Does anyone still offer a multi-channel SACD player?

[jackjofi]

Yes, there are still several manufacturers that offer multi-channel SACD players. Some examples include:

Marantz: Marantz has a range of SACD players that offer multi-channel playback, such as the SA-10 and SA-KI Ruby.

Yamaha: Yamaha's SACD players, like the CD-S2100 and CD-S1000, support multi-channel SACD playback.

 

[ARMcMeen]

I don't understand how the Yamaha CD-S2100 can support multi-channel with an output selection like this. I thought it was either HDMI or 5.1 analogue out.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

The Yamaha CD-S2100 is not a multi-channel player.

It can however spin multi-channel SACD's and fold them down to stereo

 

[GOS]

That CD-S2100 does not do multi-channel. No chance.

 

[stoopid]

I don't understand how the Yamaha CD-S2100 can support multi-channel with an output selection like this. I thought it was either HDMI or 5.1 analogue out.View attachment 90730

You can't really tell just by connections alone. Coax and optical support 5.1 but mostly lossy (compressed?, don't quite me on exact specs) due to bitrate limitations inherent in that output's technology. I checked google and the answer to your question is pretty obvious and showed very early in the search results. Another rule of thumb is to always double check, and despite supporting outputs that can transmit surround formats that player indeed does not actually support surround anything.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Coax and optical support 5.1 but mostly lossy (compressed?

Always with lossy compression.

 

[ssully]

You can't really tell just by connections alone. Coax and optical support 5.1 but mostly lossy (compressed?, don't quite me on exact specs) due to bitrate limitations inherent in that output's technology. I checked google and the answer to your question is pretty obvious and showed very early in the search results. Another rule of thumb is to always double check, and despite supporting outputs that can transmit surround formats that player indeed does not actually support surround anything.

coax/optical (S/PDIF) *only* passes lossy compressed 5.1 (and uncompressed stereo, of course)

So, you can tell what something *can't* do by the connections alone.

Reading the manual can be helpful. A crazy idea, I know! They're usually available online. For the Yamaha CD-S2100 there's even a download document called 'About Playing SACD". It consists of a single sentence, in several languages:

Audio signals recorded in DSD multi-channel format cannot be played on this unit.

(I would think the letters 'CD' in the model # would also be a clue)

 

[Jeffrey Behr]

During the summer of 2022, I decided to raise the quality of my SACD-playing system, and since I LOVE Classical music in multichannel form and already have some PS Audio (PSA) equipment, I fairly quickly decided on a PSA system based on their old DirectStream Memory Player for its ability to output raw DSD to six channels of PSA DACs. But after talking to PSA personnel several times thereafter, I determined recently that even if one uses two or three identical PSA DACs, nothing synchronizes their output-level controls. So...no PSA SACD-playback equipment.

Since then I've done something to get higher-quality sound from the equipment I have. I have achieved that using my existing, stock Oppo UDP-205 driving directly my existing excellent audio system of three poweramps, five loudspeakers, and two subwoofers. I have now achieved my BEST-ever quality of musical playback at the LOW cost of reterminating one high-quality IC cable and buying maybe-$200 of inexpensive cable for the subwoofers and surrounds.

The 'new' SACD system continues to use my high-quality 'backend'--AQ Dragon interconnect for the two main feeds; Atma-Sphere Class-D monoamps and Emotiva eleven-channel poweramp*; and loudspeakers (PS Audio FR20s, Martin Logan centerchannel, and HHR TLS-5 polydirectional surrounds). The video-system surround speakers are the same HHR TLS-5s plus a pair of humble ELAC B6s for the rear surrounds, and by running one additional inexpensive pair of ICs to the Emotiva, I again have a 7.0.4 video system. (The 7 speakers include a pair of 18"-driver Rythmik subwoofers driven in stereo and not by the '.1' channel.)

The Oppo '205, too, continues, but in an expanded role; it's now decoding the discs' digital signals and driving the poweramps directly instead of digitally via HDMI into the pre/pro. Switching from one system to the other requires flipping two switches on the MC poweramp and moving the two Dragon XLR connectors between the pre/pro and the Oppo...plenty simple enough and taking only about a minute.

The sonic result is another clearly audible increase in sound quality--more resolution including spaciousness, significantly less 'steelyness' of violins played in their higher registers, and a 'creamier', more-attractive (but still highly resolved) midrange.

