HiRez Poll Yes - FRAGILE (2002 Mix) [DVD-A]/[SACD-JAPAN]

Hey Ed
Funny you should mention Tulls Stand up , I have the remastered version that was released a few years back and you can really hear a big difference in the clarity of the acoustic guitars. It also sounds as if a dull vail has been lifted off the original recording. Benefit also sounds this way but some of the later Tull recordings that have been remastered just sound like they boosted the output and nothing more ! I really wish we had some Tull in 5.1 .
Paul

Nova said:

Hey Ed
Funny you should mention Tulls Stand up , I have the remastered version that was released a few years back and you can really hear a big difference in the clarity of the acoustic guitars. It also sounds as if a dull vail has been lifted off the original recording. Benefit also sounds this way but some of the later Tull recordings that have been remastered just sound like they boosted the output and nothing more ! I really wish we had some Tull in 5.1 .
Paul

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Hell, I'd settle for a reissued 4.0 AQUALUNG!

I've heard a few of the remasters--including STAND UP. But it sounds more like clever Eq'ing to bring up the guitars than, say, a remix, or better source tapes. Could be wrong about that, who knows? On the other hand, the MFSL gold disc of STAND UP was, IMO, completely honest to the best sound for that album I'd ever heard--not exceptionally better, but faithful to the sonics as heard on the W7/Reprise 1st press; and later, an Island UK pressing that was also pretty nice. Still, even if multis existed for STAND UP, not sure it'd be worth the bother, would take some smart remixing to spread it out AND keep the magic and warmth of the original recording intact.

FRAGILE, on the other hand, I like a bit better now for it having been mixed to 5.1, whatever misgivings I might have about the mixes. But I still think this is a situation where there is only so much that could be done to tweak without losing that 'magic,' which I don't think happened, the spirit of the album is intact on DVD-A. Maybe we just expect too much sometimes?

ED

Listened to this again the other day for the first time in awhile...after making my way though the recent Genesis box, I really think the surround Fragile a botched opportunity now. The extra reverb on the guitars and vocals is just so unnecessary. (worst offender must be the bonus track 'America' where the added 'verb on Howe's guitars changes the whole atmosphere of the middle section. And I still really dislike the remix of 'South Side of the Sky'.)

The only tracks I think shine over thier 2.0 counterparts in the 5.1 mix are 'Cans and Brahms' and '5% for Nothing'.

I like the record and I think it sounds great especially after hearing it from
vinyl on an old tin box for years!

I can't figure out why they did "Fragile" though instead of "The Yes Album".

With Starship Trooper, Your Is No Disgrace and I've Seen All Good People...tack America on to the back of that and man it'd be one hell of a
album release in 5.1!

Of course, you'll get arguments for "Tales" as well but the Yes Album I think, was more commercially viable and had better songs.
As for Tales.... you'd get no argument from me there really!

(or Relayer... or Time And A Word... or.... )

-Bob

America makes more sense as a bonus for Fragile since it was actually recorded between Fragile and Close to the Edge.


And too, Fragile is a more complex album, mix-wise, than the Yes Album.
It also happens to be a better seller and more famous than TYA. So the choice was obvious from a commercial perspective.

Close to the Edge might have been the trump card, but some of the multitracks have gone missing....so no surround remix.

bsquiresjr said:

I can't figure out why they did "Fragile" though instead of "The Yes Album".

-Bob

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I thought this too when I bought Fragile and was then more convinced when I heard the album again after many years even if it was in glorious DVD-A surround. That one song "I've Seen All Good People" is essential YES.

A "10".

An amazingly active mix that I've demoed to a fair few people with jaw-dropping results!

One of my Top 10 all-time surround albums, a desert island treasure to go along with
the 461 OB SACD, the Captain Fantastic SACD, the Seal IV DVDA, The Marvin Gaye Collection DVDA, The Nightfly DVDA, The Captain & Me DVDA, America's Homecoming DVDA, Steely Dan's Gaucho DVDA and the Winelight DVDA.

A must-have if you don't already own it.

Fragile sounds very good.

