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Thread: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by humprof View Post
    Fizzywigs, do you have the exact URL? You could try archive.org's "Wayback Machine":

    http://archive.org/web/
    Exact URL ? No I don't unfortunately . Both UMG and Sony had a site back then though fwiw.(and Warner and Silverline 4 DVDA)

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    Default Re: Old SACD catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by jsulzinger View Post
    These are pages from the catalogs that I have so I believe they are from 2002 rather than 1999. The only thing of interest that is not shown in the above images is a planned stereo release of King Crimson ITCOTCK on Virgin records.
    I'd love to see the rest. Interest is in the eye of the beholder.

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    Default Re: Old SACD catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by haikubass View Post
    A DVD-A list is in this thread.
    "this thread" that I started! haha

    I actually found an earlier thread with that list on QQ and it pours some cold water on it being an actual 'upcoming release' list, it sounds more like it was a label wish list. To quote MCunningham from that original 2002 thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by MCunningham View Post
    DVD-Forum Schweiz

    I wouldn't get excited just yet. This list has been on their site since the beginning of last year. The list consists of titles that were mentioned in passing by Warner as possible future projects back when the format was just beginning it's launch. A few have actually appeared, but for the most part, it basically remains a wish list. The owner of the site has continued to add titles to the list as they've been announced, Linkin Park: Reanimation, Alanis Morissette: Under Rug Swept, etc. along with most of the titles that have since been announced. They were not on the list originally.

    Here's an archive.org Wayback Machine capture of the UMG Upcoming SACD list on April 6, 2004. Note the 6 Steely Dan SACD's listed as upcoming at the very bottom of the page. I think they disappeared by the summer of that year - I also remember The Killers 'Hot Fuss' being on that page for a while too.

    ETA: captures from some other dates yield some interesting titles I'd forgotten about:

    Jun 3 2004: Motley Crue 'Greatest Hits' (Hip-O)

    Aug 21 2004: John Fogerty 'Deja Vu All Over Again' (Geffen)

    Oct 11 2004: Bob Marley & The Wailers 'Burnin' (Island)

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    might be best to add a word to the thread title: "NOT"

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    The Cars 5.1 mix on the DVD-A list is definitely real and it's fantastic. There are a bunch of references to it in the "Listening To Now" thread. Wonder how it escaped that vaults...

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Sorry, but put me in the camp that thinks the Cars 5.1 is an amateur job. Instrument placements are really rudimentary, with the occasional clumsy panning effect. If you do a spectral analysis of it as well, the frequency response completely cuts off somewhere around 17kHz-18kHz which is a classic sign of a lossy source.

    Given that all the songs from that album are available as Rock Band or Guitar Hero stems, I think it's more than likely that someone tried to do a 5.1 mix from them and pass it off as the shelved DVD-A mix.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by steelydave View Post
    Sorry, but put me in the camp that thinks the Cars 5.1 is an amateur job. Instrument placements are really rudimentary, with the occasional clumsy panning effect. If you do a spectral analysis of it as well, the frequency response completely cuts off somewhere around 17kHz-18kHz which is a classic sign of a lossy source.

    Given that all the songs from that album are available as Rock Band or Guitar Hero stems, I think it's more than likely that someone tried to do a 5.1 mix from them and pass it off as the shelved DVD-A mix.
    To each his own. The Cars S/T is one of my favorite albums and IMO the mix is a lot better than many legit 5.1 mixes commissioned by Warner for DVD-A.

    Nothing wrong with a good fan effort in my book...Skherbeck's 5.1 versions of the entire Boston album and Led Zep's "What Is And What Should Never Be" are a blast to listen to.
    Last edited by sjcorne; 11-14-2017 at 07:59 PM.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fizzywiggs41 View Post
    Stevie Ray Vaughn, Miles Davis, Kansas , etc . At least we know they likely have them in MC 5.1 (and quad) in their vault.
    Not necessarily. It just tells you they were titles being considered for release in 5.1 Surround SACD.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by bmoura View Post
    Not necessarily. It just tells you they were titles being considered for release in 5.1 Surround SACD.
    I agree that not all pre~announced SACD/DVD~A titles necessarily had already been remixed into 5.1, but I'm sure a number of those titles, were, in fact, remixed and awaiting release and then canned because of dreadful sales figures and/or artist rejection.

