HiRez Poll Guess Who, The - ROAD FOOD & #10 [SACD]

[rtbluray]

Please post your thoughts and comments on this 2018 Multichannel SACD release from Dutton Vocalion of the two classic albums "Road Food" and "#10" by The Guess Who.
This Multichannel SACD release contains the Quadraphonic mixes of both albums, available commercially for the first time since the 1970s!
Both Quadraphonic mixes are also available to stream in Dolby Audio via Apple Music:
https://music.apple.com/us/album/10-2003-remastered/292664821https://music.apple.com/us/album/road-food-2003-remastered/292664592


Road Food
LP APL1 0405 (1974) STEREO/APD1 0405 QUADRAPHONIC
1: STAR BABY (Cummings)
2: ATTILA’S BLUES (Cummings; Wallace; Winter; McDougall; Peterson)
3: STRAIGHTEN OUT (Cummings; Wallace)
4: DON’T YOU WANT ME (Cummings)
5: ONE WAY ROAD TO HELL (Cummings; Wallace)
6: CLAP FOR THE WOLFMAN (Cummings; Wallace; Winter)
7: PLEASIN’ FOR REASON (Cummings; McDougall)
8: ROAD FOOD (Cummings; Wallace)
9: BALLAD OF THE LAST FIVE YEARS (Cummings)
Arrangers: Allan Macmillan [4], Ben McPeek [9]

#10
LP APL1 0130 (1973) STEREO/APD1 0130 QUADRAPHONIC
10: TAKE IT OFF MY SHOULDERS (Cummings; McDougall)
11: MUSICIONÉ (Cummings; Winter; Wallace; McDougall; Peterson)
12: MISS FRIZZY (Cummings; Bachman)
13: GLAMOUR BOY (Cummings)
14: SELF PITY (Cummings)
15: LIE DOWN (Cummings)
16: CARDBOARD EMPIRE (Wallace; Winter)
17: JUST LET ME SING (Cummings)
Arrangers: Allan Macmillan & Burton Cummings [13, 17]

Multi-ch Stereo
All tracks available in stereo and multi-channel

SA-CD
This hybrid CD can be played on any standard CD players

CDSML8538

 

[oxenholme]

Not difficult.

Sound: stunning
Music: stunning
Mix: stunning

10

 

[key_wiz]

I gave this a “7”. Need to be a bit realistic here. I know we are all thrilled to get just about ANYthing in surround these days. And are all VERY appreciative of the stuff coming from DV. And the two-fers are a great value, but these AREN’T the Guess Who’s best work by a pretty long shot. The quad mixes are very good. The overall fidelity average for the mid 70s. There’s some nice tracks here, but a good amount of what I’d call filler.

So while it’s tempting to give everything a “9” or “10” these days, I’d be doing those releases I think are TRULY deserving a disservice by putting this one up there too.

Great liner notes by Dave once again!

Why the decision to put them in reverse chronological order, I wonder? Because “Road Food” was the bigger hit? Obviously not that important, just noteworthy.

But keep ‘em coming, DV! I’ll keep buying the rock/pop stuff for sure!

 

[mam]

I think in it`s quality it`s very fluctuating. Sometimes good, sometimes quiet badly like the song "glamour boy" - too strong out of the rears. Some songs like "cardboard empire" i will give a 9 but "glamour boy" ohhh my god .... only a three. Points are especially for the quadro sound.

 

[leevitalone1]

70's. what a time. Too bad about having to use tape as a medium. My very 1st CD's I remember you could hear when the tape started rolling on the cut on the cd. You would hear an very audible hiss. It was a cheapo cd player, but my buddy got a Sony and we still heard it. There was lots a really good stuff ruined by poor engineering and shitty equipment - shit in-shit out. dam shame!!

