HiRez Poll John, Elton - TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION [SACD]

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Rate the SACD of Elton John - TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION

  • 10: A Classic Disc - A must have!

    Votes: 101 63.5%

  • 9:

    Votes: 38 23.9%

  • 8:

    Votes: 19 11.9%

  • 7:

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 6:

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 5:

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 4:

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 3:

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 2: Forget it, Get the CD

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 1: Waste of plastic

    Votes: 1 0.6%
  • Total voters
    159
I have never been an Elton John fan (and that is being very diplomatic), but I am a huge fan of the late Mick Ronson. I picked this one up because he plays on the Madman Across the Water tune, and it is fantastic. I listened a few times on my stereo-only Pioneer PD-D9Mk2, and the sound quality was excellent.

I just picked up a used Oppo BDP-83 for my bedroom system, and I listened to the disk in surround sound for the first time. They should all be this good. I gave it a 10 ... but I am not sure that I will pick up any more Elton disks. I can't imagine who would have given this a 1 ... no wait, I think I know.

I only wish that Bob Dylan's Hard Rain had been released on SACD, since Ronson plays on that disk as well.
 
Quadzilla said:
I have never been an Elton John fan (and that is being very diplomatic), but I am a huge fan of the late Mick Ronson. I picked this one up because he plays on the Madman Across the Water tune, and it is fantastic. I listened a few times on my stereo-only Pioneer PD-D9Mk2, and the sound quality was excellent.

I just picked up a used Oppo BDP-83 for my bedroom system, and I listened to the disk in surround sound for the first time. They should all be this good. I gave it a 10 ... but I am not sure that I will pick up any more Elton disks. I can't imagine who would have given this a 1 ... no wait, I think I know.

I only wish that Bob Dylan's Hard Rain had been released on SACD, since Ronson plays on that disk as well.
Click to expand...

even if you're not into Elton, if you're into surround music all the SACDs of his are must-have's.

the 5.1 mixes of his classic albums are incredible.

as you say, "they should all be this good", which pretty much sums up my feelings too.

Yellow Brick Road is a bit bright sounding (though its always veered towards that kind of sound) but the 5.1 of it is still superb and the other albums are even better, Honky Chateau and Captain Fantastic are surround nirvana.
 
fredblue said:
even if you're not into Elton, if you're into surround music all the SACDs of his are must-have's.

the 5.1 mixes of his classic albums are incredible.

as you say, "they should all be this good", which pretty much sums up my feelings too.

Yellow Brick Road is a bit bright sounding (though its always veered towards that kind of sound) but the 5.1 of it is still superb and the other albums are even better, Honky Chateau and Captain Fantastic are surround nirvana.
Click to expand...
Are all the 5.1 EJ's mixed by Greg Penny? I only ask because I read somewhere on QQ forums that the 5.1 EJ's mixed by Greg Penny were the best which made me think that there might be others that are not mixed by GP.
 
wavelength said:
Are all the 5.1 EJ's mixed by Greg Penny? I only ask because I read somewhere on QQ forums that the 5.1 EJ's mixed by Greg Penny were the best which made me think that there might be others that are not mixed by GP.
Click to expand...

the Peachtree Road sacd is the lone exception, mixed by Matt Still, who engineered (and I'd heard also co-produced) that album.

it's not at all bad in surround, it just pales in comparison to the classic 70's albums and Greg Penny mixes.
 
I wonder if the lone "1" score here might be considered for review? Would it be a big hassle to do? :eek:

Seems a bit out of place in amongst the 77 other "8", "9" and "10" ratings.

41 "10" scores kinda makes that solitary "1" (by a member who rated it so low cos they didn't care for the artist) even more jarring, I reckon.
 
fredblue said:
I wonder if the lone "1" score here might be considered for review? Would it be a big hassle to do? :eek:

Seems a bit out of place in amongst the 77 other "8", "9" and "10" ratings.

