Rick Wakeman - Six Wives and Arthur

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feels like we've gone over all this before on QQ ad nauseam!?

it was a while ago now but iirc when I was testing Six Wives DVD-A I was kinda dubious about what I was hearing so asked what source was used and was told it was from the master. I took it at face value & in good faith, carried on with testing and thought no more about it.

The King Arthur is completely different kettle of fish altogether and absolutely not from the master. I don't want to go into details on the open forum kap but you can PM me if you want as I was right there in the studio when the source was being... erm, sourced so to me its origins are not up for grabs :D
 
it could very well be a reissue cause the sticker had a date of MAY 2017 and the shrink was like new, so it probably didn't come from ANOTHER store...curiouser and curiouser..
 
Having done QC for this release, and for some insane reason, not stating ANYWHERE that it's a DVD-A, I can attest to the fact that it was NOT an SQ decode.

First of all, you can not get that kind of separation even with the best of scripts (just listen to the perfect separation of the drums on the left rear, no way josé that it's a decode.)

Second, I saw a note written by an engineer who did a transfer from the MASTER of one of Yes' LANDMARK albums a YEAR after it was recorded and he found all kinds of imperfections; "surface noise", clicks, etc.
Guys, remember , analog tape is great but it's not perfect!
And this was a 40 year old tape!!! (and not even the 1st gen master!)

I was quite amused to listen to it and having it sound better than what I remember listening before it was released.

Yes, the cover is VERY sloppy; no info on who did what and the typos that remind me of the ELP BSS SACD (STS anyone??)... LPCDM??? DTX???? oh well..we got it and, as opposed to the "King Arthur" one which is a DISASTER, this one is quite enjoyable...I'll give it a healthy 8.


I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to assert in all this, but: AoQ's comparison makes it virtually certain that this DVDA , at least as originally released , was not sourced from a quad master tape. The Q8 and CD4 versions are *clearly* and *demonstrably* more discrete (and very similar to each other). Did you watch his comparison video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1OA81R41_0

Make sure to read the comments too, particularly the comment from Oxford Dickie.
 
I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to assert in all this, but: AoQ's comparison makes it virtually certain that this DVDA , at least as originally released , was not sourced from a quad master tape. The Q8 and CD4 versions are *clearly* and *demonstrably* more discrete (and very similar to each other). Did you watch his comparison video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1OA81R41_0

Make sure to read the comments too, particularly the comment from Oxford Dickie.

SIX WIVES is mastered from an SQ Vinyl disc.......with ticks/pops etc indigenous to vinyl. OTOH, the Stereo DVD~A appears to be from the original analogue tapes as it sounds superior to the QUAD transfer....at least on my system.
 
it's a pity that some members get so visceral and nasty when something is posted that , be it true or not, does not correspond to reality or to THEIR reality...
It's the difference between an abusive parent who smacks a child when they have done something wrong and a loving parent who will tell their kid that they are wrong and tell them , in a nice way, that it's wrong...

That is exactly what separates the pros from the non-pros.

A PRO musician , even if they are not the BEST technically, but has a positive and friendly attitude will get MANY a call to play, as opposed to a "pro" musician who, may be great but is an a**hole- they will get called ONCE and that would be it, cause word will spread that they are not nice to work with...

Hey, I may be wrong, but my post brought out who is what...

No wonder a lot of great people don't even bother posting here anymore...
 
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Well, on the bright side, we now know that OD still follows what goes on here. Funny that he'd care what goes on on this "dreadful" forum, filled with nothing but misinformation </sarcasm> Although I did get this bit of interesting information from him

"Yes, i had QC versions sent, and no, i have it on good authority (the person behind the whole Wakeman reissue series) that only one quad master was found, and it wasn’t any of the released albums (yes folks, there’s a quad version of one of his albums that was never released).

The last i heard, some months ago now, is that Universal do not have the rights to it, it’s in the hands of someone else who is “possibly” doing something. And that’s it."
 