WOW--all for maybe $300! I'm thrilled!


* An XPA Gen 3 model Eleven | 1.5s

 

[mandrix]

I've heard it many times. I don't hear any audible difference for the better using Analog VS HDMI from an Oppo. If you do then something has changed downstream or something just is not right.
The signal passed via HDMI (bitstreamed) should be as pure a signal as you're going to get from the device. I don't care how many devices you have downstream, how much they cost, something must change the signal to make a difference analog.

Of course the same is true for HDMI.
The quality of the SOUND / capabilities in the chain produced, your speakers, your subjective likes, other factors or steps in the chain will influence the whole she-bang.
All electronics are not created equal, true. I just don't believe an analog signal from an Oppo is any better than a digital one via HDMI. Or at least one can hear.

Just My Humble Opinion

 

[stoopid]

But my pre-oxygenated ultiminium trans-dimensional cables.

 

[Sal1950]

Just My Humble Opinion

I fully agree.
There's no argument that the DAC's inside the OPPO's are some of the best
measuring ones available even today.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...measurements-of-oppo-udp-205-uhd-player.3660/But as far as demonstrably better sound quality when done under tightly bias controlled conditions, much as yet to be shown. There is the fact that many AVR's offer some very poor
performing internal DAC's, along with their analog pre and amplifier sections.
In the big picture, for our multich playback needs, we have to take into account the complete front to back digital processing paths needed for the decoding of all the various formats such as DolbyD, Atmos, DTS, Auro3D and all the rest. It becomes difficult in the extreme to take advantage of any audible small sound quality advantage the Oppo's could possibly offer.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

... I have achieved that using my existing, stock Oppo UDP-205 driving directly my existing excellent audio system of three poweramps, five loudspeakers, and two subwoofers. I have now achieved my BEST-ever quality of musical playback at the LOW cost of reterminating one high-quality IC cable and buying maybe-$200 of inexpensive cable for the subwoofers and surrounds.

Nice one... I do a similar thing with my analogue output set-up.

I send 'stereo' music to an Audiolab 6000A (which offers: pre-, power- or integrated amplifier modes). And 'surround sound' music to the Audiolab 6000A along with three Audiolab M-PWR power amplifiers. All the amps are connected to full-range speakers as I don't run a sub/LFE.

 

[barfle]

I've heard it many times. I don't hear any audible difference for the better using Analog VS HDMI from an Oppo. If you do then something has changed downstream or something just is not right.
The signal passed via HDMI (bitstreamed) should be as pure a signal as you're going to get from the device. I don't care how many devices you have downstream, how much they cost, something must change the signal to make a difference analog.

Of course the same is true for HDMI.
The quality of the SOUND / capabilities in the chain produced, your speakers, your subjective likes, other factors or steps in the chain will influence the whole she-bang.
All electronics are not created equal, true. I just don't believe an analog signal from an Oppo is any better than a digital one via HDMI. Or at least one can hear.

Just My Humble Opinion

If there is a difference, it would be in the DACs used and/or any DSP used in your pre-pro/receiver. I have my 105 outputting 5.1 analog into my Marantz pre-pro, because that seems to be the best use of the Oppo, which was the best audio player at the time I bought it.

I’ve run one test of the DACs, that being a FLAC on a USB stick. I preferred the sound from the Oppo, but not by much.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

If there is a difference, it would be in the DACs used and/or any DSP used in your pre-pro/receiver. I have my 105 outputting 5.1 analog into my Marantz pre-pro, because that seems to be the best use of the Oppo, which was the best audio player at the time I bought it.

I’ve run one test of the DACs, that being a FLAC on a USB stick. I preferred the sound from the Oppo, but not by much.

All this begs the question... Why doesn't anybody manufacture an multi-channel amplifier with HDMI inputs that's dedicated to audio decoding along with video pass-through.

Personally, I don't need a AVR that offers a radio, bluetooth, apps, video processing, weird audio effects or any other fancy features. I just want a device that decodes the major audio formats such as: PCM, the Dolby's, the DTS's and maybe Auro and MPEG-H.

 

[ssully]

I fully agree.
There's no argument that the DAC's inside the OPPO's are some of the best
measuring ones available even today.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...measurements-of-oppo-udp-205-uhd-player.3660/But as far as demonstrably better sound quality when done under tightly bias controlled conditions, much as yet to be shown. There is the fact that many AVR's offer some very poor
performing internal DAC's, along with their analog pre and amplifier sections.