 

[fredblue]

70's. what a time. Too bad about having to use tape as a medium. My very 1st CD's I remember you could hear when the tape started rolling on the cut on the cd. You would hear an very audible hiss. It was a cheapo cd player, but my buddy got a Sony and we still heard it. There was lots a really good stuff ruined by poor engineering and shitty equipment - shit in-shit out. dam shame!!

what poor engineering?
this disc sounds great to me!
#10 sounds better to me than Road Food but certainly not “shit in-shit out” by any stretch..

 

[steelydave]

70's. what a time. Too bad about having to use tape as a medium. My very 1st CD's I remember you could hear when the tape started rolling on the cut on the cd. You would hear an very audible hiss. It was a cheapo cd player, but my buddy got a Sony and we still heard it. There was lots a really good stuff ruined by poor engineering and shitty equipment - shit in-shit out. dam shame!!

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

Not sure if you're talking about this disc in particular, or just sharing a 30-year-old anecdote about CD's or what, but there are still plenty of studios that use the same 2" 24-track tape machines from the 70's and 80's, vintage mics from the 50's and 60s, old mixing boards, etc. etc. RCA were one of the pioneers in sound recording technology, I'd hardly call their engineers (especially Brian Christian, who recorded more classic albums than the day is long) or their facilities "poor" or "shitty".

 

[leevitalone1]

what poor engineering?
this disc sounds great to me!
#10 sounds better to me than Road Food but certainly not “shit in-shit out” by any stretch..

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

Not sure if you're talking about this disc in particular, or just sharing a 30-year-old anecdote about CD's or what, but there are still plenty of studios that use the same 2" 24-track tape machines from the 70's and 80's, vintage mics from the 50's and 60s, old mixing boards, etc. etc. RCA were one of the pioneers in sound recording technology, I'd hardly call their engineers (especially Brian Christian, who recorded more classic albums than the day is long) or their facilities "poor" or "shitty".

Just generally speaking, not attacking this disc

 

[fredblue]

Just generally speaking, not attacking this disc

fair enough i agree there's poorly recorded but great music from the whole of the time since recording began, generally speaking.. yes there's definitely some shit sounding but still good stuff out there, which makes the QQ Polls so important as all the feedback and ratings members give here helps us separate the wheat from the chaff in that respect among other key things so we can make an informed decision when shopping for surround music.. yeay for the QQ guinea pigs!

 

[Q-Eight]

I guess now that we (including me) have the luxury of hearing this Quad album in it's best quality, I will agree that the Drums sound a bit thin on "Road Food". I don't think it has anything to do with the mix, but it's the unusual lack of any kind of echo or reverb on any drum piece that gives the drums a very dry sound and not much presence.

The drum sound coming out the rear channels on #10 help flesh out their sound a little more. Funny how I always overlook #10 as in my mind, it's the one with the wonky mix - but, I now have to say I prefer the mix on #10 almost more than "Road Food". #10 stays aggressively four-corner, (though, the piano does overpower on some songs) but that drum sound in the rears makes it sound like you're actually sitting in the studio. "Road Food" tends to leave rear channels quiet during some songs when there really was no need. "Star Baby" could have been mixed a little more aggressively with keyboard in front and guitar in back corners, not a little bit of everything everywhere.

I'm going to assume the master tapes for these albums are starting to fail. I'll have to have a second listen, but it was during the fade and silence between songs that I heard some audible tape noise, like a wrinkle or flutter.

Also, maybe it's just my car deck, but I've been finding some milliseconds are being cut off at the beginning of some songs, especially noticeable on the Rick Derringer and Guess Who titles.

 

[fac23]

I wasn't sure whether I should get this one, but am glad I did. #10: Great album, fantastic quad mix. Road Food isn't my cup overall, but has a nice quad mix anyway.

 

[Q-Eight]

Listened last night with my Quad headphones on and was able to pick up some more tape anomalies: at the end of "Don't you want me" from Road Food, there is some definite print-through happening at the end. It ends cold with a sharp piano blast and if you listen to the silence following, you can hear that same piano blast and Burton's vocal repeat three times.