Well I'm a little torn on this one. Yes were my favourite band for many, many years and although this mix is quite enjoyable, particularly in places, the source tracks sound somewhat distant and in need of a bit (well, actually quite a lot) of a clean-up. Maybe I've been spoiled by the quality of recent re-releases of old material but this just doesn't sound anything like as crisp as I would like it. To be fair it has a number of redeeming qualities; the mix is quite tasteful and not gimmicky. There's some dynamic range compression but not too much and last but by no means least it's classic yes in surround sound. They really should do the rest of the catalogue (and re-do this) to the quality that we know is possible and that it deserves. For me it's somewhere between a 6 and a 7 and I'll give it a 7 just because I like Yes so much.

Not the biggest Yes fan, but the mix is jaw dropping. Chris Squire has definitely caught the ear of The Strokes bassist. Still sometimes the music coalesces together into something quite magical, and sometimes it sounds like a bunch of virtuosos wanking away.

Mix/Sonics.: 10
Music: 7

Compressed with muddy sounding vocals, bass too high in center channel BUT the music is sublime! Damn this is a good album! SW please remix this baby.

keenly said:

Damn this is a good album! SW please remix this baby.

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I've been looking at this on fleabay and keep thinking the same thing. Sign me up when it happens!

The next SW Yes remix will be Fragile.

An OK mix but it lacks the feel, energy and cohesion of the original. I doubt I'll return to it much once the SW mix is released. 7

A definite 10. I thought I had voted on this before, but I didn't. Great music and mix. Love it.

Now here's a thing. When I voted for this many years ago I gave it a 10. At the time, on the system I was using then it did have a certain exciting quality, but was it really a 10? Listening now and comparing it with the recent Steven Wilson mix on BluRay shows that this is nothing like a 10, perhaps a 6 or 7. The game has moved on and the quality of surround mixes has taken a huge step forward. I wonder if all the 10s that are being awarded to recent mixes will be shown to be just a step towards something even better?

IanProudfoot said:

Now here's a thing. When I voted for this many years ago I gave it a 10. At the time, on the system I was using then it did have a certain exciting quality, but was it really a 10? Listening now and comparing it with the recent Steven Wilson mix on BluRay shows that this is nothing like a 10, perhaps a 6 or 7. The game has moved on and the quality of surround mixes has taken a huge step forward. I wonder if all the 10s that are being awarded to recent mixes will be shown to be just a step towards something even better?

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Thanks for such a great post! Brilliantly said.! :upthumb

I'm in exactly the same boat as you, I gave it a "10" yonks ago and since then as you say the game has changed with the advent of the Steven Wilson remix era.

So in that context and with the wonderful gift of hindsight I would probably give this a "7" or possibly nudge a low "8" now.. and the new SW remix an unequivocal "10" (I'd give the new Fragile 5.1 "11" out of "10" if I could because it really does "go to 11".. you can crank the new disc, unlike the first 5.1 attempt.. )

fredblue said:

So in that context and with the wonderful gift of hindsight I would probably give this a "7" or possibly nudge a low "8" now.. and the new SW remix an unequivocal "10" (I'd give the new Fragile 5.1 "11" out of "10" if I could because it really does "go to 11".. you can crank the new disc, unlike the first 5.1 attempt.. )

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I agree too but Mr B I see that you haven't yet voted on the new SW Fragile!! Now how do we get more people to vote in the QQ polls...?? :spot

colsky said:

I agree too but Mr B I see that you haven't yet voted on the new SW Fragile!! Now how do we get more people to vote in the QQ polls...?? :spot

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HAHAHAHA..!!! Nice one!!! I will go and vote an "11" now..
(You got me, maaan.. you got me.. that was a tasty spoon of my own medicine.. )

This is one of those 5.1s that makes me wonder if my head's on right. I listened to the 2002 DVDA mix from the 2015 SW bluray and it's... really terrible. The reverb, it's like Yes, Live from the well in your backyard. So much reverb, and the only things on Roundabout that make it to the rears are some keyboard bits. Extended stereo? Totally! It gets a bit better as it goes on with South Side and such, but meh. Deserves a 3 IMO, because the horrific mix job on the 5.1 actively hurts the album which is itself pretty good. Sound quality is bad too, which is weird. 2015 SW 5.1 Fragile sounds good on my system, my 1972 Fragile LP sounds good on my system, and Close to the Edge(both old LP and 2013 Blu) does too...