Rush joins the "Box Set" crowd - Buy a box set, get a 5.1 disc

Just an FYI for any Canadians.... these box sets are now $46.62 on Amazon.ca, down from the previous $63.

I am tempted, but I think I'll still wait until there are a couple reviews. I am not confident the mix will be good. If it is a nice discrete mix, then I'll gladly pay $46 for the single DVDA. If the mix is poor, then it will feel like a waste of money.

i also think that $43 for single disc (CDs are out my interest) is pretty expensive
but have hope like previously with "Moving Pictures" (from initial $26 to $15), amazon
will lower the price to around 30 bucks, to boost the sales. sadly those morons never
can put with releases proper description. tell after - promotion is a moving force of commerce

From Richard Chycki (http://ww2.richardchycki.com/archives/225):
Based on the strong feedback from the Moving Pictures 5.1 remix, Universal Records had asked me to remix Fly By Night, A Farewell To Kings and Signals in surround to be included in their ‘Sector’ series of box set releases currently underway. Like Moving Pictures, all the multitrack masters I worked with were transferred from the original analog tapes at 96 kHz/24 bit resolution and this quality was maintained right down to the finished master. Listeners are in for a revelation of new detail for these releases.

peterzach said:

As far as the way the Rush surrounds are being sold, I don't like it either and will wait till they are sold as individual copies or hopefully as a surround box(like Genesis,Doors,Talking Heads etc). This is just getting silly the way these things are getting packaged.

peter

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OK, I guess I'm going to have to be the one to remind everyone that the labels stopped selling 5.1 separately as a stand alone product because it didn't work for them. Expecting them to just go right back to that busness model is just a tad off, boys. We are actually pretty lucky to get any 5.1 at all when you really think about it.

Thanks for the info.

So "Based on the strong feedback from the Moving Pictures 5.1 remix" Universal Records has decided that surround fans need to buy 5 CDs in order to get one DVD-Audio disc. On the other hand your average Rush fan is probably absolutely clueless about High Resolution music, let alone Surround sound and that's why the packaging this way. And if High Resolution Stereo sound is able to be played on any DVD player, than it might generate more interest in the rest of the contents of of the disc, especially if one has a "Home Theater Systems." Still, what would be wrong with marketing these surround discs just as Moving Pictures 5.1 was? I'm not sure if this is price gouging or packaging necessity in order to justify the expense to do the surround remixes. Of course Rush is rich enough and could cover the remixing costs themselves if that is an issue. Either way, this will bring surround music to a large group of people almost as if Led Zeppelin did surround mixes for the first time.

wanners said:

OK, I guess I'm going to have to be the one to remind everyone that the labels stopped selling 5.1 separately as a stand alone product because it didn't work for them. Expecting them to just go right back to that busness model is just a tad off, boys. We are actually pretty lucky to get any 5.1 at all when you really think about it.

Click to expand...

Yes, that sounds about right until the market can grow more. And it has to start again someway, somehow in order to penetrate the mainstream music market and have it's rightful place right along with stereo/Mono, which has always been surround sound's ultimate goal. Except now the technology is here quite well for cheap. So there should be no excuses now to not include surround with new releases.

wavelength said:

From Richard Chycki (http://ww2.richardchycki.com/archives/225):
Based on the strong feedback from the Moving Pictures 5.1 remix, Universal Records had asked me.......

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Anyone remember when "Jimby" (allegedly from UMG) argued that NO ONE wanted 5.1 discs in any format, and that there was no way the label would do surround music in the future?

".......oooooooooooooooooooooo, makes me wonder."

JonUrban said:

Anyone remember when "Jimby" (allegedly from UMG) argued that NO ONE wanted 5.1 discs in any format, and that there was no way the label would do surround music in the future?

".......oooooooooooooooooooooo, makes me wonder."

Click to expand...

I thought he sounded like a bitter jackass myself.

He was a classic case of a record company representative being told what would sell, by the customers who would do the buying, and he didn't recognize the potential for making money.

