hard drive connected to your playback device, a NAS device (Network Attached Storage), or store in a cloud somewhere. I have no experience with the latter. You will also want a way to easily back up the library.

Once everything is ripped and stored, you can manage the playback using various set top boxes that don't look like computers, but they actually are. Maybe something like this. But there are many others. Again I've never owned one (I use a dedicated mini PC), but my understanding is they work pretty well, even for MC sound (maybe check with HomerJAU on this). Its definitely worth taking a chance considering the $100 asking price. You can control something like this with a smartphone or tablet. Still, I believe nearly anything that can handle MC is going to be Android, Windows, or Linux based. So if you absolutely gotta have IOS, its going to limit your choices.

Re-reading what I wrote, it seems complicated. And depending on your starting point, it may even seem overwhelming at first. But once you start doing it, it becomes quite easy and routine very quickly. Should you decide to jump in, I guarantee you will get more use and enjoyment out of your music collection than ever before. I can also guarantee there are lots of highly knowledgeable people here who are willing to help you out if you get stuck.

And I also have to echo what the good Doctor has said about Gary (HomerJAU) who has given me tons of help and guidance since I began all this.

 

[dr. simple]

Should you decide to jump in, I guarantee you will get more use and enjoyment out of your music collection than ever before. I can also guarantee there are lots of highly knowledgeable people here who are willing to help you out if you get stuck.

Truer words have never been spoken!

 

[skherbeck]

Just start like I did... get a laptop, download DVD-AE, and pop a DVD-A in. Done... you've ripped your first disc. Then you'll want some artwork so you'll download a tagging program... then you'll rip another, and another... then you'll want to listen to them, etc... just take the first step!

“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.”

 

[MCDave]

Discs, discs, discs ... hundreds of ‘em.

Files, files, files...you're going to have THOUSANDS of them. Much bigger PITA to manage if you ask me.

1) They’re a complete pain in the ass. The actual discs themselves. This format, or that one, my Sony plays SACD’s but only with analog out, and not Blu-Rays, while my Pioneer plays both but only single discs ... switch the AMP to analog for this CD, back to CD for Blu-Ray, but not DVD cuz that’s for the changer ...

You created this PITA yourself by not buying an Oppo universal player. Oppo players are the finest performing players on the planet, and you can still buy them used all day long. Oppo will remain in business to service these players for many years, as well as provide firmware updates. My entire multichannel system consists of one Oppo player, two stereo power amps and 4 speakers. That's all that is needed. Simple, simple, simple.

And then there’s searching, searching, and not always finding, the one I want to listen to. And hoping it still plays.

The searching isn't going to be any easier or faster when trying to find files. The searching is due to either not knowing what you want to listen to, in which case files aren't going to help, or the fact that your disc collection isn't organized. My music collection, which consists of NOTHING BUT discs, is organized by genre, and alphabetically within the genre sections. I can find any title I want in about 5 seconds.

2) They’re a complete pain in the ass. The sleeves, I mean. Super-jewels and regular jewels crack and cloud. And then there’s cardboard ... God help you with that.

How you can characterize a simple jewel box as a "complete pain in the ass" is beyond me. They don't crack and cloud unless you don't treat them properly. Cardboard? I LOVE it. Greatest invention ever was the cardboard digipack!

In the recent DISCussion of Oppo’s demise several posters raised this subject.
I agree it’s probablly inevitable.

Oppo isn't going out of business. They're just not going to produce any new players. They will remain in business indefinitely to continue to support their existing players and provide fixes via firmware upgrades.

As far as disc players disappearing...uh, yeah. There are TENS OF BILLIONS of CDs and DVDs out there that are going to need players for many years to come. They're not going anywhere, anytime in our lifetimes.

Don’t tell me to get a PC.
That is not happening.
I’ve had quite enough of bluescreen bloatware for several lifetimes.

The Windows blue screen of death disappeared many years ago, as did bloatware on new PCs. Windows PCs today are stellar. There is no reason to shun them. And, as others have pointed out, your plan is almost impossible without one.

Convert your music to files if you really want to, but there is only ONE legitimate reason to do so, in my opinion, and that's portability. But of course, headphones don't do multichannel (yet). Your problems can all be solved by improving the organization of your disc collection, and trading all your different players for a single Oppo universal player.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

Files, files, files...you're going to have THOUSANDS of them. Much bigger PITA to manage if you ask me.

You created this PITA yourself by not buying an Oppo universal player. Oppo players are the finest performing players on the planet, and you can still buy them used all day long. Oppo will remain in business to service these players for many years, as well as provide firmware updates. My entire multichannel system consists of one Oppo player, two stereo power amps and 4 speakers. That's all that is needed. Simple, simple, simple.

