Beethoven 6th Symphony - Bruno Walter / Columbia Symphony Orchestra

[ubertrout]

I noticed that Analogue Productions was releasing the famed recording by Bruno Walter and the Columbia Symphony (mostly the LA Philharmonic) of Beethoven's 6th Symphony. I originally shrugged - Sony already released this as a pretty good 2-channel SACD in their very first batch of releases, and I didn't really see the need for another remaster. But apparently they went back to the 3-track tapes, and are releasing this as a 2/3 channel SACD. Anyone heard it or have any thoughts? http://store.acousticsounds.com/d/1...o_6_in_F_Major_Op_68-Hybrid_Multichannel_SACD

 

[Simon A]

I noticed that Analogue Productions was releasing the famed recording by Bruno Walter and the Columbia Symphony (mostly the LA Philharmonic) of Beethoven's 6th Symphony. I originally shrugged - Sony already released this as a pretty good 2-channel SACD in their very first batch of releases, and I didn't really see the need for another remaster. But apparently they went back to the 3-track tapes, and are releasing this as a 2/3 channel SACD. Anyone heard it or have any thoughts? http://store.acousticsounds.com/d/1...o_6_in_F_Major_Op_68-Hybrid_Multichannel_SACD

Excellent news!

 

[4-earredwonder]

I noticed that Analogue Productions was releasing the famed recording by Bruno Walter and the Columbia Symphony (mostly the LA Philharmonic) of Beethoven's 6th Symphony. I originally shrugged - Sony already released this as a pretty good 2-channel SACD in their very first batch of releases, and I didn't really see the need for another remaster. But apparently they went back to the 3-track tapes, and are releasing this as a 2/3 channel SACD. Anyone heard it or have any thoughts? http://store.acousticsounds.com/d/1...o_6_in_F_Major_Op_68-Hybrid_Multichannel_SACD

I haven't heard that particular remastered SACD, ubertrout, but based on the three RCA Living Stereo AP remasters I've accumulated, they certainly 'trump' [NO pun intended] the original SONY SACD reissues.

 

[Scytales]

Hi.

I recently purchased the Analogue Productions release of Beethoven's 6th symphony performed by Bruno Walter conducting the Columbia Symphony Orchestra (CAPC 077 SA).

I have bought it because it is advertised as a 3 channels SA-CD remastered from original 3 tracks tapes (as most of RCA Living Stereo or Mercury Living Presence SA-CD releases) on various vendors online platforms:

Bruno Walter-Beethoven Symphony No 6 In F Major Op 68-Hybrid 3-Channel Stereo SACD|Acoustic Sounds

https://www.discogs.com/release/964...lter-Symphony-No-6-In-F-Major-Op-68-Pastorale

Symphony no. 6 in f major, op. 68 (pastorale) by Ludwig Van Beethoven, Bruno Walter, Others with cdandlp

But when I received this costly disc, after having paid import fees in France, where I live, I was sadly surprised to not see the multichannel logo anywhere on the disc liner notes, nor any statement that the disc contains an actual three channels version on the HD layer of this hybrid disc. There are only a "Stereo" logo on the disc and the liner notes.

I just put the disc in my multichannel universal disc player to check its content: the player displayed the presence of 5 channels (without subwoofer). As for the moment I only have a 3 channels hi-fi installation, I can testify that I can actually hear sound coming out of the front centre speaker, but this sound is hugely attenuated compared to the left and right channels. Nothing comparable with RCA LS or Mercury LP SA-CDs, or old Everest 3 channels recordings released on DVD-Vs or DVD-As in the USA. It seems to me that the front centre channel of the AP SA-CD only contains some low level reverb information.

I am hugely disappointed by this purchase, for the advertised disc content does not seem to me to match the actual content.

Are there anybody else who have made the same observation ?

 

[Scytales]

I have asked the editor of the above mentioned disc, and I have received a reassuring answer :

"There was a misprint on the artwork and disc stating that it is stereo when it is actually a 3-channel recording.

This is a 3-channel recording from a different label (Columbia) than the RCA Living Stereo or Mercury Living Presence releases and it was recorded differently with a lower recorded level in the center channel vs. the left and right channels. This is not a mistake or a defect but is an exact representation of the recording sourced from the original 3-channel master tapes."

The fact that my SA-CD player displayed that this is a 5 channels recording must be an idiosyncratic behaviour of the player, not an actual indication of the exact number of channels. The player display has this behaviour with any known 3 channels recording I have.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

The fact that my SA-CD player displayed that this is a 5 channels recording must be an idiosyncratic behaviour of the player, not an actual indication of the exact number of channels. The player display has this behaviour with any know 3 channels recording I have.

Most hardware (and software) does not have knowledge of channel counts other than 1, 2, 5 and 6 plus, of course, most recent stuff for immersive audio. As a result, other channel counts (3 or 4) are often packaged as 5 or 6, ideally with a suitable number and placement of blank channels.

 

[JediJoker]

The fact that my SA-CD player displayed that this is a 5 channels recording must be an idiosyncratic behaviour of the player, not an actual indication of the exact number of channels. The player display has this behaviour with any know 3 channels recording I have.

Most hardware (and software) does not have knowledge of channel counts other than 1, 2, 5 and 6 plus, of course, most recent stuff for immersive audio. As a result, other channel counts (3 or 4) are often packaged as 5 or 6, ideally with a suitable number and placement of blank channels.

Indeed, SACD only has the capability to store 2, 5, or 6 channels as a separate audio track. So, 3- and 4-channel audio are either carried in 5- or 6-channel containers on disc.

 

[Scytales]

Oh! Yes, your right. I re-read the relevant part of the most recent issue (March 2004) of the Scarlett Book I have at my disposal, and the specifications only acknowledged 5 or 6 channels. But there are provision to code other channels configuration on SA-CDs (part 3.2.1.2.5.2 "Loudspeaker_Config" of "Audio Specifications"). It's a shame the full potential of SA-CD specifications was never used. There were huge spaces for improvements in the Scarlett Book, both from a technical point of view and to improve the user-experience.

A proper display of the actual number of channels thanks to an appropriate flag in a relevant area of the disc TOC would have been one improvement.

But at least, disc editors should code a displayable text about the actual number of channels to supplement the absence of a standard. Or be precise in the liner notes. Most of the time, there is no proper information about the multichannel configuration, espacially the presence or the absence of an LFE channel.