I think Jimby's getting a bum deal here. IIRC, he was employed on the technical side at Universal and at the time, his take was the prevailing attitude in the industry (and still is). While everyone here is of course, very pleased with the recent spate of multichannel surround releases, keep in mind that while perhaps 10 or 20 new mulitchannel titles of any significance came out this year, that is but a microscopic spec in relation to the tens of thousands of new standard releases that come out each year. I think that Jimby's departure from this forum had more to do with the fact that as the defacto "industry insider" his opinion and insight was sought after and then rejected and argued against when he presented an unpopular point of view. And BTW, I do not know Jimby personally, but the "bitter jackass" comment was really unnecessary.

Ok, here's my take on this, for what it's worth. Will anything and everything eventually be released in 5.1? Yes, after all of the "box sets" have run their course, after the record companies have used every configuration imaginable to milk more money from us, and after you've spent $500 on 15 different versions of the same album, finally, the end "remasters" will be done correctly, in 5.1. By that time 7.2 (or whatever else) will have taken of, so they can start all over again. In the meantime we get ripped off with every release and the record companies and artists are wondering why they are losing ground battling people downloading their tunes for free on bit torrent sites. It seems to me that I just recently saw the bluray disk from the DSOTM Immersion boxset uploaded the other day. Don't wanna release this stuff the way fans want it? Fine. They'll get it for free then. The only reason they release stuff this way is greed. I guess the counter measure to that is theft.

It is interesting that Jimby "checked out" of here on 2-14-2011, about a month and half before the RUSH 5.1 releases came out from Universal on April 5, 2011 after endlessly berating us about MC not selling. He wasn't very helpful to the cause of helping us get Multi-Channel out there while he was in some sort of position to do or say something, that is, if he was who he said he was. Certainly no one should be chased out of here for speaking their mind if they're sincere and for real.

Personally at about $100 or less I find the DSOTM Immersion box set a very good deal. I like all that extra stuff or crap as it gives one a tactile connection to the band and music that nothing else can replicate. But yes, absolutely with the economy being what it is a simple CD/BR version of this title would have generated more sales.

I have to say that this is really poor form. Jimby berating us about MC not selling? - Dude, MC wasn't and isn't selling. The mulitchannel extras included in the criminally overpriced boxed sets that you guys are falling all over yourselves about might as well be marbles or scarves to the music executives. Wait until next week when EMI is carved into several pieces and sold off to Universal and BMG - their ancient CEOs and flunkies - and I do mean ancient and flunkies - could give a crap about MC.

Sure MC doesn't sell like stereo. We already know that and have had to live through many disappointments throughout the years - decades even. We're trying to stay positive with a surround hobby that feels hopeless at times. We the fans or someone has to build the surround market from the ground up. Will it fail miserably time and again? Sure. But I'm not giving up and neither should anyone else who cares about surround music. It is a format for the future if it isn't here now for one to really immerse themselves into the music.

I went out of my way to be nice to Jimby and implored him to stay with us. He is welcome to chime in now and say whatever he wants to at any time.

I share your passion for surround music. I would love to see a steady stream of MC releases. I have tried for years to convince everyone I know that it's the best thing since sliced bread. I drove 6 hours to Rochester, NY this weekend to set-up a surround system for a friend. When I was finished he thanked me of course - even took me out to dinner. His biggest concern, signing up for the Pandora streaming service via his BD player. I made him 10 different BD Audio compilations with over 60 hours of uncompressed multichannel surround music. When I asked him how it sounded - oh it sounds great. How do I get Hulu Plus to work? He's the 99.5% of the public out there - we're the .5% So why is Jimby a pariah all of a sudden? Because he didn't answer the questions he was asked the way we wanted him to answer them? All of a sudden, he's not the guy he says he was? He didn't personally march into the office of Lucian Grainge at Universal and demand that they start making more MC titles - you know, the rest of those Elton Johns in the vault. He was providing some insight into the process and he was knocked around here pretty good for telling it like it was. I remember at the time Jon had to calm down the rank and file a bit because they didn't like hearing what he said - despite the fact that it was this forum that approached him for some information. Now because there are a few MC titles being offered as part of these ridiculous deluxe packages - he's an impostor for not having the foresight to see them coming? Come on. He left this forum for the simple fact that no good deed goes unpunished.

