The EV4 Surround Master and Software decode shoot out!

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ArmyOfQuad

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Since 2002/2003
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I've posted a new video to my youtube channel, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_8vqhrV-8E

This video announces the first shoot out involving the Involve Surround Master. Comparing the Involve Surround Master with Oxford Dickie's EV4 software decoding process.

Check out the video for more details.

(please excuse the sound issue, not sure why, but it posted with sound only on one side this morning. I didn't feel like redoing it, so I left it.)
 
That sounds like a great idea
I will find someone that can do it for me
Maybe my grand daughter .
But you do understand that charlie never said that it is a EV4 Decoder
I brought it up as I have said and others have that the QSD1
Decodes EV4 better that Decoders that were Marked EV4 there were not many
And the Surround Master is as good as the QSD1 so I tried it and it was good
There is a Vectorscope of the decoding of a EV4 disc through the Surround Master
A test against a Marked EV4 decoder would a better one
I said that it is compatible maybe 80 pc or 90 pc.
But I like any good discussion let the chips full as they may

Ron
 
I did want to include an EV4 decoder in the mix, I just wasn't able to get my hands on one. After holding things up too long, I decided to just deal with EV4 without a vintage decoder. The real discussion that drew my interest had to do with software vs. the surround master anyways, and the debate as to whether or not EV4 is compatible with QS or not.

This is just phase 1. I will also be doing similar tests with QS and SQ. For those I'd really like to get a vintage decoder into the mix as well. I do have some decodes done by others. But, to keep things consistent across the board, I've found that to keep things equal I want the same record played on the same turntable decoded with the various methods. To keep things even, I actually played my declicked digital files of the EV4 material through the decoder rather than doing it straight off the record, that way the software and the Involve are coming from the exact same source, exact same declicking. I think I may try to go that route for SQ and QS, if I can find someone with a Tate and one of the nice Sansui QS decoders (I know there are different models that are really good, don't know which is the best off the top of my head) that would be willing to run my digital file through their decoder.
 
It's interesting how when ever I've seen EV4 on an LP jacket, I'm always expecting minimal separation and little quad "thereness." I'd like to know I underestimated some.
 
I did want to include an EV4 decoder in the mix, I just wasn't able to get my hands on one. After holding things up too long, I decided to just deal with EV4 without a vintage decoder. The real discussion that drew my interest had to do with software vs. the surround master anyways, and the debate as to whether or not EV4 is compatible with QS or not.

This is just phase 1. I will also be doing similar tests with QS and SQ. For those I'd really like to get a vintage decoder into the mix as well. I do have some decodes done by others. But, to keep things consistent across the board, I've found that to keep things equal I want the same record played on the same turntable decoded with the various methods. To keep things even, I actually played my declicked digital files of the EV4 material through the decoder rather than doing it straight off the record, that way the software and the Involve are coming from the exact same source, exact same declicking. I think I may try to go that route for SQ and QS, if I can find someone with a Tate and one of the nice Sansui QS decoders (I know there are different models that are really good, don't know which is the best off the top of my head) that would be willing to run my digital file through their decoder.

So I'm far (far.!) from expert in these matters but having done about a year or so of intensive (and intense!) SQ LP decoding stuff (like approaching 300 SQ LPs decoded with that cute little SQ vinyl modded Surround Master, some multiple times..!) I can say I feel you are absolutely right to keep your results of your SQ testing as consistent and accurate as possible by using the same turntable setup in each instance no matter which decoding method you are using.

Why's that? Well.. I'm not sure about the turntable in and of itself.. but definitely I've found the cart/stylus can have a not inconsiderable effect on the quality of the SQ decode (not sound quality, forget that for a minute) I mean more things like separation which I have noticed the improvement using the Audio Technica AT440MLb (microline) rather than either of my Ortofons (one a spherical, the other an elliptical) is quite audible to me.. anyway there you go.

as for your EV4 shootout, I've listened through all the samples in all 3 ways a couple of times now and have taken your advice making some notes while listening (which helps enormously).. I would like to listen through some more before committing to anything but I already have some strong thoughts about it which I will keep to myself at this stage so as not to prejudice the outcome one iota. thanks for doing all this btw.
 
That sounds like a great idea
I will find someone that can do it for me
Maybe my grand daughter .
But you do understand that charlie never said that it is a EV4 Decoder
I brought it up as I have said and others have that the QSD1
Decodes EV4 better that Decoders that were Marked EV4 there were not many
And the Surround Master is as good as the QSD1 so I tried it and it was good
There is a Vectorscope of the decoding of a EV4 disc through the Surround Master
A test against a Marked EV4 decoder would a better one
I said that it is compatible maybe 80 pc or 90 pc.
But I like any good discussion let the chips full as they may.

Ron


I agree Ron .

My little QSD2 from Sansui worked wonders with EV-4. (and Dynaco's DY-4D as well )
 
I agree Ron .

My little QSD2 from Sansui worked wonders with EV-4. (and Dynaco's DY-4D as well )

..ah but did the Sansui get the surround soundfield correct when decoding the EV4, relative to the discrete presentation?

gotta say I'm finding this shootout fascinating...

:smokin

can't wait til AOQ gets to some of the QS and SQ stuff I'm familiar with (I'd never heard any of these tracks before at all) :)
 
If you look up One Fine Morning /By Lighthouse
EV4 played through the Surround Master
On the Vectorscope the sound moves around you as seen on the scope
Also there is a short Enoch light track

Ron
 
Type in on Google
surround master one fine morning vectorscope youtube
And you will see also another demo of EV4 on the side

Ron
 
..ah but did the Sansui get the surround soundfield correct when decoding the EV4, relative to the discrete presentation?

gotta say I'm finding this shootout fascinating...

:smokin


Yes.

EV-4 decoders had no logic based decoding.

oh right! so EV-4 works the same way as QS then..?

and so the two systems would be cross-compatible?

(I don't know anything about all this stuff so its like being back at school.. only more fun! :eek: )
 
It is a normal oscilloscope with a small kit
attached to give a 4 channel display
I have had it for about 20 years
 
Before I commit to what I think is the Surround Master in these tests (pretty sure tbh) I just want to confirm the "Involve" mode is the QS equivalent on the decoder that is processing these EV4 encoded passages of music, yes?
 

Thanks. :upthumb

Ps. I resisted the urge to run these through the computer
(I didn't know I had the self-restraint.. :eek: ..just about everything goes through the computer these days as a matter of course, if it could do the washing and the cooking I'd set the computer to it.. hmm.. it could be programmed to do the tasks I guess.. hehehe.. :D )
 
Here is the link to the video on youtube of ' rustyandi `s vectorscope ' of Ev4 demo

The Surround Master has never claimed to be a Ev4 Decoder, it just does a good job of decoding a 4 channel sound from a Ev4 LP...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81Uzp2U6lBs

Hi,
very interesting - but what is the vectorscope.
I mean Type or is it on a flatscreen by an PC/desktop

Thanks for your information
 
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