INVOLVE SQ - IS HERE

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Thank you so much! :upthumb

If you have a minute, could I just ask what configuration of your Involve equipment you would advise in my situation?

I would be primarily playing back SQ LP's through the Surround Master with the occasional QS encoded CD and LP.

Would you suggest an "Involve + SQ Vinyl" setup in that instance rather than an 'Involve + SQ "by the book" unit?

Adam, mine is set up to reflect your needs, SM Vinyl Beta for SQ and then the Involve/QS/RM. Of course I could not compare the SM Vinyl Beta to the original SQ decoder in the SM but I could compare the SQ LPs I have that also appear on SACD and DVDA. I've been blown away by how good they sound and how closely they match their discrete counterparts. The sound is smooth, natural and without any artifacting. You will need to add a switch as well if you wish to move between sources. I bought this lovely U.S made box so I can switch between the Oppo BDP-83, the Media PC stereo analog out and the Rega RP1. The switch is passive and does not introduce any color to the sound and is silent in operation. The Involve/QS/RM decoder is often really wonderful at synthesizing quad too; examples would be the Hi-Res FLAC of Nick Drake's Bryter Later which effortlessly and musically surrounds you, Nick's voice in the phantom center, female backing vocals and strings behind with guitars and percussion up front. I have the half-speed cut LP version of Heart's 'Steamboat Annie' which is another great example of what this box can do, enveloping the music around the listening space and creating subtly discrete effects throughout.

I leave the SM on Involve/QS for anything stereo or QS and reboot for SQ. What is interesting is how cohesive the sound field is; I made minor tweaks to the speaker angles, currently around 35 degrees for the fronts and 30 degrees for the rears. No Audyssey or speaker calibration applied and I utilize the SM in 4.0 mode only, leaving my center for 5.1 specific material. I used the track 'Money' from the SQ encoded DSOTM LP as my baseline and A/B between it and the 4.0 DVDA version. They sound almost exactly the same, the discrete version edging slightly ahead in terms of positioning but both sounding as smooth as each other and the direction of the sound is pretty much identical.

IMG_3454.jpgIMG_3450.jpgIMG_3457.jpgIMG_3469.jpgIMG_3477.jpg
 
Adam, mine is set up to reflect your needs, SM Vinyl Beta for SQ and then the Involve/QS/RM. Of course I could not compare the SM Vinyl Beta to the original SQ decoder in the SM but I could compare the SQ LPs I have that also appear on SACD and DVDA. I've been blown away by how good they sound and how closely they match their discrete counterparts. The sound is smooth, natural and without any artifacting. You will need to add a switch as well if you wish to move between sources. I bought this lovely U.S made box so I can switch between the Oppo BDP-83, the Media PC stereo analog out and the Rega RP1. The switch is passive and does not introduce any color to the sound and is silent in operation. The Involve/QS/RM decoder is often really wonderful at synthesizing quad too; examples would be the Hi-Res FLAC of Nick Drake's Bryter Later which effortlessly and musically surrounds you, Nick's voice in the phantom center, female backing vocals and strings behind with guitars and percussion up front. I have the half-speed cut LP version of Heart's 'Steamboat Annie' which is another great example of what this box can do, enveloping the music around the listening space and creating subtly discrete effects throughout.

I leave the SM on Involve/QS for anything stereo or QS and reboot for SQ. What is interesting is how cohesive the sound field is; I made minor tweaks to the speaker angles, currently around 35 degrees for the fronts and 30 degrees for the rears. No Audyssey or speaker calibration applied and I utilize the SM in 4.0 mode only, leaving my center for 5.1 specific material. I used the track 'Money' from the SQ encoded DSOTM LP as my baseline and A/B between it and the 4.0 DVDA version. They sound almost exactly the same, the discrete version edging slightly ahead in terms of positioning but both sounding as smooth as each other and the direction of the sound is pretty much identical.

