Gentle Giant - Freehand (DTS9624 & Dolby)

[Bob Romano]

Please post your comments on Gentle Giant - Freehand (DTS 9624 and Dolby)

[LizardKing]

Check out the comments here http://www.quadraphonicquad.com/foru...l=1#post142601 about this one.....

Not sure how I'll vote on this.....

[d0zer]

for me, there is absolutely no doubt. The music and musicianship are great and the surround mix is really good. I remember well searching record fairs for a vinyl copy of this, when it was out of print. I'd never dreamt of getting this record in excellent sound and to top it, in surround. 10 point from me.

[Ge Someone]

This quad mix is a lost gem brought back to life. Free Hand is one of my favorite Gentle Giant albums, so I'm very OK with the content. Somehow it was thought necessary to let Peter Mew add a sub channel, hence the 4.1. There's a slight chance that a few players mistakenly take this for a 5.0 layout (although they shouldn't).
I need to listen again before voting.

[MyCuff]

Well darn. For me the music just does not work. Either this one or Interview. I gave it a 7, as the quality of the mix in DTS is worth that. Seems like these will just be part of the "collection", and will not be played again.

[rusinurbe]

Wild Vintage quad mix, and sounds great for DTS shame its not a full strength DVDA and there is no extras but you do get a 96/24 stereo mix as well. Love it

[LizardKing]

I don't like the LF-RS lead vocal splits, any other combination would make more sense to me.... For me it ruins the mix...... Was it really intended to be this way???

[sukothai]

I don't like the LF-RS lead vocal splits, any other combination would make more sense to me.... For me it ruins the mix...... Was it really intended to be this way???

Must be your listening environment, because it sounds fine to me. Both in my office and in my car. The more I listen to it, the more I like it.

[LizardKing]

Must be your listening environment, because it sounds fine to me. Both in my office and in my car. The more I listen to it, the more I like it.

Its not my environment..... I can't think of any discs that have the lead vocals done this way.....

[sukothai]

Its not my environment..... I can't think of any discs that have the lead vocals done this way.....

I just thought maybe your listening area is arranged in such a way as to make the vocal positions more noticeable. I don't usually pay attention to the position of vocals, instruments, percussion or have any preconceptions about how things should be arranged. I like to think of the 4 or 5 channels as another canvas for art and I like the way this artist used the 4 channels. For this unconventional style of rock, perhaps an unconventional use of the 4 channels is appropriate.

I put both albums on a single DVD-Audio disk and listen to it at least once a day during my commute or in my office. I've become so accustomed to the way it sounds that it didn't sound right to me when I swapped the channels as you suggested. But since this is art, I think it's OK we don't agree on channel placement.

[Q-Eight]

I don't like the LF-RS lead vocal splits, any other combination would make more sense to me.... For me it ruins the mix...... Was it really intended to be this way???

Perhaps it's a channel location error either on the disc or the master tape itself? I find it kinda neat that this title was mentioned about 2 years ago by Bob Vosigen as a possibility for a future Quadio title from Rhino.

[oxenholme]

Sonics 10, mix 10, some of the music is fringe to my taste nevertheless extremely well constructed and performed and Talybont is a real favourite. So 10 overall.

The important point being that the sound samples on the internet plus the fact there was a 4.1 mix tempted me into buying something by a band that I'd never knowingly heard before. I've ordered Interview too. I've already got the Electric Light Orchestra set and am well pleased with it. Are there any others in the series or on the way?

[oxenholme]

I don't like the LF-RS lead vocal splits, any other combination would make more sense to me.... For me it ruins the mix...... Was it really intended to be this way???

Yes, I did notice the splits, but I rather like the effect. If it's a mistake then so be it, but for me it certainly doesn't cause any problems!

[rusinurbe]

Yes, I did notice the splits, but I rather like the effect. If it's a mistake then so be it, but for me it certainly doesn't cause any problems!

I agree I think its what was on the tape and its just an unusual mixing decision. No problems with it

[stereoptic]

I gave it a 10. I've been a fan ever since the release of the Three Friends LP on Columbia. I'd been listening to the album a lot before the announcement of the quad release and it slowly became my favorite Gentle Giant release, surpassing In A Glass House. The Quad release made it twice as good. I like the surround mix; odd choices but interesting. You have to expect the odd from Gentle Giant! The hi-res stereo is wonderful as well, even though the format makes some of the tape edits stand out.

If you are new to GG< I would suggest either Octopus or In A Glass House next, followed by The Power and the Glory or Three Friends.

[timbre4]

It is such a thrill to finally hear this album in surround! I was just finishing the junior year in high school when this came out and I played it constantly. The quirkiness of the band was very catchy on this release, with the songwriting and instrumental verve at high intensity. They would play much of this record live for several years. The recollections in the booklet were worth the price of admission.

