Switched on (QS) Surround

QuadraphonicQuad

Help Support QuadraphonicQuad:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Bill Brent

300 Club - QQ All-Star
Joined
Apr 13, 2004
Messages
354
Tonight at 10pm (NYC time) - an LP Lounge event. two masters of Electronic music - Wendy Carlos and Suzanne Ciani. The Carlos masterpiece (Switched on Bach) is taken from a private CD-4 test pressing which included Carlos' "Country Lane" it's been demodulated, then encoded for QS - Ciani's "Quadraphonic Live" is a QS encoded vinyl LP that was released in limited numbers (227 actually) - a little over a year ago. so relax, and get your ears on (all 4 of them)
http://radiomaxmusic.com/popup.html
switched on.jpg
 
Tonight at 10pm (NYC time) - an LP Lounge event. two masters of Electronic music - Wendy Carlos and Suzanne Ciani. The Carlos masterpiece (Switched on Bach) is taken from a private CD-4 test pressing which included Carlos' "Country Lane" it's been demodulated, then encoded for QS - Ciani's "Quadraphonic Live" is a QS encoded vinyl LP that was released in limited numbers (227 actually) - a little over a year ago. so relax, and get your ears on (all 4 of them)
http://radiomaxmusic.com/popup.htmlView attachment 43636

I will (some what embarrassingly) admit I have always intended to listen to your podcast but never have. However Switched on Bach from CD-4 > QS I can resist. So thanks for keeping us posted!

Suzanne Cianni I already have from the discrete FLAC files she uploaded but it will be interesting to hear you discuss it. I'd like to point out that the album is not QS encoded it uses the Involve smart encode method. Yes it will play back fine on QS gear but really the new Involve encode is so different & advanced it shouldn't be lumped in as just another QS encoder. If the show isn't already recorded, perhaps you could make that distinction.

I have never used RadioMax before. There is the pop up player that's a no brainer but do I need a premium acct to get the higher bit rate?
 
hi

i believe if you go to the website you have a choice of bit-rates.
i do mention it comes with the involve, which i suggest - had it existed in the 70s, quad would still be here and the format wars would have ended quickly. - their decoder is simply amazing. I don't know that their encoder has the magic - I only say this because I've done a lot of test recordings with standard QS encoders - and run them through the involve decoder with startling results. I don't know how much better it could get - however - I have to plead ignorance as I do not have an involve encoder.
thanks
 
Hi All

Sonik Wiz is correct, The Suzanne Ciani quadraphonic live was in fact recorded in Involve format. At the time it was being produced and conceptualized we gave them our evaluation module encoder (see attachment), it had 2 modes of straight QS encode and the other was Involve mode and we asked them to play with the switch (not telling what modes were happening). The evaluated the performance of both modes in terms of the resultant stereo encode stream and the resultant 4 channel decode. We did not know which mode they chose until we had a close look at the actual stereo file - it was definitely Involve mode!

Involve mode does not suffer from the old QS/ RM issue of compression of the left / right stereo image due to poor separation. It is in fact the first triband vario matrix encoder that uses many psycho-acoustic parameters to adjust the matrix on the fly to optomise both the stereo stream and quad stream - we have 2 patents covering it.

Unfortunately the publicity boys screwed up the message and incorrectly said it was QS/ RM. We actually informed Suzanne Ciani on her recent visit to our factory that it was recorded in Involve format.

The evaluation modules are still available and the decoder supplied in the Suzanne Ciani record was similar to the evaluation decoder. We will shortly release the studio recorder software plugin for Involve format encode (It might even be free software??????)

Regards

Chucky
 

Attachments

  • Involve Audio - Involve Encode.pdf
    627.9 KB · Views: 139
  • Involve evaluation module press release_V1.4(1).pdf
    725.5 KB · Views: 155
the circuit board supplied with the LP makes the old QS recordings, as well as the test tracks I've created
measure (and more importantly sound) like real quadraphonic. so my question - if the decoder supplied
is meant for the involve specific encoded material - why does it do such a good job with straight QS?

BTW - I had 16k listeners last night with 97% retention - the few comments I've received have been
very positive.

I should mention that while I play matrix quad nearly every week (often its qs encodes of discrete material)
there remains confusion about quad over the air. Even after more than a year with this show, I still get
the same questions. I'm afraid I'd confuse my listeners if I started talking about the involve system.
The show is about playing LPs (The addition of quad was something I wanted to do, not a suggestion
of the program director)

On my own station I can play anything, and have started a nightly "surround hour" - the only (self-imposed)
restriction is the music format is eazy listening (including Jazz, Classical, Vocals and Broadway and Hollywood).
 
Hi Bill, can I ask how you acquired the CD4 test pressing of Wendy Carlos? I assumed that the only existing copy left was her personal copy. I am not equipped to listen to internet streaming. Is there a way to download the show?
 
if the decoder supplied
is meant for the involve specific encoded material - why does it do such a good job with straight QS?

Chucky of course can reply to this with so much detail your brain will bleed. My answer is that the Surround Master is pretty much a 21st century QSD-1. It owes more to QS legacy than the encoder. The SM is a brilliant updating of original design. It is intended to work with QS or Involve encoding & the latter is where the real departure from Sansui techniques exist.