SIX WIVES is mastered from an SQ Vinyl disc.......with ticks/pops etc indigenous to vinyl. OTOH, the Stereo DVD~A appears to be from the original analogue tapes as it sounds superior to the QUAD transfer....at least on my system.

The stereo version could be from a LP production tape, or nth generation copy, for all we know. Comparing stereo to mch is no way to tell whether an original master was used for either.
 
What an absolute scumbag OD is. I'd rather be a decent person who hasn't learned everything, than a sociopath with a knack for mathematical equations - someone with a conscience can read a book and learn something, whereas someone without a soul can live their whole life and never get a grasp on basic humanity.

In more quad related matters, any guesses as to what the the supposed unreleased Wakeman quad master might be? AFAIK all his early/mid 70's albums were on A&M (now belonging to UMG) but perhaps the rights have reverted after a period of time? I remember reading somewhere else that in some cases post 1972 albums revert to the original recording artist after 40 years.
 
I'm guessing a post or two have been and gone since I last visited? I know OD has apparently seen this thread and posted about it in his realm. Anyway....


it's a pity that some members get so visceral and nasty when something is posted that , be it true or not, does not correspond to reality or to THEIR reality...

I kinda think it's worse when it not only 'does not correspond to their reality', but is also *actually wrong*.

It's the difference between an abusive parent who smacks a child when they have done something wrong and a loving parent who will tell their kid that they are wrong and tell them , in a nice way, that it's wrong...

That is exactly what separates the pros from the non-pros.

A PRO musician , even if they are not the BEST technically, but has a positive and friendly attitude will get MANY a call to play, as opposed to a "pro" musician who, may be great but is an a**hole- they will get called ONCE and that would be it, cause word will spread that they are not nice to work with...

I guess that why no one ever worked with Buddy Rich...or Phil Spector...or Lou Reed...or....oh, wait....
 
What an absolute scumbag OD is. I'd rather be a decent person who hasn't learned everything, than a sociopath with a knack for mathematical equations - someone with a conscience can read a book and learn something, whereas someone without a soul can live their whole life and never get a grasp on basic humanity.

In more quad related matters, any guesses as to what the the supposed unreleased Wakeman quad master might be? AFAIK all his early/mid 70's albums were on A&M (now belonging to UMG) but perhaps the rights have reverted after a period of time? I remember reading somewhere else that in some cases post 1972 albums revert to the original recording artist after 40 years.

interesting... what's the most likely of his other albums to be in Quad, Dave?
as in, which lends itself more to surround sound do you think?
 
....any guesses as to what the the supposed unreleased Wakeman quad master might be? AFAIK all his early/mid 70's albums were on A&M (now belonging to UMG) but perhaps the rights have reverted after a period of time? I remember reading somewhere else that in some cases post 1972 albums revert to the original recording artist after 40 years.

Well the remainder of Wakeman's 70's discography is as follows:

1975: Lisztomania
1976: No Earthly Connection
1977: White Rock
1977: Criminal Record
1979: Rhapsodies

Rhapsodies is likely too late to have had a quad mix done. (Which is fine with me, I'd rather forget about Rick's disco interpretation of "Rhapsody in Blue.") Universal did a reissue of No Earthly Connection last year (with no surround content) so probably not that one either. I'd love for it to be Criminal Record, that's probably my favorite Wakeman album. But that's a very late 1977 release, so again, not likely.

Lisztomania and White Rock were both soundtracks so maybe a quad mix was done for one of them for movie theaters? That could be a likely scenario for Lisztomania since it was directed by the same person (Ken Russell) who directed the Tommy movie which had a quad soundtrack. The Lisztomania movie was released just seven months after the Tommy movie.
 
but perhaps the rights have reverted after a period of time? I remember reading somewhere else that in some cases post 1972 albums revert to the original recording artist after 40 years.