41 "10" scores kinda makes that solitary "1" (by a member who rated it so low cos they didn't care for the artist) even more jarring, I reckon.
Click to expand...

The single '1' vote is from a member who has been a member since 2002. And, although he has not logged in for some time, it is only fair that his vote remains. The SQL formula that I use for the poll tabulation was developed for me by Cai Campbell and takes into account votes like this, as an "Outlier". If you look at the HiRez Poll results page, you will see a column with this information.

I do not want to diminish the value of everyone's vote by hacking out votes that either don't fit the general opinion or that I or other members disagree with, no matter how odd they may seem. The only time I modified HiRez Poll votes is when a member obviously and spitefully executed a sabotage campaign to skew the votes of a certain genre with malicious intent. Even though the outlier formula would have adjusted for those votes, it was so blatant and so obvious that I had to take action. This is also why all of the HiRez Poll voting is now public.

We all have our opinions, and the '1' selection is there to be used if a member feels the need and feels strongly about it. Hey, I don't think Tumbleweed Connection is a '1', no way, but I have to give 'Scottmoose' his due, and if that's what he thinks, so be it.

I hope you all can appreciate this approach.
 
Only one voting option (10) contained "must have", which I think all the 70's 5.1 EJ SACDs are. Simply must have. So I voted 10.

This type of mixing proves that any music would be improved in 5.1. It makes for a much more intimate performance along with providing a new level of clarity.

Looks like EJ is no fan of surround so this may be why the missing EJ 70's 5.1 mixes still haven't been released. But it is wonderful to have most of his stuff. Yellow Brick Road & Capt. Fantastic are my favs by far.
 
Scottmoose said:
Oh dear. I'll get this out the way quickly: if you like EJ, then buy away (probably). The packaging is first rate, the DSD transfer is superb, and the mix is creative.
But I don't like EJ. The most middle-of the road artist in history to my ears. Boring.
Click to expand...

This is an unfair assessment of the disc and the mix itself and a totally unreasonable basis for a "1" vote from everything I've gleaned in the last fee years of the ethos of QQ Polls.

If I were to be unkind I'd say it's complete bullshit but then what's the use, its just a vote, we're all entitled to our opinion, Cai's system allows for this kind of nonsense "1" so it doesn't skew the Poll outcomes.. etc.

I could only even conceive rating a disc on QQ a "1" if I absolutely hated it in every respect that's relevant to the QQ Poll scores. So far (some 1,000+ surround mixes in, I might add) I've yet to find one solitary disc so utterly worthless that it would warrant a "1" in my eyes, even the biggest piles of crap have at least some merit that might give it say a "2"/"3", i.e. a poor surround mix, poor fidelity, ok music, gotta be a "2"-"3".. ah so what! blah :p
 
DennisMoore Jr. said:
Only one voting option (10) contained "must have", which I think all the 70's 5.1 EJ SACDs are. Simply must have. So I voted 10.

This type of mixing proves that any music would be improved in 5.1. It makes for a much more intimate performance along with providing a new level of clarity.

Looks like EJ is no fan of surround so this may be why the missing EJ 70's 5.1 mixes still haven't been released. But it is wonderful to have most of his stuff. Yellow Brick Road & Capt. Fantastic are my favs by far.
Click to expand...

Totally agree with you on all points Dennis! Hear hear! (y)

Tho I don't think its that he's not a fan, Greg Penny recounted that Elton was very enthusiastic from Day 1 of the surround remix "experiment", telling Greg to do GYBR after hearing one song remixed into 5.1 from the "Made In England" album and then after hearing Greg's mix he told him to do "the lot".. and even after the 1st batch had been and gone Elton said he loves GP's 5.1 mixes cos "its like looking in the mirror" having his vocals hard in the centre channel.

ah well.. maybe the 2nd batch of Don't Shoot Me, Westies, Blue Moves & Caribou will never happen..(such a shame).. but at least the mixes that did make it out are all worthy of 8's, 9's and 10's in the overwhelming opinion on this forum dedicated to surround music by people making a rational considered opinion and then voting reasonably and fairly.
 