Now, I'm not trying to knock Vocalion or Mr. Dutton in any way, shape or form. I'm merely pointing out what I hear. Matter of factly I'm very thankful these were done because it sounds to me like the tapes are beginning to deteriorate. So, best to get them out NOW versus later as their life expectancy is almost up.

I've also been noticing some mixing anomalies that are probably more entertaining than detracting. For instance, you can hear Wolfman Jack a bit clearer and you hear someone "Shhhhhh" him and the girls after the first verse. What I used to hear as him replying "no" to someone off-mic now sounds like he's got his hand over the mic and he's clearly saying "I know!".

During "Attilla's Blues", listen to the guitar in the back left channel. Hear the drums along with it? I'd bet money, this guitar was recorded during the initial tracking session; drums, bass, the one guitar and possibly Burton's keyboard. However, following the solo, the drum sound all but disappears. Must've used a different take or overdub for that section as the drum sound vanishes.

During "Glamour Boy", listen to the back channels. After the chat with Mr. McDougal, you can actually hear the tape "start" and come up to speed for the various crowd noises. It happens TWICE. I would imagine the crowd noise was probably dubbed onto the multitrack from another machine using a tape of crowd noises. But rather than "pot up" those two-to-four tracks, for the Quad mixing session, those tracks were left open so you hear the tape start! Very interesting.


I dunno about you guys, but I'm fascinated by this stuff. I mean, sure I'm versed with the older technology as well as the more modern stuff.... but these engineers were really flying blind! They had no luxury of having a visual interpretation of the sounds they were playing with! When I mix, I can visually see where I may have an errant noise or click, pop, hum.... whatever.

Man, these old timers had a set of big VU meters and a set of earphones and had to rely on tracking session notes. If there were no notes, you were on your own!! No wonder there's a plethora of mistakes in all our Quad goodies!

 

[Jim the Oldbie]

Hee! This reminds me of reading that amazing book, Beatles Recording Sessions, with my stack of CDs on the arm of the chair, listening with headphones to all the great little studio anomalies described therein. I like this stuff a lot too.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Listened last night with my Quad headphones on and was able to pick up some more tape anomalies: at the end of "Don't you want me" from Road Food, there is some definite print-through happening at the end. It ends cold with a sharp piano blast and if you listen to the silence following, you can hear that same piano blast and Burton's vocal repeat three times.

Now, I'm not trying to knock Vocalion or Mr. Dutton in any way, shape or form. I'm merely pointing out what I hear. Matter of factly I'm very thankful these were done because it sounds to me like the tapes are beginning to deteriorate. So, best to get them out NOW versus later as their life expectancy is almost up.

I've also been noticing some mixing anomalies that are probably more entertaining than detracting. For instance, you can hear Wolfman Jack a bit clearer and you hear someone "Shhhhhh" him and the girls after the first verse. What I used to hear as him replying "no" to someone off-mic now sounds like he's got his hand over the mic and he's clearly saying "I know!".

During "Attilla's Blues", listen to the guitar in the back left channel. Hear the drums along with it? I'd bet money, this guitar was recorded during the initial tracking session; drums, bass, the one guitar and possibly Burton's keyboard. However, following the solo, the drum sound all but disappears. Must've used a different take or overdub for that section as the drum sound vanishes.

During "Glamour Boy", listen to the back channels. After the chat with Mr. McDougal, you can actually hear the tape "start" and come up to speed for the various crowd noises. It happens TWICE. I would imagine the crowd noise was probably dubbed onto the multitrack from another machine using a tape of crowd noises. But rather than "pot up" those two-to-four tracks, for the Quad mixing session, those tracks were left open so you hear the tape start! Very interesting.


I dunno about you guys, but I'm fascinated by this stuff. I mean, sure I'm versed with the older technology as well as the more modern stuff.... but these engineers were really flying blind! They had no luxury of having a visual interpretation of the sounds they were playing with! When I mix, I can visually see where I may have an errant noise or click, pop, hum.... whatever.

