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View Poll Results: Rate the DVD-A/BDA of YES - FRAGILE (2015 Mix)

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  • 10 - Great Surround, Great Fidelity, Great Content

    59 67.82%
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    24 27.59%
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    3 3.45%
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  • 1: Poor Surround, Poor Fidelity, Poor Content

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Thread: Yes - FRAGILE (2015 Mix) [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

  1. #1
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    5.1 icon Yes - FRAGILE (2015 Mix) [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Please post your thoughts and comments on the 2015 Steven Wilson remix of the YES album FRAGILE.

    If you want to comment solely on the earlier 2003 release from WB/Rhino on DVD-A and Japanese SACD, please visit the thread designated for that release HERE.

    Comparisons between the two versions are always welcome and can be noted in either poll thread.

    PRE-RELEASE DISCUSSION THREAD FOR THE 2015 REMIX HERE


    Yes Fragile.jpg
    :-jon

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    There's a lot to take in on this release. I played it through once and felt slightly lost. Is it the same Fragile that I've been enjoying for more than 30 years? The first stand-out feature is the tunefulness of the bass. It's going to take several more listens before I can decide on a score, but I feel it's going to be quite high...

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    The very beginning of "Roundabout" leaves something to be desired, but then, once the full band kicks in, we're off! And it just sounds glorious!
    This is the very first time I have ever heard this song presented in surround in a way that is not only discrete but one that also honors the spirit and sound of the original stereo mix.
    If there is one critique I have concerning the new stereo and surround mixes of "Roundabout", it's that Steven still doesn't quite nail the mixing of the backing vocals. They are too clean, too separated, and not properly balanced. This is clear when the vocals come back in after the keyboard and guitar solos. It's more apparent to me when listening to the new stereo mix and less so on the surround. I do like the backing vocal mixing on the very end section before the solo guitar outro. So one little minor squabble, and the rest is perfect.
    "Cans and Brahms" no longer has the overbearing bass, which is good, but I keep wanting more from this particular surround mix, and I don't get it. Ah well, not really that significant of a track for me, so onto "We Have Heaven"!
    Like "Roundabout", SW nails the discrete aspect of great surround mixing on this song while also honoring the original sound well-known in the stereo mix. Gone are the overdrenched reverbs from the 2002 surround mix, which makes me very happy! (Naturally the footsteps at the end are just perfect for surround, but then, we already knew that)
    The next big song is "South Side of the Sky", and I'm happy to say the trend continues, which is to provide discrete surround mixes that honor the original sound and spirit of the album. Loving it! Listening to the middle section of "South Side of the Sky" almost makes me want to take back what I said earlier about the way SW mixes backing vocals as he completely gets the balance and blend of the vocals in this section. Good for him!
    The original surround mix of "Five Per Cent For Nothing" annoyed me with its constant motion about as much as certain moments of those Flaming Lips mixes do, but Steven Wilson's mix is like a fun Quad mix with one instrument in each corner of the room. It's incredibly effective without being annoying, so if you like really discrete mixes, that one's for you!
    When it comes to this new surround mix of "Long Distance Runaround", it's missing a little bolshoi (apologies if my Russian isn't right for his instance…) This mix is a little tamer than I remember, whereas the old Eddie Offord mix seemed to drive a little more. Regardless, this mix is still miles better than the older surround mix from 2002. The ending guitar bit is also a fun surround moment before "The Fish" kicks in.
    I always found the 2002 surround mix of "The Fish" to be too overblown, whereas this one from Steven Wilson is still very discrete but not overbearing. A wonderful and fitting tribute to this fun piece of music that the late Chris Squire presided over. Many of his over-layered bass moments are more intelligible than ever before, and the backing vocals at the end are a wonderful blend, so maybe Steven Wilson's better at that than I thought…
    Nothing to really see or hear when it comes to "Mood for a Day". A stereo presentation with hall-like ambience in the surrounds would actually be fitting for a composition and recording like this one.
    Now finally, it's time for my favorite song on the album, "Heart of the Sunrise"! Once Jon Anderson's voice enters, it seems to be closer to you in the room than it was for many of the other songs on the album. Like all of the other songs on this album, Steven offers us a wonderfully discrete presentation that fits well with the original sound and feel of the classic stereo mix.
    To top it all off, the reentrance of "We Have Heaven" at the end is like that wonderful cup of coffee after a delicious full course meal.

    Everything we have known or heard about this album in surround before now was wrong, and all has now been set right, so what else can I say except I'm gladly giving this release a vote of '10', and I recommend that everyone go out and pick this one up for your collection, especially on Blu-Ray!

    Surround yourself with the best.

