HiRez Poll Beatles, The - Sgt Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band [BluRay]

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Rate the BDA of The Beatles - SGT PEPPERS LONELY HEARTS CLUB BAND


  • Total voters
    150
I don't know, I'm kinda sad about you guys who don't get it...I do understand personal expectations and the previous "Love" Super high expectations . like mine, but I do think it is a quite ..ehem..appropriate mix...

It IS the BEATLES we talkin' bout...
Sargeant Peperr's nevertheless, with all the dozens and dozens of times I've heard , mostly the Stereo on LP...the mono version was a reveletion, and now we get the multichannel mix, which is a heaven sent...

Most of you will not like the simile, (although I think THIS mix is MUCH better), is the RUSH MCH MCH mixes and their consevative mixes....

:couch

I LOVE IT!!!

well you've quoted me kap, so I guess that means you feel sad for me - among others here - that don't "get it".. so here goes nuthin'.. :)

fwiw I don't feel like my expectations of what could be done with this album in Surround were particularly unrealistic.

why's that?
well for one I acknowledge that its a 50 year old recording and there are limitations inherent in that, as to what the folks remixing it now could do with numbers and types of multitrack elements available to them and so on.

also, I accept that too much heavy handed crazy revisionism would not go down well with a load of people and so the producers of this new remix would aim for something more conservative perhaps (although some of those moaners, we all know one, have been proven not to be such die hard, hardcore surround music fans as us lot at QQ.. so why some folks feel the need to whine on about very active surround mixes being so inappropriate and inauthentic compared to the original Stereo when they don't really care and they can go back to their precious original anytime they like.. bah.. we could debate that one til the cows come home! life's too short! :D )

on a more personal level, all I've ever known up til now was the (to me, sometimes kinda "wonky") Stereo mixes..
and up until the early 90's when I first got Sgt.Peppers on CD, prior to that my only exposure to the album as an album was from occasional listening with my dear (now v.sadly departed) Grandpapa playing the record on his old console radiogram piece of furniture (it was like a cocktail cabinet, a stereo and a coffin all in one.. acres of rosewood and brass handles with warm glow lights everywhere!) and that's his nigh-on 50 year old LP, I still play to this day.. and I gotta tell you he loved playing this album even when I was a nipper..which come to think of it, was even by then a good number of years after the album came out (lets face it, its a stone cold Classic, the Classic album amongst Classic albums, in every sense.. Grandad obviously felt it was that much of a classic too, he loved it 10-15 years after it first came out).

what I'm trying to convey (sorry for the rambling, its just all one long stream of semi-consciousness!) and maybe I should have expressed this better already.. but I was first and foremost thinking of the music in the context of the only versions I know.
that is ;
1.) the Stereo - still never heard it in mono - and what I thought maybe could have been done with panning and a bit of creativity in remixing it into 5.1 surround based on the Stereo
2.) then looking at what modern technology could do 10+ years ago with The Beatles' music in the Love DVD-A in 5.1 (imho = jawdroppingly good)

..and in all fairness, if the result of this new Sgt Pepper 5.1 surround remix had even fallen somewhere in between what I'd always imagined it might be in surround (some harmonies back there, some harp over there, a bit of sitar over here, some crowd noise sound fx back there, etc) and with even only one or two instances of some of the crazy ass surround stuff they did in the Love 5.1 (that I love!) just to really remind yourself you're alive, then I'd be totally happy and have no hesitation in giving this a 9 or 10 in the QQ Poll..

..BUT, for me, the new 5.1 actually is less inventive and engaging than both the aspects of the old Stereo mixes I enjoy to this day (those that are more modern with lead vocals in centre front mostly but not always) and just about everything i love about Love in 5.1.

so for those reasons, among others, at this point I'm just plain underwhelmed by this new surround remix.

