paypal- shipping item-funds

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8trackman

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2010
Messages
212
hello everyone quick question

recently purchased something off eBay, and the seller mentioned that as a new eBayer they will have to wait 1-2 weeks for the funds to clear from paypal

I have no reason to doubt the seller, just I have never had anyone tell me this before

I went to Paypal website itself and it take 21 days for funds to clear for new sellers!!!!

don't you only have a 30 day window to open a dispute? (i.e 9 days to ship......this is unfair for people selling stuff across borders, its taken awhile for me to get stuff)
 
Yes, Paypal can HOLD funds for up to three weeks until clearing them for inclusion in your (seller's) account, but since the buyer has paid for the item, the seller is supposed to ship fairly quickly. My wife has occasionally had that happen, but since she's only waiting for the money to clear (she will always get it, usually within a week, as she sells sporadically) she mails packages out as soon as she can. But a seller is not supposed to wait until they have access to the money to send the package, that ain't the way it works, and they're asking for bad feedback and other hassles if they do. If a seller has a beef about how long it takes to get funds into their own account (as opposed to their Paypal account), well, not a lot they can do.

ED :)
 
the seller is making me wait until they get the funds from paypal

I can't pass judgement as I have never sold anything so I don't know what the process is like....its just annoying for both of us
 
the seller is making me wait until they get the funds from paypal

I can't pass judgement as I have never sold anything so I don't know what the process is like....its just annoying for both of us

Ok, let's go through this step by step:

Say I'm the buyer and you're the seller. You buy, send the funds through Paypal. But Paypal decides to hold the funds to ensure the transaction goes smoothly and your package arrives hassle-free. AFAIK, this is the way Paypal does business these days, period.

In order to unlock the funds you paid, you have to give ME (the seller) positive feedback, or several weeks must pass without any negative feedback (AFAIK).

As a seller, I'm obligated to send you the package promptly even though MY money is being held by Paypal, because I'll get the money sooner when you leave prompt, positive feedback. The problem with your scenario is that the seller, by holding your package, is going against the rules and just as bad (for them), delaying payment by withholding your package through no fault of your own. Either they're just plain ignorant OR they're trying to rip you off by waiting for your money to clear and then not send you anything. Which is very stupid and risky, since they could be banned for that kind of nonsense.

My advice: send the seller an e-mail explaining that it is in their best interest to send your package to you, since that is what they are supposed to do under the seller rules of eBay and, I believe, Paypal.

The point is this: you've paid, right? So the problem isn't with you, you've done your part. Your package should have been shipped within the time specified for that specific listing. These new Paypal rules can be confusing, so maybe this just a misunderstanding. But you need to inform them of the situation, they may not fully understand the 'new' rules.

ED :)
 
thanks for your help Ed!

found that eBay page stating there is a direct rule against this "If PayPal places a temporary hold on payments you receive for an item you sold, you're not allowed to hold shipment until the funds are released.Note that holding shipment may affect your detailed seller ratings and buyer satisfaction, which increases the chances of future PayPal payments being held" http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-practices.html

so I have sent a message to the seller, to please send me the unit with a tracking #

will keep you posted on what happens
 
Are you sure you didn't pay by what is called an eCheck? That payment method takes 4 business days to clear before seller gets an amount in their PayPal account and the payment could fail to fund. As a seller, I always wait for that type of payment to clear and with a weekend, that means shipment will be a week from the time the payment is initiated.

http://reviews.ebay.com/quot-PayPal-eCheck-quot-Questions-Answered_W0QQugidZ10000000004626966

If payment has been funded by immediate transfer of funds or credit card and seller is just trying to wait to ship until he has funds released from his PayPal account, just file a complaint with eBay.
 