Man, these old timers had a set of big VU meters and a set of earphones and had to rely on tracking session notes. If there were no notes, you were on your own!! No wonder there's a plethora of mistakes in all our Quad goodies!

One of the QUIRKS of Magnetic Tape is, unfortunately, PRINT THROUGH. As Open Reel collectors, we were always told to play or fast forward/rewind these tapes, at the very least once a year, to PREVENT print through.

It has nothing to do with D~V. It has to do with the majors who I'm sure have NOT tended to their Open Reel Masters [which should be MORE of an incentive to liberate them from their musty vaults].

I've also heard print through from some of HDTT's transfers.

Actually, it would be a full time job to hire someone to play these masters from time to time but then of course there remains the risk of damaging these tapes during the playback/rewind/fast forward process, most especially when splices are involved!

And it's also imperative that these Master Reels be transferred to a digital medium ASAP. And one can only wonder how many Master Tapes are unusable due to 'rampant' print through or oxide deterioration...or BOTH...probably in the mega~thousands!

 

[Scott65]

One of the QUIRKS of Magnetic Tape is, unfortunately, PRINT THROUGH. As Open Reel collectors, we were always told to play or fast forward/rewind these tapes, at the very least once a year, to PREVENT print through.

It has nothing to do with D~V. It has to do with the majors who I'm sure have NOT tended to their Open Reel Masters [which should be MORE of an incentive to liberate them from their musty vaults].

I've also heard print through from some of HDTT's transfers.

Actually, it would be a full time job to hire someone to play these masters from time to time but then of course there remains the risk of damaging these tapes during the playback/rewind/fast forward process, most especially when splices are involved!

And it's also imperative that these Master Reels be transferred to a digital medium ASAP. And one can only wonder how many Master Tapes are unusable due to 'rampant' print through or oxide deterioration...or BOTH...probably in the mega~thousands!

when they remixed Bohemian Rhapsody into 5.1 they had to bake the master tapes
https://www.soundonsound.com/people/queen-night-opera

 

[JediJoker]

when they remixed Bohemian Rhapsody into 5.1 they had to bake the master tapes
https://www.soundonsound.com/people/queen-night-opera

Almost any master tapes from the '70s, whether completed mixes or multitracks, require baking before playback/transfer due to failing bonding agents that respond positively to heat.

 

[sjcorne]

when they remixed Bohemian Rhapsody into 5.1 they had to bake the master tapes
https://www.soundonsound.com/people/queen-night-opera

What a fascinating read! Thanks for posting. I know they did a similar article about the mixing of Steely Dan's Everything Must Go.

 

[Jim the Oldbie]

Yup - Remember how Andy Partridge kept us in suspense on Twitter while Oranges and Lemons was in the oven? That boy has a flair for the drama, heh.

 

[ClarkNovak]

I am very glad to have this. "Road Food" is the last great Guess Who album. Burton Cummings and the group had come to the end of their ability to co-operate. Cummings was prepping for his own solo career, and his writing on "Road Food" was a precursor of the sound he'd use on his own. "Star Baby", "Road Food" and of course "Clap For The Wolfman" were great tracks, and the rest of the album was solid as well. "#10", on the other hand, was made up primarily of leftovers and had about much imagination, musically, as the album's title implies. Interestingly, the best song on the record IMO was "Miss Frizzy", a collaboration between Cummings and Randy Bachman that someone found in the vault. Other than that, the album is lackluster or downright confusing, as Burton does his lyrical Nautilus thing.

The transfer and mastering is as great as I've come to expect from Dutton, and the mix is, as most RCA quad issues were, very discrete.
Sonics: 10
Road Food: 9
#10: 6
Total vote: 8

 

[quicksrt]

I'm not sold on the musical merits of either album. However there are three hits here that I really like. The sound quality is nice, quad is wonderful.

I'm leaning on a 7.5 due to filler material. Or rounding down to a 7 because there are so many 8, 9, and 10s that also sound great but have more consistent material. This is not Best of Vol 2 that's fer sure.