    There just might be some test pressings of the pre~announced titles floating around. Would've loved to be a fly on the roll at the time of the DVD~A/SACD rollout. Minuscule ads in the major audio publications....no wonder those numbskulls failed. Apathy killed the Quadio star!

    But of course, at the time, those of us heavily into surround had NO idea that plug would be so unceremoniously pulled. Hindsight IS 50~50!

    I'm still to this day amazed that DVD, more than any other format, took off like a bullet out of the starting gate. UHD 4K, as far as I'm concerned, is DOA or at least struggling to co~exist with BD~V and even DVDs, the latter of which continues to be churned out and are sometimes even more expensive than BD~Vs.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by 4-earredwonder View Post
    I agree that not all pre~announced SACD/DVD~A titles necessarily had already been remixed into 5.1, but I'm sure a number of those titles, were, in fact, remixed and awaiting release and then canned because of dreadful sales figures and/or artist rejection.
    Having chased down countless rumored 4 Channel and 5.1 Channel mixes with Audio Fidelity, I can say that most of the rumored Surround mixes that were announced ended up never being mixed into Surround.
    The ones that were are subject to the standard issues of artist approval, licensing fee requests, etc.

    So I wouldn't get your hopes up too high on most of these announced Surround titles.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by bmoura View Post
    Having chased down countless rumored 4 Channel and 5.1 Channel mixes with Audio Fidelity, I can say that most of the rumored Surround mixes that were announced ended up never being mixed into Surround.
    The ones that were are subject to the standard issues of artist approval, licensing fee requests, etc.

    So I wouldn't get your hopes up too high on most of these announced Surround titles.
    I think with the UK laws being more amenable than US ones and considering Michael Dutton's rapport with SONY Music [among others], he could possibly license some of those existing pre~announced titles as more than a handful fit into D~V's targeted 'comfort zone.'

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by sjcorne View Post
    To each his own (was just listening to America Homecoming). It's one of my favorite albums and IMO the mix is a lot better than many legit 5.1 mixes commissioned by Warner for DVD-A.

    Nothing wrong with a good fan effort in my book...Skherbeck's 5.1 versions of the entire Boston album and Led Zep's "What Is And What Should Never Be" are a blast to listen to.
    Homecoming is not a fan effort, but was in fact a legit DVD-A release from Warners. Are you saying there was also a "fan" 5.1 mix which you rate better than other legit 5.1 mixes.

    I missed your point there.

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    Default Re: Old SACD catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by steelydave View Post
    "this thread" that I started! haha

    I actually found an earlier thread with that list on QQ and it pours some cold water on it being an actual 'upcoming release' list, it sounds more like it was a label wish list. To quote MCunningham from that original 2002 thread:




    Here's an archive.org Wayback Machine capture of the UMG Upcoming SACD list on April 6, 2004. Note the 6 Steely Dan SACD's listed as upcoming at the very bottom of the page. I think they disappeared by the summer of that year - I also remember The Killers 'Hot Fuss' being on that page for a while too.

    ETA: captures from some other dates yield some interesting titles I'd forgotten about:

    Jun 3 2004: Motley Crue 'Greatest Hits' (Hip-O)

    Aug 21 2004: John Fogerty 'Deja Vu All Over Again' (Geffen)

    Oct 11 2004: Bob Marley & The Wailers 'Burnin' (Island)
    I'm guessing the Motley Crue SACD would be the same mix as on the "Greatest Video Hits" DVD released around the same time, only at higher resolution...

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by quicksrt View Post
    Homecoming is not a fan effort, but was in fact a legit DVD-A release from Warners. Are you saying there was also a "fan" 5.1 mix which you rate better than other legit 5.1 mixes.