    Coming soon in 2017: "Eye in the Sky" (The Alan Parsons Project); "Black Sea" (XTC) and more from Gentle Giant!
    Already released: "Songs from the Wood" (Jethro Tull); "Misplaced Childhood" (Marillion); and "Sgt Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band"

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    First off thanks again Mr. Wilson ! off the top i have to say that as with many of the releases on Blu Ray you have to crank it up a bit . I gave this a good run through at a good volume ! I've had the 2002 release for a while and this release is much smoother , the vocals are clear the drums have punch and what i like the best is that you hear both the High and low end of Chris's Rick ! I feel that most of the low end was rolled off in the past during mastering for vinyl and early CD . i'ts nice to hear the full spectrum of a Rickenbacker with the low end there it complements the famous crunch of the Rick ! The drums are a bit more punchy and up front.
    I think the thing that takes getting used to is the separation and the space that the surround mix offers. you kind of get it in your head one way after listening to it for 30 years . glad to have this in my collection! anyone looking for a DvD a 2002 copy?
    P.S i gave it a solid 9 !
    Nova

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    I have the DVD-Audio that I purchased many years ago I always felt the recording of it was uneven and not balanced. Listening to the BluRay was like listening to a totally different CD I was blown away. I am giving this a 10 because this to me is an outstanding recorded surround and as much as I did not want to purchase another Fragile would of preferred Tales, but after listening to it I am glad I did take the plunge Thank you Steve Wilson for another great Surround Bluray!!
    Elad

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    I read here that this "Fragile" will be the last from Mr. Wilson
    Nova

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Fantastic music, mix and fidelity on this one. Unlike the earlier DVD-A it’s faithful to the feel and balance of the original but with greater clarity (no more distortion on the piano!). We also get some terrific extras (instrumental mixes ), good liner notes and an adorable little insert replica. An easy ’10’.

    Addendum: Hearing Chris’s voice so warmly and clearly in the rears during the middle of “South Side” made me quite sad the first time through.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Quote Originally Posted by blue.monk View Post
    ...(no more distortion on the piano!).
    Precisely! This has always been one of those records where I felt I had to listen "through" the distortion in order to enjoy all the great music underneath. No longer necessary!

    -- Jim

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    I was waiting for this release - disappointed with the Surround mix on Roundabout - some parts sound very jumbled up to me on first listen last night (as opposed to rtbluray's comments on this track I found parts to be sonically mishmashed together rather than too separated).

    The rest of the album has been done superbly, especially the vocals. I would have given this a 9 but Roundabout dropped it to an 8 for me..... FWIW the 2003 DVD-A runs regular rotation on my system.

    For some reason the additional tracks on the DVD-A won't play on my player (Pioneer Elite 59AVi). Once any of the songs are selected nothing happens.
    edit - they play on my Oppo FWIW.
    Last edited by PaulT; 11-11-2015 at 12:41 AM.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    After listening to the 5.1 mix earlier today I also gave it a "10".......it'll never get any better than it is right now.[unless somebody comes up with a way to have a hologram of the band performing the songs live as you're listening to them]
    Last edited by hwkn; 11-12-2015 at 03:11 AM.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Another excellent release in this series of Steven Wilson Yes remixes. A series that MUST be continued !

    Perfect in every respect. Superb clarity and surround mix as everyone is saying. I know this album inside out, and its never sounded better, Yes music is just made for surround. Great use of the rears with the backing vocals, and I'm amazed by how good the drums and bass sound on this. As others have said this, like the other Yes albums in this series, sounds better louder.

    The packaging is really nice, and I love that they've included, in mini form, the booklet from the original LP release.

    Some nice extra songs too, and alternative and instrumental mixes.

    A definite 10

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    yeah. the mini version of the booklet was a LOVELY detail!
    Avatar: a Goddess...Capucine -...The Ice Queen
    -------------------------------------
    "LIFE is NOT in Stereo , it's in SURROUND, so why limit your music to stereo...? By that same train of thought we should've stayed in MONO..." -Me

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Another 10.
    Love the extras. The instrumental tracks are beautiful.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Like some others here, I want to give this a few more listens before I give a score. But, good grief, a first listen to the new 5.1 mix on the DVD-A has left my jaw on the floor. The fidelity is amazing. I've found prior CDs to often be bright. This is balanced and wonderful, with some of the most beautiful bass tones I've heard. And the mix..just wow. Completely immersive in the best possible way. I'm loving this new release.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    clg, totally agree with you on this. The BD really reveals the wonderful texture of the music. As I posted above, the instrumental tracks are stunning.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    This is a review of the (core DTS) from the DVD-A from my car (my car Kenwood plays core DTS of DVD-A's but not mlp's) and a review of the DTS-MA from the BD from my home reference system. I also played the DVD-A MLP from my OPPO bitstreamed thru my home Pioneer VSX-53 5.1 reference system. I also played the DVD-A MLP thru my FooBar PC system bitstreamed to my Pioneer home reference system.