The searching isn't going to be any easier or faster when trying to find files. The searching is due to either not knowing what you want to listen to, in which case files aren't going to help, or the fact that your disc collection isn't organized. My music collection, which consists of NOTHING BUT discs, is organized by genre, and alphabetically within the genre sections. I can find any title I want in about 5 seconds..

Once the files are ripped, there is no managing to be done. You never need to touch them again. The only thing left is to play them. And they are all contained in something smaller than a shoebox.

You are way off base on the searching. In less time than it takes you to locate a title, I can not only find any title I own, but I can find any individual song in any format of any mastering I own and be playing it before you actually pull the disk off your shelf. And I can do this without ever even getting out of my seat. I can even find the song I want to hear without knowing what album it actually appears on.

How you can characterize a simple jewel box as a "complete pain in the ass" is beyond me. They don't crack and cloud unless you don't treat them properly. Cardboard? I LOVE it. Greatest invention ever was the cardboard digipack!.

They all have to be stored. Ya gotta find them, you gotta put them back. The text on the covers is so small you can only read them with a magnifying glass. All my album art is shown on a large screen TV. I even get full lyrics as the song plays, even for song titles that never came with printed lyrics to begin with. My biggest problem is where to store them. A good porton of mine end up packed away in cardboard boxes stacked up in my utility room.

Oppo isn't going out of business. They're just not going to produce any new players. They will remain in business indefinitely to continue to support their existing players and provide fixes via firmware upgrades.

Oppo is no longer in the audio business. They continue to sell phones in the Asian markets. That's what they did before they started selling any audio equipment. It remains to be seen what hoops an Oppo owner may need to go through in five years from now to get an old Oppo repaired. And it has nothing to do with whether Oppo is in business or not. They will be old products and old technology that very few will care about. Like getting a 90's circa turntable from an out-of-business manufacturers repaired today. And your assertion that Oppo will continue to offer firmware updates is wishful thinking on your part.

As far as disc players disappearing...uh, yeah. There are TENS OF BILLIONS of CDs and DVDs out there that are going to need players for many years to come. They're not going anywhere, anytime in our lifetimes.!.

I'll bet you said the same thing about LP records, VHS tape, 8 tracks, cassettes. I'm sure someone once said it about Edison cylinders and 78's? You can still get vintage equipment to play all those if you want to go that route. You can add DTS CDs and DVD-Audio to that list as well. In a few more years you can probably add SACD's.

The most obvious telltale sign that the end of the physical disk is at hand is how difficult it has become to buy a new car with a CD player. Even aftermarket CD players are no longer available for new cars. They play files.

The Windows blue screen of death disappeared many years ago, as did bloatware on new PCs. Windows PCs today are stellar. There is no reason to shun them. And, as others have pointed out, your plan is almost impossible without one.

Convert your music to files if you really want to, but there is only ONE legitimate reason to do so, in my opinion, and that's portability. But of course, headphones don't do multichannel (yet). Your problems can all be solved by improving the organization of your disc collection, and trading all your different players for a single Oppo universal player.

What I can say with certainty is this... I have never heard anyone who has digitized their collection regret that they did it. I have never heard of anyone doing it and then reverting back to playing disks. There are a lot of good reasons to do it, a few of which you cant fully grasp until you have tried it.

 

[atrocity]

Files, files, files...you're going to have THOUSANDS of them. Much bigger PITA to manage if you ask me.

But with the right server software (and really good ones are free), there really isn't "management" as such. When I first started, hard drives were maxed out at 2TB and I needed two of them to store everything. Due to my own inattention, in some extreme cases I wound up with crazy stuff like the same act being in four different directories, e.g., Drive 1 had "The Who" and "Who", as did Drive 2. What did that mean when I wanted to play an album by The Who? Absolutely nothing. I told the server to give me a list of everything by The Who and I got it.

The searching is due to either not knowing what you want to listen to

My favorite server option is when I ask it to give me a list of random albums and I choose either just one or add many to the queue.

I'm sure I've said this before: I never, ever understood the whole "put it online" thing until I tried it. I believe I've been doing it for ten years now and I'll never, ever go back.

 

[MCDave]

You are way off base on the searching. In less time than it takes you to locate a title, I can not only find any title I own, but I can find any individual song in any format of any mastering I own and be playing it before you actually pull the disk off your shelf. And I can do this without ever even getting out of my seat. I can even find the song I want to hear without knowing what album it actually appears on.