In Sansui encodeing it is single band fixed encoding coefficients of .4142 or ~ -7dB between chs. As stated in Chucky's previous note the Involve encoder works variably over three independent frequency bands. It checks the separation & direction of the inputted discrete sound & adjusts the matrix blend from a max of -7dB to much less. So this gives an encoded output that has all the directional encoding perfect for a Surround Master or other QS decoder, but also has audibly wider separation to a listener as in a stereo record. Best of both worlds.

I really enjoyed the show last night! I'm sorry I haven't tuned in to other shows of yours. I recorded on my upstairs PC & will listen to again on my SM downstairs tonight. Back in '72 Switched on Bach stereo played back via Hafler set up was my 1st exposure to surround sound sound. I picked a good one to start with; it blew me away. I have the SQ LP somewhere but I can't find it so your slection was a real treat.

What is your other channel you podcast from with more frequent playing of quad?
 
Hi Bill, can I ask how you acquired the CD4 test pressing of Wendy Carlos? I assumed that the only existing copy left was her personal copy. I am not equipped to listen to internet streaming. Is there a way to download the show?

she (actually at the time 46 years ago, he) gave it to me. back then you could call people on the phone,
and they'd invite you over. we spent a good deal of time talking about the different approached to quad (including speaker placement) and I left with two laquers - 1 is essentially SoB+country Lane - the other was 30 minutes of Sonic Seasonings (these are not pre33ssings in the strict sense of the word) - In those days JVC was located in Queens and I had pushed my way into a lot of doors. - got to spend time with Dr. Bauer as well - fun days. -
I can post the SoB part of the show, but would not feel comfortable sharing the Quad/live portion, as you can still buy the surround version of that.
 
Chucky of course can reply to this with so much detail your brain will bleed. My answer is that the Surround Master is pretty much a 21st century QSD-1. It owes more to QS legacy than the encoder. The SM is a brilliant updating of original design. It is intended to work with QS or Involve encoding & the latter is where the real departure from Sansui techniques exist.

In Sansui encodeing it is single band fixed encoding coefficients of .4142 or ~ -7dB between chs. As stated in Chucky's previous note the Involve encoder works variably over three independent frequency bands. It checks the separation & direction of the inputted discrete sound & adjusts the matrix blend from a max of -7dB to much less. So this gives an encoded output that has all the directional encoding perfect for a Surround Master or other QS decoder, but also has audibly wider separation to a listener as in a stereo record. Best of both worlds.

I really enjoyed the show last night! I'm sorry I haven't tuned in to other shows of yours. I recorded on my upstairs PC & will listen to again on my SM downstairs tonight. Back in '72 Switched on Bach stereo played back via Hafler set up was my 1st exposure to surround sound sound. I picked a good one to start with; it blew me away. I have the SQ LP somewhere but I can't find it so your slection was a real treat.

What is your other channel you podcast from with more frequent playing of quad?

I play an hour of EZ listening every night at 8pm (NYC time) on my EZMax station - for example tonight I'm playins an hour of vocals (Johnny Mathis & Barbara Streisand in SQ and Bary Manilow and Gordon Lightfoot in QS) http://radiomaxmusic.com/ezmaxpop.html

thanks for listening
 
she (actually at the time 46 years ago, he) gave it to me. back then you could call people on the phone,
and they'd invite you over. we spent a good deal of time talking about the different approached to quad (including speaker placement) and I left with two laquers - 1 is essentially SoB...
You are a lucky guy!

In the mix identical to the Q8's?
 
I play an hour of EZ listening every night at 8pm (NYC time) on my EZMax station - for example tonight I'm playins an hour of vocals (Johnny Mathis & Barbara Streisand in SQ and Bary Manilow and Gordon Lightfoot in QS) http://radiomaxmusic.com/ezmaxpop.html

thanks for listening
Hmmm, I've got a stereo out of my computer's sound card to an RCA to my Surround Master v2, will probably work that way :unsure:
Thanks Bill, should be interesting! (*5pm West Coast then)
 
I have to admit that I am jealous that you got to meet Wendy/Walter. She was my introduction to electronic music. She is a smart person with a huge knowledge of music that I can not even aspire to be. I wish she would keep up on her website and find ways to continue distributing her musical legacy. I hope she is still alive and well.
 
I have to admit that I am jealous that you got to meet Wendy/Walter. She was my introduction to electronic music. She is a smart person with a huge knowledge of music that I can not even aspire to be. I wish she would keep up on her website and find ways to continue distributing her musical legacy. I hope she is still alive and well.
very much alive - check out her website
 
she (actually at the time 46 years ago, he) gave it to me. back then you could call people on the phone,
and they'd invite you over. we spent a good deal of time talking about the different approached to quad (including speaker placement) and I left with two laquers - 1 is essentially SoB+country Lane - the other was 30 minutes of Sonic Seasonings (these are not pre33ssings in the strict sense of the word) - In those days JVC was located in Queens and I had pushed my way into a lot of doors. - got to spend time with Dr. Bauer as well - fun days. -
I can post the SoB part of the show, but would not feel comfortable sharing the Quad/live portion, as you can still buy the surround version of that.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z7m97bjencvdj1n/LP Lounge s02e18 Switched On Surround (1 of 2).wav?dl=0
 
Last edited:
Back
Top