    I missed your point there.
    Yeah sorry...I probably shouldn't have put the Homecoming reference in there as it wasn't really funny. I had typed "to each his own" and remembered that was the name of one of the songs on that album, so thought it would be funny but it wasn't. I know Homecoming is an 100% real Elliot Scheiner 5.1 mix and it's one of my favorites.

    My opinion was that the Cars 5.1, whether it is fan made or real, is better than some other Warner DVD-A mixes that were released, such as the 5.1 Machine Head or Billion Dollar Babies which sound more like "expanded stereo" to me.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by bmoura View Post
    Not necessarily. It just tells you they were titles being considered for release in 5.1 Surround SACD.
    Oh my, should of stated "possibly" .

    Well we do know Miles Davis exists , and 2 SRV titles I'd seen as upcoming MC on a few sites back when , Kansas ??? Who knows .(the shadow I suppose)

    Wonder if The Byrds-Fifth Dimension got the treatment ? Was on that Sony site for about a year ...right up to the time that site disappeared , not definitive but who knows ?


    Any info regarding SACD titles that "you know definitely " don't exist , Brian ? ( Well Sony, of course )

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fizzywiggs41 View Post
    Oh my, should of stated "possibly" .

    Well we do know Miles Davis exists , and 2 SRV titles I'd seen as upcoming MC on a few sites back when , Kansas ??? Who knows .(the shadow I suppose)

    Wonder if The Byrds-Fifth Dimension got the treatment ? Was on that Sony site for about a year ...right up to the time that site disappeared , not definitive but who knows ?


    Any info regarding SACD titles that "you know definitely " don't exist , Brian ? ( Well Sony, of course )
    Byrds' 5D and the SRV were afaik remixed into 5.1 by QQ Member ThomC (Thom Cadley)
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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fredblue View Post
    Byrds' 5D and the SRV were afaik remixed into 5.1 by QQ Member ThomC (Thom Cadley)
    Thanks , Fredderico .

    Nice to know someone's on the ball.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    I wonder if Mark Anderson--or anyone else--would be willing to draft a subsection of the "Rumored" page of his Popular Quad discography compiling titles that were definitely mixed...

    Quote Originally Posted by fredblue View Post
    Byrds' 5D and the SRV were afaik remixed into 5.1 by QQ Member ThomC (Thom Cadley)

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by humprof View Post
    I wonder if Mark Anderson--or anyone else--would be willing to draft a subsection of the "Rumored" page of his Popular Quad discography compiling titles that were definitely mixed...
    iirc the Byrds' mix was speculated upon to be possibly not the best ever due to limited multitracks at the remix engineer's disposal or something, may account for it never making it out i don't know..!?
    ..also I think an SRV v.v.briefly may have made it out but don't quote me on that, its past bedtime and I may have had one too many Smirnoff and 7Up's ce soir to be totally relied upon now
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    6 MultiCh DL

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fredblue View Post
    iirc the Byrds' mix was speculated upon to be possibly not the best ever due to limited multitracks at the remix engineer's disposal or something, may account for it never making it out i don't know..!?
    ..also I think an SRV v.v.briefly may have made it out but don't quote me on that, its past bedtime and I may have had one too many Smirnoff and 7Up's ce soir to be totally relied upon now
    That doesn't really surprise me...it is a pretty old album (1966). If it was released it might've been the oldest album to be mixed in surround. iirc Super Session & Child Is Father To The Man were each recorded a year or two later.

    Come to think of it a lot of the mixes I've heard from this short-lived series of Single-Layer Multichannel SACDs from Sony aren't particularly impressive IMO.

    The ones sourced from quad masters are fantastic- I have Head Hunters, Blow By Blow & Mysterious Traveller

    Of the 5.1's I've got, a few are generally good but mixed rather conservatively (The BJs, JTs, Strange Beautiful Music). Toys In The Attic is probably the most adventurous new mix but I like the quad better. Tapestry never really impressed me, Agents Of Fortune and the Oasis album are pretty bad, and Kind Of Blue & Time Out are essentially 3-channel. I'm probably forgetting others...

    Haven't heard the rest, still looking for In A Silent Way, Gratitude, Blue Country Heart, and the two PIR quads.