I paid with my credit card, the e-check funding directly from my bank I take it? I didnt know you could do that

I like using my credit card because I get points + far easier to get money refunded then taking from bank account

I gave them 3-5 business days to give me a shipping #

how to do you complain to eBay?, I am familiar with the paypal dispute option- but that seems a little extreme at this time
 
hello updates on this continuing saga

seller is giving me a sob story about money....details aren't really important, states money will be available to her to ship in five days (Friday the 18th)

I paid for the item Oct. 29th?, so the 18th will be 21 days of waiting for the seller to ship the item- I have 45 days to make a dispute

should I open up a Paypal dispute to protect myself (knowing this will freeze the funds to the seller?)

btw seller has offered a complete refund

thanks Colin
 
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does the seller have any grounds to stand on when on the eBay page that the item in question "Will usually ship within 2 business days of receiving cleared payment"
 
does the seller have any grounds to stand on when on the eBay page that the item in question "Will usually ship within 2 business days of receiving cleared payment"

No, the payment was funded about 2 weeks ago, this is just a seller deciding he doesn't want to ship and funded doesn't ever mean when the seller can withdraw the funds from his PayPal account, funded means when the account has the funds.
 
Well, this is a very precarious posture PayPal has implemented and IMO it creates more harm than good by imposing undue friction between the buyer and the seller. If I may use myself as an example, I've been an eBay member since 1998 and hold a 100% feedback rating. Out of the first 8 of those 13 years or so I sold a good deal of audio related items, then got away from selling until this past July when I sold a Pioneer SX-950. All went well, I followed-up with the buyer after he had opportunity to hook it up and he was thrilled. About 3 weeks after the auction I get an email from PayPal stating they regretfully will be holding all future payments for 21 days. I called them (and I was not at all nice) explaining I'm a veteran member with perfect feedback, yet even though I was a member years before PayPal was an embryo, I'm classified as a new seller because I hadn't sold anything in awhile, so I decided I would never sell on eBay again.

First of all, with my auctions there is nothing to dispute, as every auction is as-is, no returns, final sale. Holding the funds is academic because the terms in the description clearly states this. I get great responses to my auctions because the pictures are very clear and I probably post 3 substantial paragraphs of very pertinent information, usually more than the prospective buyer would even think to ask. In short, I leave no room for disappointment because the last thing I want is to have to revisit the issue, so integrity is paramount. When my package is dropped for shipment, I know 100% that auction is behind me. So again, when the auction description states no refunds or returns (there's a check box to indicate this when creating the auction details), PayPal knows this is the criteria, therefore there's no reason to hold anything. Here's how one seller expressed their payment terms on an auction I saw today: "PayPal payment due 48 hrs after sale ends. Unit ships after paypal funds are actually transfered to my account - typically 3-4 days after you initiate payment". As an alternative, "new" sellers should simply say, "as a result of PayPal holding funds for 21 days, unit will ship when funds are transferred. Please do not bid on this item if you are not agreeable to this, as these are the terms. My apologies for this inconvenience". Only if people would care enough to support each other and complain to eBay, buyers and sellers alike, can change be a possibility.

I have to agree with the person holding the item and my empathy is with them. Selling on eBay has always been about receiving the payment before the item ships, period. New rules or not, it's unacceptable PayPal forces themselves to police sales that have no recourse as per item description. Some will choose to succumb to this money-hostage scheme because they do not want to be deprived selling on eBay. Well, that's a very sad exchange of self-respect as a result of being bullied. Apologists will find a way to justify PayPal's actions, but I found myself doing fine with Audiogon and the like, and after one sale back on eBay and I remember why I stopped in the first place. PayPal. At that time it was against the buyer, forcing buyers and sellers to use PayPal instead of money orders. Of course eBay owns PayPal and "safety" was a red herring to justify the forced additional fees.

Anyway, there's another angle to consider. There's no explanation in the world that will ever validate why PayPal appoints themselves as an escrow device, especially when sales are stated as final.
 