It doesn't matter. You still have to find what you want to hear once you've decided. It doesn't matter whether it's 5 seconds looking for a file or a 5 seconds looking for a disc.

Oppo is no longer in the audio business. They continue to sell phones in the Asian markets. That's what they did before they started selling any audio equipment. It remains to be seen what hoops an Oppo owner may need to go through in five years from now to get an old Oppo repaired. And it has nothing to do with whether Oppo is in business or not. They will be old products and old technology that very few will care about. Like getting a 90's circa turntable from an out-of-business manufacturers repaired today. And your assertion that Oppo will continue to offer firmware updates is wishful thinking on your part.

You are mistaken, sorry. Read the third paragraph on Oppo's farewell announcement: https://www.oppodigital.com/farewell.aspx Your other comments show your ignorance about Oppo's reputation and credibility.

I'll bet you said the same thing about LP records, VHS tape, 8 tracks, cassettes. I'm sure someone once said it about Edison cylinders and 78's? You can still get vintage equipment to play all those if you want to go that route. You can add DTS CDs and DVD-Audio to that list as well. In a few more years you can probably add SACD's.

The most obvious telltale sign that the end of the physical disk is at hand is how difficult it has become to buy a new car with a CD player. Even aftermarket CD players are no longer available for new cars. They play files.

Wrong again. Not only do many new cars still come with CD players as standard, mine did as well, a 2015 Hyundai Accent. In addition, Pioneer still has 22 new and current aftermarket radio head units that have built-in CD players, one of which I used to replace the one that came in my Hyundai. I didn't even bother to check other manufacturers, bud I did 2 years ago when I did my shopping and virtually all manufacturers of aftermarket car head units offer models with CD players. Once again you pull nonsense out of your ass and present them as facts.

Why would you bet I say the same thing about other previous formats? Is it because you like to express your disagreement by insulting my intelligence?

 

[LuvMyQuad]

You are mistaken, sorry. Read the third paragraph on Oppo's farewell announcement: https://www.oppodigital.com/farewell.aspx Your other comments show your ignorance about Oppo's reputation and credibility.

I want to make it clear that I think Oppo's reputation and credibility are stellar. I have owned two Oppos and there is one in my rack to this day. They are awesome machines. And whenever I needed anything from them, they were great to deal with.

But that was all so.... yesterday.

Being on the other side of this kind of business closing thing more than once, here is my best guess about what is happening at Oppo.

The vast majority of the Oppo audio development group has likely already moved on to greener pastures. And if any talent still remains, they will probably be let go or transferred in the near future. There is no new work to do. If they are smart about it they will hold on to one or two of the group that are close enough to it to carry on to the final end. There probably will be a couple of firmware updates for the latest products. because most of the work is likely already in the pipeline. Then, they will stop because there is no longer a dedicated engineering/development group.

There will still be some work for a customer service group, at least until all the remaining shipments are out the door. Then there will be drastic attrition in that group as well. After that, all that's left for them is the CS portion of the warranty work. I would expect Oppo will honor all its in-warranty work. They will keep a small tech group or possibly contract that service out if its more profitable (read this as "costs less" because in warranty service it will be a distinct negative on the balance sheet. CEO's hat those}. Unless the out of warranty work can turn a profit (which I doubt), they will eventually contract that service out. It certainly wont be the Oppo service we all know and love. In time, Oppo service will completely stop. Private techs and tech savvy hobbyists will likely rise up with offers to service the broken Oppo's of the world. There will be a niche market for repairs. There will be a healthy used market for many years.

Once the manufacturing process is shut down and no longer generating income, support personnel become very expensive commodities.
Its not an Oppo thing... its a business thing. You simply cannot afford to pay for support labor for a product line that no longer exists nor contributes to the bottom line. They are no different from any other enterprise. There are no "nice guys" in business.

The only real question is how long this will all take. My estimate is 3-4 years.

Regarding what is on the Oppo website, sure I read it. More than once. In the face of closing up shop with one more run of product to clean out the parts inventories and get one last infusion of cash did you expect them to say "beware that we'll certainly be gone in a couple of years"? Maybe I should have used the "its on the internet so it must be true argument".

No matter. The longevity of Oppo really isn't a point to argue about. You believe what you will, and spend your money accordingly. It matters not to me nor to anyone else that is looking at this thread since none of it addresses the OPs original concern.

