Quad hardware requirements

[pwreimers]

Recently I came into possession of a Kenwood KN-7044. Not knowing what it was, I bought it for $10 from the thrift store (still in the original box!). I was pleased to find it in mint condition, what it is and does. I have a fairly decent setup to run this 'quadrixer.'

Now, I'm interested in a quad turntable to hook up to it and I've found a couple of quadraphonic vinyl recordings to use. I was surprised to see the quad turntable I was looking at (a Dual 1229Q) still has only two RCA connector outputs. From this I assume that this turntable utilizes the 'matrix' method of quadraphonic sound recording and reproduction. Is this assumption true?

On the turntable: is a certain type of cartridges/stylus required?

I have more questions, but I want to go at this a little slow, as I'm learning.

Thanks, in advance,
Pete

 

[John Svensson]

Hi Peter, no such animal as a quad turntable, the decoding is done within the "audio receiver", the "how" depending on whether you are talking about SQ or QS matrix disc, or a CD-4 discrete quad disc. I'm not familiar with any Kenwood models, others may be, but the chances of it having a very effective matrix decoder are slim. What does it indicate it decodes, SQ or QS? If you intend to get into CD4 records, then you'll need to worry about the turntable/stylus you are using.

 

[karlkastner]

 

[pwreimers]

Hi Peter, no such animal as a quad turntable, the decoding is done within the "audio receiver", the "how" depending on whether you are talking about SQ or QS matrix disc, or a CD-4 discrete quad disc. I'm not familiar with any Kenwood models, others may be, but the chances of it having a very effective matrix decoder are slim. What does it indicate it decodes, SQ or QS? If you intend to get into CD4 records, then you'll need to worry about the turntable/stylus you are using.

Thanks John.
-At this time I do not have the instruction manual and am unable to discern if it decodes SQ or QS. Here is a picture of the rear of the unit:

-At this time, I only use the AUX1 2-channel input.
-The two vinyl recordings I have both say they are SQ, and were produced by Columbia.
-Regarding turntables:
1. can any 2 channel turntable play SQ recordings and be decoded by the Quadrixer (even if ineffective)?
2. the Dual 1229Q has the ability to play CD4 vinyl recordings, distinctly different from a Dual 1229. To do this, it requires a special cartridge and Shibata stylus. This appears to be the only real difference. If this is true, then, like in (1) above, it is not necessary to have the Dual 1229Q to play SQ vinyl recordings. Correct?

Thanks again,
Pete

 

[Quadzilla]

Thanks John.
-At this time I do not have the instruction manual and am unable to discern if it decodes SQ or QS. Here is a picture of the rear of the unit:
View attachment 34292
-At this time, I only use the AUX1 2-channel input.
-The two vinyl recordings I have both say they are SQ, and were produced by Columbia.
-Regarding turntables:
1. can any 2 channel turntable play SQ recordings and be decoded by the Quadrixer (even if ineffective)?
2. the Dual 1229Q has the ability to play CD4 vinyl recordings, distinctly different from a Dual 1229. To do this, it requires a special cartridge and Shibata stylus. This appears to be the only real difference. If this is true, then, like in (1) above, it is not necessary to have the Dual 1229Q to play SQ vinyl recordings. Correct?

Thanks again,
Pete

Hi Pete.

1. Yes
2. The only difference would be an anti-skating adjustment for Shibata styli (my 704 has the same thing), and possibly a low-capacitance tonearm cable; which is required for proper CD-4 playback. I replaced the cable on my 704 with a much better cable anyway, since the original was very old.

 

[Soundfield]

Sadly Pete, the "Quadrixer" is not a decoder of any description, but merely a simple effects generator. It uses a spring delay line (as used in the "reverb amps" for electric guitars back in the day) to introduce artificial reverberation into the 'rear' channels. Whilst it's got a lot of knobs, there's not much circuitry inside the box and the majority of the electronics are actually devoted to simply driving the fancy VU meters (!) as you can see from the circuit diagram which is downloadable here : http://www.audioservicemanuals.com/k/kenwood/Kenwood-KN/159341-kenwood-kn-7044-schematic ). It certainly looks pretty when lit up though!

 

[pwreimers]

Really. I'm wondering now: how do you know if you have a quadraphonic piece of equipment (are there special labels...etc.)?

 

[Quadzilla]

There will be a mode selector that says SQ, QS (could be labeled RM) and/or CD-4. Do some research though.
Figure out what you want to do, and what you want to play on the gear before you buy it.

 

[pwreimers]

...
Figure out what you want to do, and what you want to play on the gear before you buy it.

That simple piece of advice always goes the right way. I've heard it many times and it gives me direction. Thanks!

 

[Quadzilla]

I didn't mean to oversimplify it, but you could chase your tail for months and spend a ton of money, and still not get the results you want. Once you decide on the music, formats, etc. you want to play, then we can steer you into the best equipment. Finding something that plays SQ is a good place to start … and an RM setting would be a bonus. Avoid CD-4 unless you are really committed to it.

 

[pwreimers]

I didn't mean to oversimplify it...

For me, having simple forward motion may take longer, yet pays well. Thanks again.

Since this device is pretty much free, and it makes my basement sound setup bitchin' I'm keeping it as is. I do love analog meters. When I hooked it up, it surprised me as it had no 'phono' inputs. The outputs are strange, too (.1mV and 1.0mV, as i recall). The manual would be a bonus.