Thank you for giving me your side from a sellers perspective, I asked this same question on eBay's forums and their is a lot of sellers who are feeling the same way in regards to paypal, I too believe that it is an unfair system.

the item I am buying is also "final" sale, in fact the description states that it is broken!.....so I don't understand the need for paypal to hold the funds...its not like I can dispute the sale after I receive the item, I am buying it with the understanding that it is broken

I actually haven't filed a dispute yet until the seller has had at least a chance to get "cold hard cash" - which is today as its the 21st day since I bought the item in question, so I waiting until 10 pm for some form on communication from the seller- If I don't get some sort of proof of shipping then I am put into a bit of a difficult situation as I have to protect myself

Colin

thank you Chris for your responses as well
 
updates-

seller claimed on the 19th that in their words "transferred the money from PayPal to my bank"

on the 21st the seller stated that "Luckily I checked Pay-Pal before I shipped this morning I see they have reversed the money and you are getting a refund... So sorry I cant ship as was planned... Again very sorry and I promise to not do this again to anybody else"

obviously the seller got spooked when I filled out the item not received form on Paypal, although I stated several times I want the item!

I have finally given up and said I would accept the refund- what is the next step?

p.s- these messages are being sent from the eBay account- the seller is not using the Paypal dispute forum
 
a blanket statement - all of you dont buy or sell enough to know whats up...period.

if you have not sold 25 items since mid 2009 then there is a hold on your funds from buyer until -

"Funds from your sales will be unavailable and show as pending in your PayPal account for a period of time. Learn more"

Selling Basics
How you receive funds from your sales
Ship the same day your buyer pays and print your shipping label on eBay for fastest access to your funds.

While you establish your selling track record, access to funds from buyer payments may be delayed to promote successful fulfillment. As soon as you meet all of the following criteria, payments from your buyers will generally be available immediately:

It's been more than 90 days since your first successful sale; (thats me)
You've had more than 25 sales transactions; and (nope - only 13)
You've had more than $250 in total sales.(yep)

How can I get my funds quickly?

To access your funds as quickly as 3 days after eBay can confirm delivery, we recommend that you ship within 24 hours after your buyer pays and print your shipping label on eBay. With eBay label printing:

Tracking information is automatically provided to eBay
You get discounted postage rates (the eBay label printing service is FREE) i dont remember it being free
Funds for shipping will be available to you immediately (up to $15) (big deal - i have a kenwood ka907 that needs to go out - 120 in shipping - out of pocket -
funds are held)


PRINT YOUR LABEL on
eBay NOW
What if I don’t use eBay label printing?

If you ship directly using USPS, UPS, or FedEx, you can upload your tracking information manually to My eBay. Your funds will still be available 3 days after eBay receives confirmation of delivery.
Mark the item as shipped in My eBay. Even if you don’t upload tracking, if you mark the item as shipped in My eBay, your funds will be available 7 days after your latest estimated delivery date.
If you don't provide tracking information or mark the item as shipped, or the estimated delivery date can't be calculated, your funds will be available 21 days after your buyer pays.

Other reasons access to funds may be delayed: (besides the fucking interest we are making)

Funds could also be delayed if your account does not meet the minimum performance (i have a medium performance level - i have 3 strikes against me - all three for buyer manipulation - example - the kenwood model 9g is A.K.A the kr 9000 - was an auction title - got booted for confusing the buyers on what exactly were they buying - huh) standard required of all eBay sellers, or a higher than normal level of risk is associated with this transaction or with your account—for example a sudden spike in eBay Buyer Protection cases, PayPal disputes or claims, unusual selling activity, items with an exceptionally high selling price, or sales in a new category or a category such as tickets, travel, or gift certificates. Learn more.
Best practices for fast access to funds