JonUrban said:
The single '1' vote is from a member who has been a member since 2002. And, although he has not logged in for some time, it is only fair that his vote remains. The SQL formula that I use for the poll tabulation was developed for me by Cai Campbell and takes into account votes like this, as an "Outlier". If you look at the HiRez Poll results page, you will see a column with this information.

I do not want to diminish the value of everyone's vote by hacking out votes that either don't fit the general opinion or that I or other members disagree with, no matter how odd they may seem. The only time I modified HiRez Poll votes is when a member obviously and spitefully executed a sabotage campaign to skew the votes of a certain genre with malicious intent. Even though the outlier formula would have adjusted for those votes, it was so blatant and so obvious that I had to take action. This is also why all of the HiRez Poll voting is now public.

We all have our opinions, and the '1' selection is there to be used if a member feels the need and feels strongly about it. Hey, I don't think Tumbleweed Connection is a '1', no way, but I have to give 'Scottmoose' his due, and if that's what he thinks, so be it.

I hope you all can appreciate this approach.
Click to expand...

Thank you for taking the time and trouble to respond Jon.

While I respect your standpoint I don't agree with that member's reasoning for voting "1" in this particular instance.. but its all good, I appreciate that you care enough to think it all through to that degree, you certainly don't owe me any explanation as to why it was allowed, it just surprised me, that's all :) Peace out (y)
 
fredblue said:
Totally agree with you on all points Dennis! Hear hear! (y)

Tho I don't think its that he's not a fan, Greg Penny recounted that Elton was very enthusiastic from Day 1 of the surround remix "experiment", telling Greg to do GYBR after hearing one song remixed into 5.1 from the "Made In England" album and then after hearing Greg's mix he told him to do "the lot".. and even after the 1st batch had been and gone Elton said he loves GP's 5.1 mixes cos "its like looking in the mirror" having his vocals hard in the centre channel.

ah well.. maybe the 2nd batch of Don't Shoot Me, Westies, Blue Moves & Caribou will never happen..(such a shame).. but at least the mixes that did make it out are all worthy of 8's, 9's and 10's in the overwhelming opinion on this forum dedicated to surround music by people making a rational considered opinion and then voting reasonably and fairly.
Click to expand...

Hello m8, :)

Thanks for the additional info. about Elton & the mixes. EJ is such a huge world-wide artist, I would think logically the missing 5.1 mixes would have to come out sooner than later. Rock Of The Westies is the one I await the most.

I do think it was good form and entirely needed to call attention to the chap who gave a vote of "1". Like you said even a horrible mix should rate higher. And there would be no reasonable case to be made(other than just sheer spite) that the spectatular work that was done on Elton's classic mixes deserved such a "bitch slapping".:mad:@: If one doesn't like the artist fine, but it was a considerable piece of engineering to come up with that 5.1 SACD and it should not be dragged through the refuse like that. Just my $.02 or one shilling!

Further, when a complete gentleman(like yourself) who is always positive around here points something out as a bit outside the lines...well I say it is a fair call.

I hope we get the remaining 5.1 EJ mixes sooner than later. Cheers!
 
As for meself, played this one the other night, still love it to death: album and mix. And pretty confident, too, for a third album. Great lyrics and imagery by Bernie, and the young Reg really dug into them. Maybe you have to be older, and American, to understand what is really going on here (though I think most of it would translate well anywhere, and is far from 'boring' by any stretch).


ED :)
 
"Tumbleweed Connection" sports a fine mix by Greg Penny. As with all the Elton John SACDs the audio is a bit on the loud side, but it still has decent dynamics and is quite listenable. "Tumbleweed" has held up well musically over the decades and the Western-themed lyrics are among Bernie Taupin's best. It's also probably Elton John's best album; it's certainly my favorite. I can't bring myself to give less than 9 points to this wonderful set of cuts.
 
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