    So who knows...maybe some of these unreleased mixes weren't all that great. Remember these would've been from the same company that ignored the incredible quad versions of Bartok Concerto For Orchestra and the Chorus Line soundtrack...

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fredblue View Post
    iirc the Byrds' mix was speculated upon to be possibly not the best ever due to limited multitracks at the remix engineer's disposal or something, may account for it never making it out i don't know..!?
    ..also I think an SRV v.v.briefly may have made it out but don't quote me on that, its past bedtime and I may have had one too many Smirnoff and 7Up's ce soir to be totally relied upon now
    Could be a case where a few were "partially" mixed , incomplete mixes.

    Hell I aint picky--give me what you got Sony !!

    --And that goes DOUBLE for UMG with say...AJA !! And the remaining "mixed" Dan's fwiw.

    We know "Pretzel Logic " was completed , and either Royal Scam or Katie Lied but it gets a bit foggy there as to what Elliot Scheiner managed to mix from the Dan before UMG pulled the plug.
    (and of course ...Greg Penny's mixes of "Don't Shoot..", Blue Moves,..etc.fr ELTON JOHN)

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fizzywiggs41 View Post
    Could be a case where a few were "partially" mixed.
    Yes, that has occurred as well.
    Most famously with the Thriller album by Michael Jackson. Where Jackson rejected the 5.1 mixes done by several different top recording engineers.

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by sjcorne View Post
    That doesn't really surprise me...it is a pretty old album (1966). If it was released it might've been the oldest album to be mixed in surround. iirc Super Session & Child Is Father To The Man were each recorded a year or two later.

    Come to think of it a lot of the mixes I've heard from this short-lived series of Single-Layer Multichannel SACDs from Sony aren't particularly impressive IMO.

    The ones sourced from quad masters are fantastic- I have Head Hunters, Blow By Blow & Mysterious Traveller

    Of the 5.1's I've got, a few are generally good but mixed rather conservatively (The BJs, JTs, Strange Beautiful Music). Toys In The Attic is probably the most adventurous new mix but I like the quad better. Tapestry never really impressed me, Agents Of Fortune and the Oasis album are pretty bad, and Kind Of Blue & Time Out are essentially 3-channel. I'm probably forgetting others...

    Haven't heard the rest, still looking for In A Silent Way, Gratitude, Blue Country Heart, and the two PIR quads.

    So who knows...maybe some of these unreleased mixes weren't all that great. Remember these would've been from the


    same company that ignored the incredible quad versions of Bartok Concerto For Orchestra and the Chorus Line




    soundtrack...


    I have a few titles mixed in surround fr '66 or prior, fwiw.

    4 Dylan's !! Other Side Of The Mirror -DVD (64,65,66), and Live in NYC- SACD(64), Another Side Of -SACD (64), Bringing It All Back Home- SACD(65), Blonde On Blonde -SACD (66) .

    Donavon-Fairytale DVDA(65)-weak surround though. And there are Beatles (DVD, DVDA, BD) mixes fr 64 upwards , possibly
    63 as well.


    There are not very many though. And some better than others . The earliest surround I think is the SACD of Art Tatum (1949 plus) piano works.


    https://www.amazon.ca/Live-Shrine-St.../dp/B0017R1E5K

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  38. #49
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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Quote Originally Posted by fizzywiggs41 View Post
    We know "Pretzel Logic " was completed , and either Royal Scam or Katy Lied but it gets a bit foggy there as to what Elliot Scheiner managed to mix from the Dan before UMG pulled the plug.
    Pretzel Logic's 45th is in 2019 I think...there's really no reason they can't just throw the 5.1 in a mega box set and finally end all the speculation. I wouldn't even care if it was a Dolby-encoded DVD.

    But that's another conversation for another thread I suppose...

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    Default Re: 2002 SACD Catalog with Kansas Leftoverture listed as coming soon

    Actually I'm hoping for a "small " box with Pretzel's and Pretzel.

    Big box of all 5.1 STEELY DAN'S would be way cool , though.

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