Ship quickly
Specify 1-day handling time for the shortest estimated delivery time (a combination of your handling time plus the carrier's published estimated delivery time).
Offer an expedited shipping option (package delivered in 1-3 business days).
Ship within 24 hours after your buyer pays.
Provide tracking
Ship with a carrier that offers package tracking and always upload the tracking information to My eBay.
The easiest way to upload tracking is to buy postage at a discount and print shipping labels on eBay—eBay label printing is a free service. Tracking information is uploaded automatically, funds to cover the cost of shipping (up to $15) will be available immediately, and funds from the buyer will be available 3 days after eBay can confirm the order was delivered.
If you don't use eBay label printing, manually enter your tracking information into My eBay.
If you choose not to use a service with tracking, make sure you mark the item as shipped in My eBay.
Delight your buyer
Respond quickly to resolve any buyer issues.
Focus on providing great service in order to prevent eBay Buyer Protection cases from being opened.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ebay would prefer the common joe to go away or just be in the "for sale" section of ebay - ebay would rather be a volume liquidator with high volume sellers - the normal person is just in their way. so they take advantage of the desperate - that want to make some dough selling some belongings - with all the fees - but also protect the buyer from the REAL DESPERATE SELLERS that are out there to rip someone off. in one of many lawsuits ebay was named as a 'front' for selling stolen goods - and had to clamp down on sellers.

problem for me is - i was told it was 25 items since i opened my account - so i sold about 20 or so things to date....i thought. when my funds were being held i called and asked how long this was going to go on - thats when ebay sed items sold prior to mid 2009 no longer count towards the 25 sales total - so now i have a lot of heavy gear for sale - 2 entire quad systems - everything almost - and first item is to leave monday - and i have 13 transactions that i will sell and not get my funds unless i play it their way.

check this out - i sold an amp today - 250 bucks
- $6 to list
- $38 final value fee
- $12 in paypal fees

now they are holding my money because i havent sold 25 items since mid-2009 - the fastest way to get it is to use their shipping labels.

dont leave out packing fees - i no longer make fun of recycled shipping materials.

on the other hand - i dont think i could have sold a kenwood ka907 amp for parts here in denton texas for $200 bucks....ever.

ebay really wants to be one huge online walmart - would prefer new volume - discontinued or drop-shipped items over used - so they are making the common man more of the 'for sale ads' of their site - and the more money they squeeze and the more ways the buyer is protected - it really does force a person to be legit. that 5 star thing is a fucker too - its not just to show the public your rating within your feedback - noooo....of course it is a monetary way to punish a seller - some idiot goes through there and leaves one star for all 5 categories - and then another does it too - so now out of 15 sales - all positive feedback - but a lower star rating than perfect - well the seller gets punished - with more of a percent taken away in the form of 'final value fee'. back in the day it was more like a nationwide 'for sale' ads in a newspaper...but the scammers ruined it for all of us. one last thing about final value fee - for the amp i exampled below - the final value fee was made up of 2 parts - fee on the selling value + final value fee on the cost of the shipping! you read right. i was charged $23 for final value fee of the item - have an arbitrary weight and size of box for epay shipping calculator - and when looking at final value fees - i saw i was charged $15 for the amount that the BUYER had to pay in shipping! i am really scared of that - nobody knows that - but its true.

kenwood ka 907 - parts unit - powers up - but no sound - perfect for restoration
Dec-09-11 03:32:01 PST Final Value Fee on Shipping Shipping and other costs less sales tax: $160.97 (Auction) US $14.49
kenwood ka 907 - parts unit - powers up - but no sound - perfect for restoration
Final price: $250.00 (Auction) 280788107245 Dec-09-11 03:31:53 PST Final Value fee US $22.50


so the girl is right - if she sold you a 60 pound receiver - it could be $80 to ship to you - she has to pay that out of pocket - or use the ebay shipping label method - which i know they make money on somehow - i remember a fee to print the label - and then ebay will release $15 of the buyers funds to the seller to go towards shipping costs. problem is - this girl dont have any coin - so how is she to pay all but $15 of the $80 shipping? its a hard life. so this female thought she would sell something and make some christmas dough - instead she got squat - even if she sold 25 $1 magazines - thats only $25 ... she needs $250 worth of sales under her belt - and she cannot sale 25 $10 magazines during thanksgiving break - and been geared up for christmas selling - the catch...."it has to be more than 90 days from first positive sale"....so female needed to prepare to sell things on ebay 90 or more days ago - and get the formalities out of the way - craigslist - local ads for free if item for sale is under $300 in most local newspapers - adiogone - $6 listing fee - period.