I don't feel particularly sad about it... disappointed, yes.. from what I felt (you can argue the toss otherwise, I won't be offended) was not some outlandish expectation starting point I don't feel was out of whack to what they could do with it in surround with modern techniques.. but please don't feel sad for me kap! oh and don't cry for me Argentina.. the truth is I never left QQ! I mean you! :D
 
well you've quoted me kap, so I guess that means you feel sad for me - among others here - that don't "get it".. so here goes nuthin'.. :)

fwiw I don't feel like my expectations of what could be done with this album in Surround were particularly unrealistic.

why's that?
well for one I acknowledge that its a 50 year old recording and there are limitations inherent in that, as to what the folks remixing it now could do with numbers and types of multitrack elements available to them and so on.

also, I accept that too much heavy handed crazy revisionism would not go down well with a load of people and so the producers of this new remix would aim for something more conservative perhaps (although some of those moaners, we all know one, have been proven not to be such die hard, hardcore surround music fans as us lot at QQ.. so why some folks feel the need to whine on about very active surround mixes being so inappropriate and inauthentic compared to the original Stereo when they don't really care and they can go back to their precious original anytime they like.. bah.. we could debate that one til the cows come home! life's too short! :D )

on a more personal level, all I've ever known up til now was the (to me, sometimes kinda "wonky") Stereo mixes..
and up until the early 90's when I first got Sgt.Peppers on CD, prior to that my only exposure to the album as an album was from occasional listening with my dear (now v.sadly departed) Grandpapa playing the record on his old console radiogram piece of furniture (it was like a cocktail cabinet, a stereo and a coffin all in one.. acres of rosewood and brass handles with warm glow lights everywhere!) and that's his nigh-on 50 year old LP, I still play to this day.. and I gotta tell you he loved playing this album even when I was a nipper..which come to think of it, was even by then a good number of years after the album came out (lets face it, its a stone cold Classic, the Classic album amongst Classic albums, in every sense.. Grandad obviously felt it was that much of a classic too, he loved it 10-15 years after it first came out).

what I'm trying to convey (sorry for the rambling, its just all one long stream of semi-consciousness!) and maybe I should have expressed this better already.. but I was first and foremost thinking of the music in the context of the only versions I know.
that is ;
1.) the Stereo - still never heard it in mono - and what I thought maybe could have been done with panning and a bit of creativity in remixing it into 5.1 surround based on the Stereo
2.) then looking at what modern technology could do 10+ years ago with The Beatles' music in the Love DVD-A in 5.1 (imho = jawdroppingly good)

..and in all fairness, if the result of this new Sgt Pepper 5.1 surround remix had even fallen somewhere in between what I'd always imagined it might be in surround (some harmonies back there, some harp over there, a bit of sitar over here, some crowd noise sound fx back there, etc) and with even only one or two instances of some of the crazy ass surround stuff they did in the Love 5.1 (that I love!) just to really remind yourself you're alive, then I'd be totally happy and have no hesitation in giving this a 9 or 10 in the QQ Poll..

..BUT, for me, the new 5.1 actually is less inventive and engaging than both the aspects of the old Stereo mixes I enjoy to this day (those that are more modern with lead vocals in centre front mostly but not always) and just about everything i love about Love in 5.1.

so for those reasons, among others, at this point I'm just plain underwhelmed by this new surround remix.

I don't feel particularly sad about it... disappointed, yes.. from what I felt (you can argue the toss otherwise, I won't be offended) was not some outlandish expectation starting point I don't feel was out of whack to what they could do with it in surround with modern techniques.. but please don't feel sad for me kap! oh and don't cry for me Argentina.. the truth is I never left QQ! I mean you! :D


I'm not kidding.....OK?

"Yeah...what HE said"..thank you Adam...!
:smokin
 
You should try turning up the rear channels about 3 dB (you might like the surround mix more!)
well here's what I did do:
transferred it to a quad reel with the center channel bleed between 2 fronts.
listened to this rear channels only and while it is discrete occasionally, it's not nearly enough, really I expected so much more from a recording I've heard frankly too many times anyway:)
early in the album especially it's just plain bad, with ambience in the rears.
Kite does some interesting stuff with clarity and a small bit of panning but not nearly enough, very frustrating...and I know this will be heresy, but I honestly think John's voice should move in this as he introduces various acts. Oh man I could go on..
 
