ATOM HEART MOTHER . TMQ wth?

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I think that if you use the

QSD1 or Surround Master

you would find out that it is a QS encoded disc

Maybe the Audition script is a bit out

It is not, at least my copy (see photo above).
It is true that the scripts had been developed a lot during these years on cleaning out the decoding from artifacts, but the basic maths are the same. While the SQ/QS test i did 7 years ago were with a older script, the only decode that did match the UK Q8 was the SQ for both UK and Jap.
 
It is not, at least my copy (see photo above).
It is true that the scripts had been developed a lot during these years on cleaning out the decoding from artifacts, but the basic maths are the same. While the SQ/QS test i did 7 years ago were with a older script, the only decode that did match the UK Q8 was the SQ for both UK and Jap.

Winopener:
You're talking about The Japanese version of Atom Heart Mother - correct? Rustyandi was talking about the Japanese DSOTM...

Does your Japanese ATM have any of the additional matrix info, e.g. "2S 1 P" or "2S 4 P 4-3 W" ?

From the the Pink Floyd Archives:
Japanese ATM Quad:
ATMJAP.jpg
Title: Atom Heart Mother (Odeon Records quadraphonic issue)
Record Company: Odeon Records
Catalog Number: EOZ-80008
Matrix Information: (side 1 / side 2)
1) QHVL-781-A 2S 1 P / QHVL-781-B 1S 11 P (both stamped) (promo)
2) QHVL-781-A 2S 4 P 4-3 W / QHVL-781-B 1S 6 P (both stamped)
Release Information: Odeon Records quadraphonic issue with four channel RM sound.
http://pinkfloydarchives.com/DJaLPPF.htm#AHMq

UK ATM Quad (1st Pressing):
ATMUK.jpg
Title: Atom Heart Mother (Harvest Records 1st SQ quadraphonic issue)
Record Company: Harvest Records
Catalog Number: Q4 SHVL 781
Matrix Information: (side 1 / side 2)
1) QHVL 781 A-1 G 1 / QHVL 781 B-2 G 1 (both stamped)
2) QHVL 781 A-2 A 1 / QHVL 781 B-3 M 1 (both stamped)
Release Information: First quadraphonic issue with the SQ quadraphonic logo on the front cover.
http://pinkfloydarchives.com/DUKLPPF.htm#AHMSQ1

UK ATM Quad (2nd Pressing):
Title: Atom Heart Mother (Harvest Records 2nd SQ quadraphonic issue)
Record Company: Harvest Records
Catalog Number: Q4 SHVL 781
Matrix Information: (side 1 / side 2)
1) QHVL 781 A-2 T / QHVL 781 B-3 CXM 1 (both stamped)
http://pinkfloydarchives.com/DUKLPPF.htm#AHMSQ2


Japanese Dark Side of the Moon Quad:
DSOTMJAP.jpg
Title: The Dark Side Of The Moon (EMI / Toshiba Records quadraphonic issue)
Record Company: EMI / Toshiba Records
Catalog Number: EMZ-82005
Matrix Information: (side 1 / side 2)
1) 4QSHVL-804-A 1S 4 P 4-YW / 4QSHVL-804-B 1S 3 P (both stamped)
Release Date: 1974
Release Information: Quadraphonic issue.
http://pinkfloydarchives.com/DJaLPPF.htm#DSOTMq

UK Dark Side of the Moon Quad:
DSOTMUK.jpg
Title: The Dark Side of the Moon (Harvest Records SQ quadraphonic issue)
Record Company: Harvest Records
Catalog Number: Q4 SHVL 804
Matrix Information: (side 1 / side 2)
1) QHVL 804 A-1 G 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 G 1 (both stamped)
2) QHVL 804 A-1 G 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 R 1 (both stamped)
3) QHVL 804 A-2 P 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 L 1 (both stamped)
4) QHVL 804 A-2 GM 2 / QHVL 804 B-1 L 1 (both stamped)
5) QHVL 804 A-2 RP 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 RH 2 (both stamped)
6) QHVL 804 A-2 RL 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 GG 2 (both stamped)
7) QHVL 804 A-2 AO 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 GG 2 (both stamped)
8) QHVL 804 A-2 MR 1 / QHVL 804 B-1 RR 2 (both stamped)
9) QHVL 804 A-3 G 2 HTM / QHVL 804 B 1 R 2 (both stamped except HTM written)
10) QHVL 804 A-3 M 2 HTM / QHVL 804 B 1 RM 2 (both stamped except HTM written)
11) QHVL 804 A-3 O 1 HTM / QHVL 804-B AP 2 (both stamped except HTM written)
12) QHVL 804 A-3 L 1 HTM / QHVL 804-B 1 2 (both stamped except HTM written)
Release Date: December 1973
Release Information: SQ quadraphonic issue with "EMI Records Ltd." on the label.
http://pinkfloydarchives.com/DUKLPPF.htm#DSOTMSQ1
 