View attachment 20412View attachment 20413View attachment 20414View attachment 20415View attachment 20416

Thank you SOOOOOOOO much, you're a marvel..! (y) (y)

1 x SQ Vinyl Beta and Involve/QS/RM model Surround Master it is..! :D

Oh.. I can only see one out of your 5 attachments..! Wot appened..!? :yikes
 
OK!!! So I just listened to the CD of BUDDY RICH LIVE AT KING STREET! It is, I believe, and I know someone will correct me if I’m wrong, the only recording encoded using the Tate SQ system. It was produced by Gary Rebar. When the SURROUND MASTER SQ was originally released, this recording was the only recording, that I listened too, that was clearly better defined through the TATE ll than through the SURROUND MASTER SQ; however there is no doubt about it now , after listening to it through the new SM SQ, that it equals the TATE ll decoding! …..This was a live recording and the surround mix was derived from the special mixer created for the recording……………….It is a wonderful recording, but not an especially great surround recording….but the TATE ll brought out the mix in a clearly more defined way than the old SM SQ….not now! Whatever the resident gurus did, they did it brilliantly……and this isn’t even vinyl…it’s CD! Who’d a thunk!?
Dwight
 
SQ TATE Encodes:

DOLLY PARTON-IN LONDON

DAVID BOWIE-SERIOUS MOONLIGHT

BILL WATROUS-LIVE (SONY DIGIT LABEL)

LIONEL HAMPTON-LIVE (SONY DIGIT LABEL)........ plus one other jazz artist on (SONY DIGIT LABEL)

and KENNY LOGGINS-ALIVE



All live performances.I wonder if I missed any others?
 
OK!!! So I just listened to the CD of BUDDY RICH LIVE AT KING STREET! It is, I believe, and I know someone will correct me if I’m wrong, the only recording encoded using the Tate SQ system. It was produced by Gary Rebar. When the SURROUND MASTER SQ was originally released, this recording was the only recording, that I listened too, that was clearly better defined through the TATE ll than through the SURROUND MASTER SQ; however there is no doubt about it now , after listening to it through the new SM SQ, that it equals the TATE ll decoding! …..This was a live recording and the surround mix was derived from the special mixer created for the recording……………….It is a wonderful recording, but not an especially great surround recording….but the TATE ll brought out the mix in a clearly more defined way than the old SM SQ….not now! Whatever the resident gurus did, they did it brilliantly……and this isn’t even vinyl…it’s CD! Who’d a thunk!?
Dwight

I just posted about the Laserdisc version of this, the post has the expansive liner notes about the recording itself and the mastering of it. My findings match yours in terms of the decode on the new SQ SM :smokin

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...oded-LaserDisc&p=256359&highlight=#post256359
 
To anyone in the group:

Is there any cheap way (or what is the least expensive way) to convert multi-channel analog to HDMI? I would LOVE to snag the surround master but my latest HDMI/3D/7.1 receiver lacks analog multi-channel inputs. Tab's glowing review of the SM makes my HDMI bottleneck even more frustrating..
 
Tad
How about you put the test up on your
Site showing the QS Decoding and the SQ Decoding on the scopes
For any new members that have not heard of the unit
And any one who may get into Quad
 
Hi Wunlow

This is a really hard question, I have searched high and low for such a gizmo and so far no success. We have thought about designing such a device ourselves but so far time does not permit. Did I tell you guys of all the ways I do not like HDMI?

Can any body offer better advice? If I was cheeky I would say sell the receiver and buy a Y4 system but that would be just opportunistic self promotion!

Did I tell you guys of all the ways I hate "modern" receivers?

Good luck

Chucky


To anyone in the group:

Is there any cheap way (or what is the least expensive way) to convert multi-channel analog to HDMI? I would LOVE to snag the surround master but my latest HDMI/3D/7.1 receiver lacks analog multi-channel inputs. Tab's glowing review of the SM makes my HDMI bottleneck even more frustrating..
 
Hi Wunlow

This is a really hard question, I have searched high and low for such a gizmo and so far no success. We have thought about designing such a device ourselves but so far time does not permit. Did I tell you guys of all the ways I do not like HDMI?

Can any body offer better advice? If I was cheeky I would say sell the receiver and buy a Y4 system but that would be just opportunistic self promotion!

Did I tell you guys of all the ways I hate "modern" receivers?

Good luck

Chucky


To anyone in the group:

Is there any cheap way (or what is the least expensive way) to convert multi-channel analog to HDMI? I would LOVE to snag the surround master but my latest HDMI/3D/7.1 receiver lacks analog multi-channel inputs. Tab's glowing review of the SM makes my HDMI bottleneck even more frustrating..
 
Well...I will try. Here's the thing - someone gave me a Marantz 4240 that was a bottomless pit of repairs. After my tech had it for 6 months, he finally got it working properly and I bought a nice case for it on eBay. My job duties keep multiplying, so I set that one up in my office and I've been testing the Involve there. I don't have the SQD-2010 hooked up to it. In fact, I had to pull it out of my main system to recap the power supply. I'll have to get busy and do a proper setup at home. I can promise you, though... the new version sounds remarkably better to my ears. It's the best all-around quad decoder ever made. I never thought I'd type something like that in the year 2015.
 