btw dont ever use a tech that isnt within walking distance.

wm a reid

"qsd-1" on ebay - buy my gear
 
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thanks W.A Reid- I must confess that I didn't read your entire post, but it sounds like eBay is very unfair towards people selling stuff

its also stupid how you aren't considered a verified seller despite selling more then 25 items

I looked at your auctions- your selling some nice stuff- its a shame you cant keep it (I agree with you on the QSD-1 it is UGLY) I would rather have looks/multi use functions i.e- (qrx- series) over the QSD-1 anyday

will keep looking at your auctions thanks for the reply


btw- I got a refund and gave the seller 5 stars across the board- it was mixed messages on both sides,
 
you are very polite 8trackman - thank you.

i am going to do something a little more simple - i have a fisher 800b in a custom cabinet with a record grinder garrard - im going stereo tubes and Bozak symphony speakers - i am keeping a qrx 7001 - i will hear qs synth again - i will glady use jim - our new guru - to put me one together.

william anthony reid
 
cool cant wait to see the cabinet

so is this the Fisher 800b that your referring to http://antiqueradio.org/Fisher800B.htm?

high tech gear for the day, I know enough to know that FM wasn't exactly widespread in the early 60s, it it has multiplex FM sweet!

what does it look when searching for signal strength? sort of like those old fashioned magic eye tubes? - google images has no good pics

thanks for calling me polite- I think its a combination of me being a newb, so trying not to be too annoying + 4 years of university rubbing off (your forced to be extra polite to profs when emailing or they ignore you)

Colin
 
http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=328775

this is actually my thread - several posts later someone uploaded the pictures - larry - i will see if i cant pull them over here - yes - on AK i am 'sansuigirl' - password is 'girlsansui' - theres nothing anyone can say or do that wont get me kicked off - so use the account if you have to. 2.jpg3.jpg4.jpgattachment.jpg

that seems to be a custom cabinet - teak - the bottom half - as you can see - is a LP divider - with a great shelf for cd/dvd storage. the top half has a garrard tt built in and on the very top is the 800b - it is the best of fisher receivers - some like the 800c - but the 800b has the 'fisheye' tubes you were mentioning - that thing with a pair of bozaks - i am right smack in the middle of the 1950's - the good ol days. the knobs to the left of the receiver looked like those things built into some speakers where you turn the 'brightness' up or down - the pushbutton is the power switch for the receiver with some sort of delay between the button and the receiver - similar to bringing it up to power with a variac. i do not mind saying i paid $350 for the entire rig - i told the person selling it she was doing herself no good with her listing title - she did something like this "old-fisher-receiver+cabinet-pickup only" i wanted her to fix it so i wouldnt be forced to drive 3.5 hours one way to get it - but she wouldnt change it - donation to a church fundraiser - so she didnt care - and i bought - i havent powered it up once - ever.


my quad bob 9001 is gone - 1250
both quad scopes are gone - oddly the heathkit and panasonic sold in the same price range
my qsd1 will be gone tomorrow
all qrx 7001 are gone x 3
both jvc sea 4channel eq s are gone

the only one i am keeping for the moment is - the technics 6700x - complete restoration - and parts machine for the scope and power meter MARYLEBIRTHDAY 127.jpg

its the only other quad receiver with a scope - except the marantz 4400 - the pioneer 949 is just bulbs behind fractal glass.

bought the 6700x from the original owner - went to contact him later to say i liked it and thanks for every and all technics paperwork on quad he had accumulated when he bought it as an original owner...and he had died from cancer - i didnt know him - but he included his notes and pricing and brochures - very personal - so i am keeping it in his honor - in the basement in a box stuffed with socks filled with dry rice in them - oddly, very similar to the former owners present state.

this machine has been completely restored - all LED - all caps - all everything - and then i have a parts machine where i pulled the scope and the meter - might ditch the rest of it - it looks fabulous - oh yeah heat-gunned the plastic veneer - and the exposed wood - sanded and came out friggin great.