Winopener:
You're talking about The Japanese version of Atom Heart Mother - correct? Rustyandi was talking about the Japanese DSOTM...

Does your Japanese ATM have any of the additional matrix info, e.g. "2S 1 P" or "2S 4 P 4-3 W" ?

This:
2) QHVL-781-A 2S 4 P 4-3 W / QHVL-781-B 1S 6 P (both stamped)
 
I went down to my Cave
Pulled out both LPs
The QS was marked as above
I played the SQ in QS the front is the same but the rear channels
are not separated there is a of centre decoding
But when I play SQ in TATE and QS in QSD1 perfect
I can say that there is two Quad LP. versions of Dark Side Of the Moon
 
Thanks Rustyandi for the clarification about DSOTM. This does fit pefectly with what i've written above: the matrix information of the stampers are different between Japan and UK, so it is a different cut, non stamper-cloning involved.

Back on the AHM topic, i've checked the Vernon site about the various quad releases of AHM and the only recut is the third Brazilian edition

Title: Atom Heart Mother (SQ quadraphonic 3rd issue)
Record Company: EMI / Harvest Records
Catalog Number: 31C 064 04550QD
Matrix Information: (side 1 / side 2)
1) 04550 1 C2 (P) 1187 200 / 04550 2 C2 (P) 1987 200 (both written)
Release Information: Third SQ quadraphonic issue.

All other AHM quad releases anywhere does have the QHVL-781* stampers, thus all these are clones of the UK version, which is SQ.
So, following the same reasoning, i can say that there is only one Quad LP version of Atom Heart Mother.
 
I will try them out tomorrow night
I use the Scope and my ears to test decoding
I am hoping when my granddaughter gets some time to tell me how to put
things on the net I will show the tests
It's not all roses when you get old
 
I played tracks From A/T/H/Mother in both systems
My first questions is WHY?
Music it is not
Track
Summer plays along until near the end then a guitar
goes solo in R/R channel
The track plays the same in both QS and SQ
when I played the QS in SQ the guitar went to the front channel
So it did not decode the same
Track
Mind your thoughts Please
there is a lot of movement around the channels
It played the same in QS and SQ
My thoughts are there is two Systems
SQ and QS Quad
If you played either Systems on the wrong Decoder you will
a surround effect
But only when played on the right Decoder
do you get a clean channel separation
The numbers on the disc are as shown on the pictures above
 
I played tracks From A/T/H/Mother in both systems
My first questions is WHY?
Music it is not
Track
Summer plays along until near the end then a guitar
goes solo in R/R channel
The track plays the same in both QS and SQ
when I played the QS in SQ the guitar went to the front channel
So it did not decode the same
Track
Mind your thoughts Please
there is a lot of movement around the channels
It played the same in QS and SQ
My thoughts are there is two Systems
SQ and QS Quad
If you played either Systems on the wrong Decoder you will
a surround effect
But only when played on the right Decoder
do you get a clean channel separation
The numbers on the disc are as shown on the pictures above
Old thread back. Regarding jap pressing of AHM I think there’s misinformation about decoding correctly just by the fact jap pressing have similar stamper it doesn‘t mean it is the same stamper. it was 1974 and almost everything could be done!!
Back to topics:
I never really listened carefully to this album in quad, I have both jap lp and the “sad” US Q8. I tried to understand which song has the best quad effect so I could determine which encoding was used on the japanese pressing. Winopener suggested me to try Summer ‘68 because near the end there’s an acoustic guitar going front center to rear left
I listened to the Q8 first and it is just like that, center to rear left
checked that in SQ with the Tate and as RustIandy said it goes from center to front left. Tried that again with the sansui 7001 and boom!! Front center to rear lef, so this sounds QS to me.
Now that I’ve worked a lot on auition scripts I’m very sure that a rear left signal would sound mono and oop on sq undecoded, which is different from QS, any left or right signal will play 75% left or right, in phase and out of phase. If this was a SQ stamper that guitar would play correctly in SQ.
I also did some research and there are 3 pressings of the RM version of AHM.
5F276965-34A3-4CAE-9679-6F2459D0B3B3.png