Wrong again. Not only do many new cars still come with CD players as standard, mine did as well, a 2015 Hyundai Accent. In addition, Pioneer still has 22 new and current aftermarket radio head units that have built-in CD players, one of which I used to replace the one that came in my Hyundai. I didn't even bother to check other manufacturers, bud I did 2 years ago when I did my shopping and virtually all manufacturers of aftermarket car head units offer models with CD players. Once again you pull nonsense out of your ass and present them as facts.

OMG .... this hurts.... I had to pull all this out of my ass too.

I don't have experience with your Hyundai. But 2015 was nearly 4 car model years ago. And I agree the situation was a little different then. If you take a look you may see that it has gotten worse. Depending on what car company we are talking about the audio entertainment choices on new vehicles have gotten smaller every year.

Here is what I do have experience with. My wife drives Chrysler 300's. She likes them. Next month she will take delivery on her third 300 in 12 years. The 1st was a 2006 model. It came with a CD player and believe it or not, a cassette player. There were several optional entertainment systems she could have chose. Next up was a 2015 model. This was the first year Chrysler stopped offering CD players. I don't mean as standard equipment, I mean no option for one. To try and replace the factory sound system means replacing the entire dash control system. the camera system, the climate control functions, the Nav functions. No aftermarket system was available. Other entertainment options were only concerned with features that were non audio (navigation w-fi and such). You are expected to either listen to XM radio, rip your own music and play it back from an SD card or USB drive, or stream it from your smartphone. And this wasn't just her car, it was the entire Chrysler line (maybe not the mini van... not sure). Her new one will only offer more of the same. No physical media allowed.

I'm a Chevy guy. In 2007 I bought an Equinox that came with a factory CD unit. In 2017 I leased a Traverse. It also came with a standard CD player. but this one wont play gapless and sounds like crap. Sadly there were no aftermarket head units available, again because of the integrated control systems that share function with the entertainment system now. in 2020 my leas will be up. I already know they have removed the CD players from any of the SUVs I am likely To consider for a new vehicle.

Pioneer may well have head units for sale. But if you are thinking of buying something new off the lot any time soon look closely at what can actually be installed.

I feel much better after pulling that all out.

Why would you bet I say the same thing about other previous formats? Is it because you like to express your disagreement by insulting my intelligence?

I would bet on the format thing because that's what everyone who is deeply entrenched in a specific format says. There is money involved. People tend to need to justify it. Hey I did it too for a while back in the day.

I can vividly remember the used record guy back in the mid 80's telling me how I was a fool to go in so big for these Compact Disk things. They were a fad that would die out in a few years. They had several fatal flaws, the biggest of which was how you couldant record on them. Yeah, he went broke and closed up shop in 2 years.

Same thing with VHS. There were tens of billions of those tapes out there too. So many that the market would never disappear, right?

Now its CDs. Like Sting says, "History will teach us Nothing"'.

The real point I want to make here is that Pod Cat started this thread looking for an Apple based option with which to rip his music collection. His motivation was that he disliked dealing with the physical disks. He got several well worded responses regarding the limited availability of Apple software and some encouragement on how it really isn't as difficult as it seems. You on the other hand took a different tack. You decided he was full of shit with his opinion of physical media and further implied he should just carry on with playing disks because its a better way. Its not. Not for me, not for many like me, and probably not for him. Maybe it is for you. You didn't address Eggplant's question or concern at all. You just kinda told him he was a fool for thinking that way.

Lastly, I have avoided insulting you buy claiming you are pulling stuff out of your ass or calling you ignorant. That was by design. Its just not my style. What I will say is that in my life experience, the few times someone has accused me of insulting their intelligence, well, there really was no need to make an effort to prove they were on the low end of the smart scale. They always made that point quite clear on their own.

I'm out on this thread. Eggplant if you need any help or anything, just PM.

 

[JonUrban]

Do we always HAVE to insult each other?

 

[Frogmort]

Do we always HAVE to insult each other?

I am compelled to let you know that I love you Jon. Thanks again for everything!

The power of Quad compels me...

 

[JonUrban]

I am compelled to let you know that I love you Jon. Thanks again for everything!

The power of Quad compels me...

Sometimes I feel like the forum mother . . . . .

 

[atrocity]

Sometimes I feel like the forum mother . . . . .

That makes us the kids who genuinely appreciate you even though we sometimes think we're too cool to say it.

 

[Snood]

Well there is a way if his player is able to play 5.1 flacs........USB hookup with external hard drive and somebody willing to fill his external up with fun tunes.

Pod would have to be willing a lil bit and learn how to plug 2 plugs in (power cord & USB slot) and find the USB on the menu on the TV.....and search for albums

Would all depend on his player though