- here is a pic of the gear before - oh yeah the restored kenwood supreme int. amp is gone 1200 MARYLEBIRTHDAY 005.jpg i have another - unrestored if someone wants to buy it - about $500 clams.

i appreciate most everyone here - i consider you friends - but that is a mental disorder i have - histrionics - i am vulnerable - and those who pick up on that ...eat me alive. so sonically - i am clearing house - and starting over - and when i post my 10 million word blog on here about my tech stories - you will realize why i am so down.

william anthony reid
 
First of all, with my auctions there is nothing to dispute, as every auction is as-is, no returns, final sale. Holding the funds is academic because the terms in the description clearly states this. I get great responses to my auctions because the pictures are very clear and I probably post 3 substantial paragraphs of very pertinent information, usually more than the prospective buyer would even think to ask. In short, I leave no room for disappointment because the last thing I want is to have to revisit the issue, so integrity is paramount. When my package is dropped for shipment, I know 100% that auction is behind me. So again, when the auction description states no refunds or returns (there's a check box to indicate this when creating the auction details), PayPal knows this is the criteria, therefore there's no reason to hold anything. Here's how one seller expressed their payment terms on an auction I saw today: "PayPal payment due 48 hrs after sale ends. Unit ships after paypal funds are actually transfered to my account - typically 3-4 days after you initiate payment". As an alternative, "new" sellers should simply say, "as a result of PayPal holding funds for 21 days, unit will ship when funds are transferred. Please do not bid on this item if you are not agreeable to this, as these are the terms. My apologies for this inconvenience". Only if people would care enough to support each other and complain to eBay, buyers and sellers alike, can change be a possibility.

I have to agree with the person holding the item and my empathy is with them. Selling on eBay has always been about receiving the payment before the item ships, period. New rules or not, it's unacceptable PayPal forces themselves to police sales that have no recourse as per item description. Some will choose to succumb to this money-hostage scheme because they do not want to be deprived selling on eBay. Well, that's a very sad exchange of self-respect as a result of being bullied. Apologists will find a way to justify PayPal's actions, but I found myself doing fine with Audiogon and the like, and after one sale back on eBay and I remember why I stopped in the first place. PayPal. At that time it was against the buyer, forcing buyers and sellers to use PayPal instead of money orders. Of course eBay owns PayPal and "safety" was a red herring to justify the forced additional fees.
Anyway, there's another angle to consider. There's no explanation in the world that will ever validate why PayPal appoints themselves as an escrow device, especially when sales are stated as final.
ever hear of interest - there is a huge gigantic billion dollar reason paypal/ebay holds funds - they earn interest on it.

ah - you dont know what you are talking about - you can write any rules you want in your item description - but you must take paypal - so paypal rules outweigh your rules - your rules are like the sticker on the back of dump truck that says 'stay back 200 feet - not responsible for falling debris or damage to your vehicle" - that sticker is for dumb people - oh he has a sticker - so i guess its ok a rock just bounced out of his truck and broke my windshield - nah - call 911 and tell them youre following the truck and somebody better come assist with your citizens arrest.

'returns' are for people with buyers remorse - a snad case is completely different - if it is not described accurately - then it can be returned - period. (significantly not as described) - so realistically, the more you talk in an auction - the more likely a buyer with remorse has an opportunity to return the item - words like - mint - flawless - perfect working order - all those words can get any piece of gear returned - and i have not paid to return an item in about 6 years - so i dont even fall under the - well, do i want to return this over a scratch? not if i have to pay to return it - call ebay - talk normal - get a prepaid return shipping slip emailed to you from ebay - tape it to the box - its gone - its tracked - and youre money is returned.

read how it works and do as they say - put whatever you want in your auction - but all rules lay in the hands of epay.

w.a.r.
 
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