....and one more thing while I'm rantin' and ravin':)
after what I heard done in the Anthology I really felt it would be no sweat to do a surround mix, after all they did a quad in '73.
with an adventurous mix there would be a wow factor to bring in a new audience for surround and who better to do this than the Beatles? total missed opportunity. I feel like this is little more than Silverline in places and if this is what I heard to demonstrate the glory of surround, I'd go 'meh' and stick with good old stereo and mono.
 
Not to digress from the subject at hand, but BS&T's first album Child Is Father To The Man was released in February of 1968 and what Al Cooper accomplished with this 5.1 remix is NOTHING SHORT of SPECTACULAR. I have NO idea how many tracks they had to work with but on my system it sounds transcendent.

Giles Martin is a conservative remixer and I've been saying all along that it was George Martin's guidance/input which made the LOVE album so sonically superior to Pepper.

Thankfully, on my system, Pepper does sound the best I've ever heard it but like Adam and company, IMO, it could've been much MORE....in the discrete surround department!

Paging Al Cooper* to remix THE WHITE ALBUM..........

[*Steve Wilson is too busy with his own projects and the great, honorable Elliot Scheiner is retired]:(

And when surround connoisseur, fredblue [known as AB to his constituents] ain't happy with the surround mix....there'll surely be hell to pay down that long and winding road as he's the kind of lad who just can't LET IT BE!
 
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..BUT, for me, the new 5.1 actually is less inventive and engaging than both the aspects of the old Stereo mixes I enjoy to this day (those that are more modern with lead vocals in centre front mostly but not always) and just about everything i love about Love in 5.1.

so for those reasons, among others, at this point I'm just plain underwhelmed by this new surround remix.
I kept a piece of fredblue's quote as it is what is prompting my response, but didn't want to take up too much room. I thought this was a good representative section in a very good comment.

Anyway, slavish homage to the original mono in a stereo or multichannel remix is a flawed concept even if it is supposed to reflect the artist's original intent. You can still be faithful to the artist's intent and produce a result that not only has the great clarity the blu ray of this has, but also open up the dynamics some. I gave this an 8 on the poll primarily because of the clarity and strength of the album.

I remember first listening to one song on this album clandestinely as I was babysitting the neighbor's kids when I was about 14. I had heard the Beatles were heavily into drugs by this point but didn't believe it because I had just recently seen "Help." I selected a song at random. Mr.Kite - that sounds nice. The needle fell, I was alone in the house, the song was scary, and holy cow, it was true, the Beatles were all drug addicts just like my parents warned me and I should never ever listen to anything past Rubber Soul. Or my real soul would be lost....Well, a couple of years later I listened again, this time all the way through, and as the final piano chord crashed and faded, I remember thinking what incredible geniuses they were. If ever a piano chord could shake the world it was that one.

My slight disappointment with the remix is my unrealistic expectation that the moment I first heard this album completely might be recreated just a little. But I can't put that on Giles. I have played Sgt Pepper so many times that it is too familiar to recreate the elation of that first real listen. But it has left me thinking I may not buy the White Album - I have never thought it was as good as SP, and if they take the same approach on the remix the resulting dynamics may be the same. Ah well, maybe I will buy it. There's still the clarity....
 
I My slight disappointment with the remix is my unrealistic expectation that the moment I first heard this album completely might be recreated just a little. But I can't put that on Giles. I have played Sgt Pepper so many times that it is too familiar to recreate the elation of that first real listen. But it has left me thinking I may not buy the White Album - I have never thought it was as good as SP, and if they take the same approach on the remix the resulting dynamics may be the same. Ah well, maybe I will buy it. There's still the clarity....