In Wakeman's biography he details his repeated financial misadventures which he seems to have encountered all his life. Rick has sold off all his rights to his music and YES music many times over to pay off liabilities due to overly casual fiduciary involvement. If any original rights were granted back to the artist, rest assured Rick has sold them away already. So no, he wouldn't own them.

Thanks for the tidbit about an unreleased quad. For me I kinda worship, 6 Wives, Arthur & Journey... so "any" quad version is better than nothing. Although nowhere near the quality of a Steven Wilson or GP remix, I still treasure the Wakeman 4.0 releases. I spent years listening to them on a cheesy 8-track tape on 4" paper uni-dome speakers, so the difference to me with the 4.0 releases is pretty amazing. Actually, I'm going to listen to Arthur in 4.0 right now. Excuse me... :smokin
 
Who is OD? Banned forum member?

He is a very talented person who is very passionate about quad and preserving old quad recordings. He sometimes gets very defensive when he probably should not and that actually makes me sad. I happened to like the guy and appreciated his accomplishments, but he tends to get too passionate, to put it mildly, and after a very long time I finally did in fact have to ban him as he left me no choice. He is missed by some, including me, but for the sake of the membership here he had to go.

One of the things I really hate about running this forum is the tension and bitterness that sometimes develops around here. Many of us are old and getting older. Getting into arguments and tirades on the internet is just so not worth it. I have on a number of times decided to tank this place only to be turned around by something good that happens, or encouragement from the membership.

The quad/surround community is small and there is no reason for everyone not to get along. That would make me happy. Really. But alas, there have been a handful of times here when that was not possible.

None of us know how long we'll all be around, and that goes for this place as well.
 
Thanks for the reply, Jon.
Totally understand.
I appreciate QQ for the exact reasons you stated.
You do a fine job.
 
My recollection - which is not always reliable these days - is that the quad master that was located was a previously unreleased quad mix of White Rock.

It would be quite ironic if they can't find the quad masters that were released but found one that wasn't.
 
i've recently revisited this one, mostly to compare to the CD-4 LP I picked up.

unless I was v.unlucky or something and bought a total dud LP that was duff when it left the factory in 1975 (or whenever the CD-4 was released!) it so happens, despite being in pretty much unplayed condition, it runs the gamut of problems vinyl can suffer from!

for one its pressed wildly off-centre, on practically wafer thin vinyl, that has warped to such an extent the 30kHz carrier constantly drops in and out.. and even after a couple of thorough cleans in the cleaning machine and a good few plays there is still some noise throughout that is more noticeable during the quieter passages.

why am I mentioning all this in a Poll for the DVD-Audio disc in the more recent Deluxe Edition?

well given how lousy my CD-4 LP is, I have to say I will now be more lenient on the quality of the CD-4 transfer used on the DVD-A in this set.. either UnderMyWheels had a CD-4 pressing that didn't suffer all the flaws mine does or they are a dab hand at overcoming such issues somehow. either way I salute them and thank them for their efforts!

musically I rather enjoy this album, its quite different to Six Wives but it is kinda fun and campy and despite being somewhat self-indulgent it doesn't drag much.. the surround mix has its moments and as others here have said there is some extreme panning (which people either like or loathe, I love it but accept its not everyone's cuppa tea).. so anyway, to wrap up here, I gave it a "7" in this Poll back when the Deluxe Edition first came out.. I think knowing now what a pigs' ear the CD-4 of this can be (as my seemingly unplayed or hardly ever played copy is!) I'd probably bump that upto an "8" if I were voting now.
 
Aaaaand, ignoring the few mean spirits, I have to confess that NO, it's not the Master, and it's an SQ decode...

Somehow somebody"tweaked" it cause it sounds brighter than what I remember (hey, it was 2014!!!), and maybe that's why I thought it was the Master...

Anyway, nowadays, since labels do whatever they want and without crediting anyone, I wouldn't have been surprised if they futzed with this one.....
 
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