I don't really have better advice on this specific type of gizmo, but I can talk about my solution to the issue of mixing vintage quad with modern equipment.

The long story short version is, I've found it's best to go all vintage for quad, and all modern for modern. Add to this a pair of niles spk-1 switches, and you can hook up a vintage quad amp and modern receiver to the same set of speakers, and easily go between vintage and modern.

I know that doesn't answer the actual question of finding a device to make your hdmi input an analog multichannel input, I've been curious about that myself, but after going through many different setups of mixing equipment, I've been much happier now that I have both a vintage and modern amp hooked up to my speakers. If you keep your eyes open, you can usually find some niles spk-1 switches for a reasonable amount on ebay.

I'm planning on discussing in more detail quad equipment and setups and how to get into quad on my quadcast youtube channel, I'm still sorting out how to approach that and what I really want to do with that channel, but I've got lots of ideas going around in my head and expect things to be happening there soon.

Hi Wunlow

This is a really hard question, I have searched high and low for such a gizmo and so far no success. We have thought about designing such a device ourselves but so far time does not permit. Did I tell you guys of all the ways I do not like HDMI?

Can any body offer better advice? If I was cheeky I would say sell the receiver and buy a Y4 system but that would be just opportunistic self promotion!

Did I tell you guys of all the ways I hate "modern" receivers?

Good luck

Chucky
 
Hi Chucky --
So what's the protocol for getting our "original" Involve SQ unit updated to the new and improved? Ship it to you guys for the chip swap? I can solder, but I'd rather not take the chance with surface mount contacts as I just don't have the experience with it.
 
Hi Bangsezmax

You have already started the process! I have forwarded your request and we will be contacting you shortly with the details.

Regards

Chucky

Hi Chucky --
So what's the protocol for getting our "original" Involve SQ unit updated to the new and improved? Ship it to you guys for the chip swap? I can solder, but I'd rather not take the chance with surface mount contacts as I just don't have the experience with it.
 
Hi Chucky,

Any update on the time-line for the new Surround Master with HDMI etc.?

Cheers

Duncan
 
Hi DuncanS

Nup, the problem is extreme workload and getting sidetracked on all sorts of stuff. It will happen (remember how long it too us to do the vinyl SQ update!), hopefully within 6 months......I blame "Overture" and society in general.

Regards

Chucky

Hi Chucky,

Any update on the time-line for the new Surround Master with HDMI etc.?

Cheers

Duncan
 
Hi Wunlow

This is a really hard question, I have searched high and low for such a gizmo and so far no success. We have thought about designing such a device ourselves but so far time does not permit. Did I tell you guys of all the ways I do not like HDMI?

Can any body offer better advice? If I was cheeky I would say sell the receiver and buy a Y4 system but that would be just opportunistic self promotion!

Did I tell you guys of all the ways I hate "modern" receivers?

Good luck

Chucky

Thanks! I need it. :)

Yeah.. I really needed 3D passthrough for my work and was already set up for 7.1. Saw a receiver on sale and it was after the purchase that I shockingly discovered the new trend of so many receivers that are dropping multi-channel analog discrete inputs .. Many of the higher end $$ receivers still have them, but the mid-priced recievers have taken a serious step backwards by losing this feature. Not just for a great item like the Surround Master, but other formats like DVD-Audio and older retro multi-channel sources.

I had considered using my computer to get by this bottleneck, as I can feed multichannel audio sources from my computer to my receiver via HDMI. The catch there is getting four (or more) analog channels into the computer. Did a cursory search and that doesn't appear to be cheap either.. Can someone use multiple external USB stereo capture cards to do multi-channel capture or pass-through? Stereo inputs are dirt dirt cheap .. but anything past that is just insanely priced, and it shouldn't be.


If anyone comes up with a work-around let us know!

- Wunlow
 
Wunlow,

One option that has been discussed before on the forum, is to use a Creative Labs DTS-610. That will take 6-channel analog RCA input and return DTS-encoded S/PDIF and fiber optic output.
That doesn't get you to HDMI, but if your new receiver is the end of the line for the signal, you should be good to go. Downside: Creative doesn't make them any longer, so you're left to scouring
internet auction sites for them.
 
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