May I say that Giles is haunted by his Father's ghost (or poltergeist in this case)
St. George can be praised(or praise -ed in English English) for his impact on the Beatles but his slavish devotion to MONO and Hatred for STEREO. St George MUST REALLY HATE US from the great beyond and our 4.0/5.1 ilk. I think his legacy and impact on Giles is self evident. BE safe! Don't disfigure the Beatles. You can't change them!!!! Why can't there be more than one mix if you are so afraid? I despise safe conservative use of channels. Have fun dammit!!
Giles BE BRAVE!!!!! SP in 24/96 is still stunning. I had the BEATLES GREEN APPLE USB collection all Beatle albums in 24/44.8 Pretty Damn good but the DTS i24/96 5.1 is stunning. Strawberry Fields is Fing incredible.

The best Beatles surround is the song YELLOW SUBMARINE on the BLU-Ray (not Beatles One) of Yellow Submarine Si o No?

Is the talk of the White Album fact or fiction? Al Kooper please step forward! I will buy it regardless.
 
May I say that Giles is haunted by his Father's ghost (or poltergeist in this case)
St. George can be praised(or praise -ed in English English) for his impact on the Beatles but his slavish devotion to MONO and Hatred for STEREO. St George MUST REALLY HATE US from the great beyond and our 4.0/5.1 ilk. I think his legacy and impact on Giles is self evident. BE safe! Don't disfigure the Beatles. You can't change them!!!! Why can't there be more than one mix if you are so afraid? I despise safe conservative use of channels. Have fun dammit!!
Giles BE BRAVE!!!!! SP in 24/96 is still stunning. I had the BEATLES GREEN APPLE USB collection all Beatle albums in 24/44.8 Pretty Damn good but the DTS i24/96 5.1 is stunning. Strawberry Fields is Fing incredible.

The best Beatles surround is the song YELLOW SUBMARINE on the BLU-Ray (not Beatles One) of Yellow Submarine Si o No?

Is the talk of the White Album fact or fiction? Al Kooper please step forward! I will buy it regardless.

You seem to forget and I will shout it from the rooftops: The reason LOVE was so f~ing GREAT was that 'St. George' had the upper hand in bringing this discrete Beatles potpourri to fruition. Sir George knew those master tapes backwards and forwards. Only he could mastermind that exquisite remix!

Personally, I think SP had way too many cooks in the broth [the remaining Beatles, 'perhaps' Yoko and Olivia to a lesser extent] and Giles' ULTRA remixing conservatism which was already on FULL display in the Criterion BD~V 'double stereo version' of A Hard Days Night and Beatles 1+ [actually BEATLES -5.1].

And unless we make out dissatisfaction known to the powers that be at Universal {UMG} we can expect MORE OF THE SAME in regards to any future Beatles surround projects.

And remember fellas: it's not as though there will any future attempts to remix Sgt. Pepper, Hard Days Night and Beatles 1+ into surround. THIS IS IT!


True Story: Elliot Scheiner approached Apple/EMI with a proposal to remix Abbey Road in surround. They laughed at him. So, who's laughing NOW? :(
 
You seem to forget and I will shout it from the rooftops: The reason LOVE was so f~ing GREAT was that 'St. George' had the upper hand in bringing this discrete Beatles potpourri to fruition. Sir George knew those master tapes backwards and forwards. Only he could mastermind that exquisite remix!

You do realise that Sir George Martin was practically deaf when 'Love' was mixed and that Giles was his 'ears' for that entire project?
 
You seem to forget and I will shout it from the rooftops: The reason LOVE was so f~ing GREAT was that 'St. George' had the upper hand in bringing this discrete Beatles potpourri to fruition. Sir George knew those master tapes backwards and forwards. Only he could mastermind that exquisite remix!

Personally, I think SP had way too many cooks in the broth [the remaining Beatles, 'perhaps' Yoko and Olivia to a lesser extent] and Giles' ULTRA remixing conservatism which was already on FULL display in the Criterion BD~V 'double stereo version' of A Hard Days Night and Beatles 1+ [actually BEATLES -5.1].

And unless we make out dissatisfaction known to the powers that be at Universal {UMG} we can expect MORE OF THE SAME in regards to any future Beatles surround projects.

And remember fellas: it's not as though there will any future attempts to remix Sgt. Pepper, Hard Days Night and Beatles 1+ into surround. THIS IS IT!