Maybe the first batch was SQ??
I have the “version 2” pressing.

and by the way:
F15403EF-05E2-462D-A722-56045C645434.png
C336F1DF-7F7F-4BB1-A118-A7A188B20AA0.jpeg

As you can see the rumout area of the japanese pressing on side 2 is wider than the UK
 
Last edited:
Let's get this straight, i did all this 7 years ago:
1) The Japanese Odeon marked RM *is* pressed fron the same UK stamper as the Harvest UK SQ. So, there is no true RM version.
2) Visually compared both Jap and UK lp. I have the Jap, i borrowed the UK from a friend. Same stampers, and IIRC Jap didn't even bother to add the EOZ n.
3) Both UK and Jap does decode identically.
4) Both UK and Jap, when decoded as SQ, have the same sonic placements as the discrete UK Q8, which i have.

Here's the tricky part:
5) Both UK and Jap, when decoded as QS, doesn'have the same sonic placements as the discrete UK Q8, however they do create a very nice surround landscape - even if it is a wrong one (for example, DSOTM SQ doesn't decode so well in QS). So i can understand well why it seems to be a true RM when it is not - even decoding it wrongly it sounds nice.

A especially revealing snippets is on "Summer 68": on the discrete UK Q8 the DG guitar pans from full front to Rear Left (going with memory... don't have a surround rig now where i'm typing). Decoding the matrixed LP as QS, that snippets show how astray is a technically wrong decoding, no matter how nice the end results can be.

Now, is someone want to buy a "pricy RM" version of AHM, i can sell mine.:)
Doing some extra research on EMI/ODEON RM titles; as I recently did an Involve decode of this Japanese title-

https://www.discogs.com/release/8942939-Franck-Pourcel-And-His-Orchestra-Western
now I’m wondering if it’s the same kind of deal as the Pink Floyd -(SQ) instead?

Most all the EMI Quads are SQ, aren’t they?
 
Doing some extra research on EMI/ODEON RM titles; as I recently did an Involve decode of this Japanese title-

https://www.discogs.com/release/8942939-Franck-Pourcel-And-His-Orchestra-Western
now I’m wondering if it’s the same kind of deal as the Pink Floyd -(SQ) instead?

Most all the EMI Quads are SQ, aren’t they?
I talked to Winopener about AHM release from japan. I have both the discrete Q8, the matrix decoded US Q8 and the japan RM album. I can tell for sure the japanese is QS encoded, so this RM=SQ on this title is not true. And we can’t tell it because the UK SQ stamper has a similar catalog number as the RM, similar does not mean the same to me. Fact is that the decoded RM is the same as the discrete does make a huge difference.
I test it with the Involve, the Sansui QRX-7001, the Tate and the result is very clear by ear, pc and quad scope
 
I talked to Winopener about AHM release from japan. I have both the discrete Q8, the matrix decoded US Q8 and the japan RM album. I can tell for sure the japanese is QS encoded, so this RM=SQ on this title is not true. And we can’t tell it because the UK SQ stamper has a similar catalog number as the RM, similar does not mean the same to me. Fact is that the decoded RM is the same as the discrete does make a huge difference.
I test it with the Involve, the Sansui QRX-7001, the Tate and the result is very clear by ear, pc and quad scope
whew 😓 thanks for the extra clarification @Lucanu, I really didn't want to have to rip again in SQ, and then compare. I'd rather just sit back and enjoy.

Talk about a label dipping their toe in a specific matrix (RM /QS) as just a cursory search in discogs (not definitive); found maybe 3-4 titles in RM?

matrix.gif
 
This reminds me of someone telling me something about a project he was working on called "What is RM, and why it isn't BMX, QM, QS or QX". Oddly enough, google searching for that leads to QQ threads of debates on decoding algorithms. Funny how controversial such topics can get, but useful if one has trouble getting to sleep.

Interesting to know the AHM SQ stamper myth/rumor is just that.
 
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