Seems that "Jimby" was on other message boards. He claims to have been Quote: "DVD-A disc producer on Diana Krall, Steely Dan, The Who, and about 40 more DVD-A titles."

http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/search.mpl?author=jimby&user_id=12997&forum=ALL&sortRank=None&sort=date&sortOrder=DESC

http://cgi.audioasylum.com/cgi/mail.mpl?user_ID=12997&f=dvda#email_form

http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.pl?forum=dvda&n=31161

RE: How many DVD-A have bad Mastering?

• Posted by on May 8, 2010 at 18:52:54In Reply to: RE: How many DVD-A have bad Mastering? posted by antoneb on March 25, 2010 at 22:48:54:

Jim Belcher ("Jimby") was the Production Director for DVD Audio at Universal Records and indeed was the DVD A producer for Steely Dan, Diana Krall, etc. - he is now the currently the VP of Advanced Technology at Universal primarily involved in BD technology.

I suppose we could go back and forth on this for some time as neither of us know Jimby personally. The questioning of one's true identity on the internet is rife with all possibilities good and bad - you can cast aspersions with impunity and/or be completely fooled by someone with equal access to information. My real name is not Elmer and I'll guess that yours is not Old Quad Guy (or is it? ). Perhaps I am too naive, but I think "Jimby" is Jim Belcher and he just got plain fed up with having to defend his comments - especially when they were solicited by this forum.

Ok, thanks we've figured out the who was "Jimby" mystery.

The problem many had with him was his "condescending" attitude to us. It matters not who you think you are whether you work for Universal Records or are a Janitor in your day job, be a real human being. He never seemed like one of us or a regular guy. He wasn't always correct with his facts and when one called him on that or tried to engage or question his assertions, he got all indignant just because folks wanted to know what he was actually talking about. His opinions were not always asked for and he would chime in out of the blue and could be all snarky at us instead of getting into the spirit of enjoying surround music like we all do here. In the 6 years he was here he didn't post anything about the music he liked, except maybe to promote a couple of BR discs. It's all there for everyone to read in all 83 of his posts here. Anyone can go to his user name to find them. I read them all last night. Lot's of arrogance, not much info, much of which we already knew or was out there on the net. We still of course open the invitation for him to post whatever here, but a conversation is a 2 way street.

Anyway time to move on. The music industry isn't the same as what it was 5 years ago or even 2, all water under the bridge. We'll all have to see what this new announcement is for 2012 we've been hearing about from the music industry, what's left of it.

EDIT: One more thing, we don't need the "music industry" anymore except for the vintage material they hold in their vaults and seem to not know how to market or know what to do with.

Based on the strong feedback from the Moving Pictures 5.1 remix, Universal Records had asked me.......

Click to expand...

well guys, this sentence from Richard Chycki says a lot to me. at the present circumstances the needs in changes
for music industry just inevitable. sure, they doing it as usual through a$$ hole, instead of rising profile for "new"
musical format in the eyes of consumer by letting it to be affordable and become just the normal ordinary format for
any listeners (thanks God today this is possible almost in every household), they trying again put it into exclusive category
of luxury goods for those chosen ones to make quick profit with minimum efforts.
but you cannot milk the cows forever without feeding them and eventually such marketing trick will fall. it just matter of time.

as for Jimby, i do remember his quite pessimistic view on the future of the music in MC format and you know,
it was his personal view to which he is entitled as any of us. and thanks to our forum's policies no one attempted
to censor him or direct his approach to be more optimistical and favorable to quad/surround agenda of this board,
which is great. at least i see it so

The thing is, I can understand an insider sharing information about the point of view from a company. The thing about Jimby was, we tried to engage in conversation with him, and he pretty much ridiculed us. He went beyond telling us about the low sells to stating the "facts" about why the sells were low. He insisted people don't want surround sound, don't care about surround sound, and aren't interested. We pointed out that there was lack of promotion, lack of available titles, and confusion with format wars. He refused to acknowledge that and continued to ridicule us insisting that people plain and simple didn't want it. After going around in circles, one would have to ask, why did he bother? I mean...what type of person gets their kicks coming to a surround sound forum to lecture everyone about how no one cares about surround sound? There was really no need for him to be here with the attitude he came here with.

I'm not a huge fan of Rush, but I enjoyed the DVD-A of Moving Pictures.

If anyone from Universal is infiltrating this forum, I'm not that interested in getting the 5 free CDs with my DVD-A. I might be interested in buying some of the DVD-As alone.