True Story: Elliot Scheiner approached Apple/EMI with a proposal to remix Abbey Road in surround. They laughed at him. So, who's laughing NOW? :(
The fact that THIS IS IT is what has me so upset. Yes, more clarity. ..which mostly makes things better but sometimes not so much, for example, at least on my system on previous versions She's Leaving Home had the strings sounding very wood, now they sound very metal...of course the strings are metal but they resonate in a wood cabinet, now to me it sounds like the entire violin is made of metal.

It's really what they did with the sound placement on the surround version that has me spittin' nails.
 
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I'm having a hard time shaking this out of my system, but in time, All Things Must Pass.
This reminds me of the time I spent a lot (like $6.99!) on a quad 8-track of one of my favorite albums of all time, Carole King Tapestry.
Even as a teenager circa 1974 I was highly upset at the echo-y mess they had going on in the rear channels.

This brought those horrible feelings right back again, decades later, only now it's my fave band of all time.

Pepper isn't nearly as bad as Tapestry was (and Tapestry did get a nice surround mix for sacd later on)
but let me speak of the Beatles vision for a minute. On Revolver, you have panning (elenor) and on Abbey Road you have panning (sun king)
so, as these mixes were obviously approved, the Beatles were obvious fans of panning around sound. Had they had full surround in homes does anyone think the Fabs wouldn't have gone wild with it? Of course they would have.

Now, 50 years later, people complain Paul is in the right channel only. Well, it was what it was! People want to modernize things and center his vocal. Ok but that also makes it like every other record, not the crazy weirdness that was originally put out there. Same with the Pepper remix. More clarity. also more boring. end of today's rant.
 
Re: the audience being in the front instead of the back.

Maybe from the band's perspective -- and this is, after all, an album about a band! -- it's only natural for the audience to be in front ?
 
dont know if it's my setup..but the 5.1 mix didn't sound very surroundish at all to me though the new stereo remix was very impressive!

edit: I may have it worked out...the signal is going via ps4/hdmi to the tv, then out via optical ..will be trying optical straight from ps4
 
Second good listen today, and yes there is clarity, but on the whole I am seriously unimpressed.

The remix is down there with Silverline and James Guthrie's poor extended stereo mixes.

Lots of jumping up and down because it's The Beatles, tempered with why when 'Love' was so good can every surround mix since be so bad.

Anyone who has given this a score higher than Love is not measuring things properly.

Well said. In addition those edgy vocals don't help.
 
The fact that THIS IS IT is what has me so upset. Yes, more clarity. ..which mostly makes things better but sometimes not so much, for example, at least on my system on previous versions She's Leaving Home had the strings sounding very wood, now they sound very metal...of course the strings are metal but they resonate in a wood cabinet, now to me it sounds like the entire violin is made of metal.

It's really what they did with the sound placement on the surround version that has me spittin' nails.

I think "clarity" can be switched with "edgy". Too bad I really hoped this would be similar to Love.
 
Re: the audience being in the front instead of the back.

Maybe from the band's perspective -- and this is, after all, an album about a band! -- it's only natural for the audience to be in front ?

hmm, while we all hear music differently and nobody is wrong, I'll just say it seems to me that it is a show presentation for an audience (the person listening to it) and as you are a member 'we hope you will/have enjoy/enjoyed the show' your seat should be front row of course:)
 
I can't check it right now, but from memory the crowd IS in the rears, isn't it? (although I do have the rears turned up 3dB!)

Played it this morning for a friend, and had the audience in mind while listening -- on my system, at least, I can confirm lennonfan's saying the audience IS in the front! I sort of like hearing what an audience must have sounded like to the Beatles (thankfully, no piercing tweenage screams :rolleyes: ).

I also tried the trick of sitting between the rear speakers while my friend was in my usual "separate front row lounge seats for two" and it DID sound more immersive! I may try tweaking to the rear when I'm really bored some day (I've been wanting to try a different mic placement for a new Audyssey tweak anyway).
 
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