Free Hand, On Reflection, the goods just keep coming from one of the most talented groups of all time. His Last Voyage is one of those unforgettable Kerry Minnear vocals that you just never forget. This song was also the theme to as bad a crush as a boy of 17 could have in my case. (I did dance with her in 2011, she's going to hear this one day)

I didn't buy Interview yet but I know I will. Have to wonder if there wasnt any thought to preparing the previous Capitol album The Power And The Glory which would be stronger material-wise. Just IMHO and yes very grateful (excited) that we can have such treasures after all this time.

[fredblue]

Perhaps it's a channel location error either on the disc or the master tape itself? I find it kinda neat that this title was mentioned about 2 years ago by Bob Vosigen as a possibility for a future Quadio title from Rhino.

Ah-ha! That is amazing!

So are there other potential Rhino quadio's that UK labels like EMI/Chrysalis have the rights to?

[timbre4]

Ah-ha! That is amazing!

So are there other potential Rhino quadio's that UK labels like EMI/Chrysalis have the rights to?

I think that's a backwards cul-de-sac; we got these releases independent of the Quadio demise.

[fredblue]

I think that's a backwards cul-de-sac; we got these releases independent of the Quadio demise.

Ah, ok. So if the UK GG quad dvds didn't come about because/in-spite of the Quadio connection and that series' premature end, or the potential Quadio release wasn't an alert to EMI that the quads existed, where did the inspiration (or from whom) do you think the latest "flurry" of quad releases came?

As a follow on, I'm curious as to which other titles were Rhino quad in the States that are on the currently "quad reissue friendly" labels in the UK, like EMI?

[fredblue]

On only one complete listen through since I got this the day it came out, I'll give it an "8", largely because of what it represents (a previously unreleased Quad mix!) rather than the music!

Shameful to a degree I know but if I judged it purely on the music, I'd only be able to give it a "5" or "6", this isn't one I'll be playing too often.

[kap'n krunch]

Another 9 from me...
same as Interview, one point is deducted for not being Lossless...
Great music and Mix (for the 70s)....

[Plan9]

For me the .1 channel is completely superfluous, plus I think it makes the bass sound too loud and boomy at times.
The mastering is also too compressed for my tastes, I like it more dynamic.
And I prefer the surround experience on In'terview.

So, I only give it a 6.

[Plan9]

I have followed LizardKing's advice and swapped the rears on this mix.

Well it sounds much better and discrete. No doubt in my mind that the rear channels are reversed.

Try it.

[ArmyOfQuad]

I have to agree that there's something wrong with the channel assignment on this, the vocals on a diagonal is a big hint, and upon further listening, the diagonals just pair up better. However, simply swapping the rights to bring the vocals to the front doesn't fix it, as the clicks at the beginning are now paired diagonally. This leads me to believe that either the front or backs then need to be swapped to get rid of that diagonal action that seems unlikely to be how it was mixed. Upon further analysis, it appears that yes, it's not just the clicks that are made diagonal, so that it does make sense to do that swap as well. To make the quad mix align with the stereo mix (based on the clicks), the following corrections should be made, in my opinion:

Move the front left to front right
Move the front right to rear right
Move the rear right to front left

These errors happened often in the quad days, and they will continue to happen time and time again as long as we continue to have a lack of standards in track assignment, and a lack of attention to detail in the process of manufacturing the product. What really gets me is that in theory, someone mastered this. Which means that someone listened to this, with a critical ear, whose job it is to pay attention to detail and fine tune the sound to get the best sound possible out of this. And despite this being his job function, despite him supposedly listening to this critically, he failed to notice the obvious error in channel assignment. I'd like to know who mastered this, because that is one person who should be unemployed.

[fredblue]

I have to agree that there's something wrong with the channel assignment on this, the vocals on a diagonal is a big hint, and upon further listening, the diagonals just pair up better. However, simply swapping the rights to bring the vocals to the front doesn't fix it, as the clicks at the beginning are now paired diagonally. This leads me to believe that either the front or backs then need to be swapped to get rid of that diagonal action that seems unlikely to be how it was mixed. Upon further analysis, it appears that yes, it's not just the clicks that are made diagonal, so that it does make sense to do that swap as well. To make the quad mix align with the stereo mix (based on the clicks), the following corrections should be made, in my opinion:

Move the front left to front right
Move the front right to rear right
Move the rear right to front left

These errors happened often in the quad days, and they will continue to happen time and time again as long as we continue to have a lack of standards in track assignment, and a lack of attention to detail in the process of manufacturing the product. What really gets me is that in theory, someone mastered this. Which means that someone listened to this, with a critical ear, whose job it is to pay attention to detail and fine tune the sound to get the best sound possible out of this. And despite this being his job function, despite him supposedly listening to this critically, he failed to notice the obvious error in channel assignment. I'd like to know who mastered this, because that is one person who should be unemployed.

wow.. I thought there was something up with this one but..

.. from what you've discovered ArmyOfQuad, that means practically every channel, except rear left, is totally screwed up on this one and needs repurposing..!?

No wonder this mix never got released back in the day..!!