I have an entry level setup with my Fisher 200T driving Utah speakers, an Optonica 1515 driving some ATV123s down there. Laptop & radio, Dual 1015 turntable w Empire 888 cart. I've given up on cassettes, love vinyl sound and play digital stuff for convenience. It seems sterile, kinda. If I have a choice: vinyl. I'd sure like to see if reel tape decks are stable and reproduce vinyl better than my laptop. I think I'd spend the bucks there, and then the true Quad.

Basement sound is fun. I can turn it up! It's also the only place I can play a '4.0' system, although I really have two 2.0s, using this for reverb 4.0 (whatever that may be).

It's quasi-quad!

Regards,
Pete

 

[Quadzilla]

It doesn't have phono inputs because it is intended to be used with two stereo amplifiers. You would connect the phono to your Optonica and then route the front channels back into a tape monitor loop. The rear channel outputs would then feed a second stereo amplifier and speakers. If you got a quad reel machine, you would connect it directly to the Kenwood piece using the same (double-stereo) amplifier/speaker configuration.

 

[proufo]

It has two discrete four-channel inputs, so add a SM and an universal digital disc player and you have it covered. Forget about the 2-ch inputs.

You will need two matching (design and aesthetics) stereo power amps. It won't be much cool not having the all-vintage look. Look for KM-8002.

 

[Quadzilla]

It has two discrete four-channel inputs, so add a SM and an universal digital disc player and you have it covered. Forget about the 2-ch inputs.

You will need two matching (design and aesthetics) stereo power amps. It won't be much cool not having the all-vintage look. Look for KM-8002.

That is an excellent idea.

 

[pwreimers]

It has two discrete four-channel inputs, so add a SM and an universal digital disc player and you have it covered. Forget about the 2-ch inputs.

You will need two matching (design and aesthetics) stereo power amps. It won't be much cool not having the all-vintage look. Look for KM-8002.

Proufo & Quadzilla: I don't know what a SM is. Please explain? I'm new to this field.

Also, how to use the 4-ch inputs? I thought they would be reserved for something that has 4-ch outputs, like a reel tape deck.

And, I know you're trying to help me set this up, there is one more piece of equipment: I run the cassette, the turntable and the laptop (which has a disc player) into a Sony STRDB930 receiver and use its 2-room output to feed the 2-ch AUX-1 input of the quadrixer. Then, the quadrixer 1.0mV outputs feed the inputs on the two amplifiers.

If there's a better setup, I'd like to try it.

You're right about the coolness factor of having a matched setup, using the Kenwood line.

Regards,
Pete

 

[Quadzilla]

I don't know what SM is either.

You are on the right track though, and we are suggesting that you get a digital (DVD or Blu-ray) player that has multichannel (5.1-channel) analog outputs. You would set it up so that you only use four of those channels … e.g. no subwoofer or centre channels. There are a number of multichannel and/or quadraphonic albums released on those formats, and if you got a unit that also played SACDs that would be a bonus.

I use a multichannel Sony SACD/DVD player with a Sansui quad receiver in my home office, along with the Dual 704 in my earlier post.

 

[proufo]

Proufo & Quadzilla: I don't know what a SM is. Please explain? I'm new to this field.

It is a Surround Master. You can search for it here. It is a DSP-based QS and SQ (the two main matrix Quad formats) decoder. It receives two line inputs, mainly from a phono preamp, decodes them and outputs 4 channels.

Also, how to use the 4-ch inputs? I thought they would be reserved for something that has 4-ch outputs, like a reel tape deck.

That's a mission for the future, should you choose/decide to accept it.

But for now you would use it to receive discrete 4-ch outputs from the Surround Master and from the SACD/DVD-A and perhaps BD-A player.

Enjoy!

 

[proufo]

there is one more piece of equipment: I run the cassette, the turntable and the laptop (which has a disc player)

Not sure if you can feed stereo into the Surround Master and get 2.0/4.0 (not 5.0/5.1) outputs. Somebody here will help you with that.

You would use an external RCA switch (search for Zektor) to accommodate the multiple sources.[/QUOTE]

 

[pwreimers]

I don't know what SM is either.

You are on the right track though, and we are suggesting that you get a digital (DVD or Blu-ray) player that has multichannel (5.1-channel) analog outputs. You would set it up so that you only use four of those channels … e.g. no subwoofer or centre channels. There are a number of multichannel and/or quadraphonic albums released on those formats, and if you got a unit that also played SACDs that would be a bonus.

I use a multichannel Sony SACD/DVD player with a Sansui quad receiver in my home office, along with the Dual 704 in my earlier post.

View attachment 34325

Hey! Thanks for reminding me! I happen to have a Sony DVPNC555ES with extensive upgrades from SACDmods. That would be ideal for this.

It has two discrete four-channel inputs, so add a SM and an universal digital disc player ...

I looked at the Surround Master and it looks like hype to me. I remember a consistent reaction listeners had to the Pono device: "it's a close to vinyl recording" as you can get. The Surround Master only has an SQ option, and it's not standard. Not sure it can decode QS.

 

[proufo]

I looked at the Surround Master and it looks like hype to me. I remember a consistent reaction listeners had to the Pono device: "it's a close to vinyl recording" as you can get. The Surround Master only has an SQ option, and it's not standard. Not sure it can decode QS.

Look closer. It is a good product, sadly the A/D conversion and DSP processing is 16/44 (say, circa 1982) without input level adjustment to boot, but no one has ever complained.