    I bought both versions (DVD-A, BD) to compare/contrast as this album is like my baby (own every iteration).

    This one is Close to the Edge of a 10. My FooBar 5.1 channel bar graph is a bit more epileptic then most every other surround disc I own, actually suprised me at first.

    This is a positive (although it may sound like a negative) as I appreciate separation and dynamics but it's almost (but not 100%) like SW is trying a little too hard, BUT, I truly hear discreetness in this mix like I have never heard before.

    That being said, a wonderful recording, a wonderful demonstration of what real music/musicianship is, a wonderful surround mix, and truly one of the better if not the best releases of recent time for me as this album is the pinnacle of Yes's musical prowess.

    A must own, of course, it doesn't get much better than this.

    I put this right up there with the "mystery engineer" 4.1 DVD-A bootleg of DSOTM and Bob Marley's Legend.

    Keep 'em coming SW, hopefully 90215 next, <-- yup I'm a fan of.
    Last edited by salsdali; 11-15-2015 at 06:41 AM.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Quote Originally Posted by salsdali View Post
    Keep 'em coming SW, 90215 next, <-- yup I'm a fan.
    I'd love to hear 90125! If SW doesn't want to do it, maybe Yes will give other engineers a chance!

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Quote Originally Posted by edisonbaggins View Post
    I'd love to hear 90125! If SW doesn't want to do it, maybe Yes will give other engineers a chance!
    pick+me.jpg


    Surround yourself with the best.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Quote Originally Posted by rtbluray View Post
    Have you done any mixing?!

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Quote Originally Posted by edisonbaggins View Post
    Have you done any mixing?!
    "Have I Done Any Mixing?", he asks…

    Here are some surround mixes I have done: http://www.quadraphonicquad.com/foru...on!&highlight=

    There's also a lot more stereo mixes I have completed (for commission, for practice, and for competition), but since this is a surround forum (and we're getting pretty OT here) PM me if anyone wants links to check out some of those.

    Surround yourself with the best.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    I was anticipating this one, given that I consider this album, Rumors, and Three Friends to be my musical "coming of age" albums. One could have reasonably anticipated, in advance of the release, that I would give a 10/10 for content.

    That said, there was always a harshness to the sound of the album. Whether on vinyl or CD, it just had an edge. I could get through it, but I was tired of listening in the end. I attributed that to the complexity of the music and left it at that. Not so.

    With this mix, I hear everything I heard in prior releases, and then some. I think the instrument placement in the surround field is outstanding, and the balance is excellent. But there is one thing that got left out - the harshness and consequential listening fatigue. I can't speak to where that comes from - but the stereo and surround mixes are great improvements over past releases (yes, even my beloved original) for this reason alone. They retain all of the complexity and go down buttery-smooth. 10/10 for mix too. Would give it an 11 if I could.

    As a side note: my son and I had a fun debate while cooking dinner last night over whether it is Jackson Pollock's or Pablo Picasso's paintings that are the best analogy for the lyrics on this album. Really - WTH is that man singing about on some of these songs anyway?

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    5.1 icon Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Here is a look at the 6 CH Wav files from the original DVD-A of Track 1, "Roundabout", and from the new Steven Wilson mix on the BluRay. Channel order from top to bottom in FL, FR, C, Sub, RL, RR.

    The top wav file is the DVD-A, the lower the BluRay. You can see without hearing that different choices were made, especially with the center channel. You can also see why you have to play the BluRay louder than the DVD-A. You can also see what appears to be more definition in the wav files in the SW mix than the Rhino mix.

    For tech heads like me, this is interesting to see. For others, not so much...........

    Roundabout.jpg
    :-jon

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    My order for this (along with Gentle Giant Power and the Glory) from Amazon is out for delivery!! Full review tomorrow morning.

    I know this thing is gonna be killer.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    So I have given it 9/10. I was considering 10/10, but I like to leave some dynamic range in the scoring system... I just love the natural dynamics and artful separation and placement of the instruments and vocals.
    I've always been a fan of great stereo imaging and my old Meridian two channel system gave me that; an illusion of solidity that adds another dimension to the music. I'm very happy to report that I get that same solidity of image with this 5.1 mix, but in 360 degrees. What's really clever is that it achieves this while retaining or possibly improving on the emotional impact of the songs. Maybe that should have been a 10?
    Last edited by IanProudfoot; 11-18-2015 at 02:09 PM.

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    Default Re: Yes FRAGILE (2015 Mix)- [BluRay Audio/DVD-A]

    Wow!! This fucker is indeed a 10 all the way. WOWWWWWWWW!!!

    I've always loved this album straight thru from beginning to end. To me even what some consider to be throwaway tracks Cans, We Have Heaven and Five are all great.

  41. Thanks Clint Eastwood, GOS, JanBakker thanked for this post
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