Performance has to be pretty darn poor to be actually routinely audible.

And for me, with everything ripped to files, there's no need for a holy Oppo device.

Audio hobbyists worry too much about unimportant stuff, when room acoustics and speaker setup and performance are really paramount.

Why people using multiple subs -- which bear the brunt of power requirements for audio -- believe they need brawny power amps is another question to ponder.

 

[atrocity]

All this begs the question... Why doesn't anybody manufacture an multi-channel amplifier with HDMI inputs that's dedicated to audio decoding along with video pass-through.

Personally, I don't need a AVR that offers a radio, bluetooth, apps, video processing, weird audio effects or any other fancy features. I just want a device that decodes the major audio formats such as: PCM, the Dolby's, the DTS's and maybe Auro and MPEG-H.

Back in March I had to recycle my Onkyo because the Hate Defecation Murder Interface board died again and there was no available replacement. I wound getting a NAD T 758 and I like it. I think it has some kind of Bluetooth something or other, but I don't care and haven't seriously looked into it. It does have straight video passthrough, no radio and decoding of the dominant formats (i.e.,no Auro or MPEG-H). It does decode Atmos, though I don't have the speakers or the ambition. I think it can decode 7.1.4 but you'll need another amp or you'll have to choose between 7.1.2 or 5.1.4. But you definitely would want to confirm that if it's important to you, I may have garbled it.

It includes the ability to configure the sound via Dirac Live and it's really on my to-do list for some day, but it sounded so good right out of the box that I just haven't made it a priority.

With tax it came to $1,767.10, which is probably right around what I paid for the Onkyo years ago. The sales pitch was that 1) NAD believes in keeping it simple and 2) Some of the boards are swappable, allegedly making it possible to upgrade to 8k (it currently works great with 4k).

It also lacks a phono preamp, which is a minor inconvenience for me. It also includes only the latest Dolby Surround option, which I thought sounded good enough for music...until I compared it to the Surround Master in Involve mode, at which point Dolby suddenly sounded a LOT less appealing.

Oh, it also has MQA, which arguably contradicts with the philosophy of keeping it simple and for which I have no use.

It can stream from a local library, but after years of using LMS, it seems clunky and pointless. I tried it once, heard a tiny glitch at a track transition and never used it again.

If I sound like I'm badmouthing it, I'm just trying to think of every possible shortcoming someone might care about. I'm actually very, very happy with it. And boy, am I done with Onkyo!

 

[Owen Smith]

Oh, it also has MQA, which arguably contradicts with the philosophy of keeping it simple and for which I have no use.

The MQA snakeoil salespeople managed to convince almost every audio gear manufacturer that they needed to support MQA. Even Oppo got infected with MQA crap.

 

[Sal1950]

The MQA snakeoil salespeople managed to convince almost every audio gear manufacturer that they needed to support MQA. Even Oppo got infected with MQA crap.

What comes around goes around.
I believe they're on the last gasps now.
Couldn't happen to a nicer snake-oil purveyor.
JMHO

 

[mandrix]

All this begs the question... Why doesn't anybody manufacture an multi-channel amplifier with HDMI inputs that's dedicated to audio decoding along with video pass-through.

Personally, I don't need a AVR that offers a radio, bluetooth, apps, video processing, weird audio effects or any other fancy features. I just want a device that decodes the major audio formats such as: PCM, the Dolby's, the DTS's and maybe Auro and MPEG-H.

Amen, Brother. I'm right there with you.
All the (to me) useless stuff they put on modern AVR's is just bogus to me.

 

[mandrix]

Back in March I had to recycle my Onkyo because the Hate Defecation Murder Interface board died again and there was no available replacement. I wound getting a NAD T 758 and I like it. I think it has some kind of Bluetooth something or other, but I don't care and haven't seriously looked into it. It does have straight video passthrough, no radio and decoding of the dominant formats (i.e.,no Auro or MPEG-H). It does decode Atmos, though I don't have the speakers or the ambition. I think it can decode 7.1.4 but you'll need another amp or you'll have to choose between 7.1.2 or 5.1.4. But you definitely would want to confirm that if it's important to you, I may have garbled it.

It includes the ability to configure the sound via Dirac Live and it's really on my to-do list for some day, but it sounded so good right out of the box that I just haven't made it a priority.

With tax it came to $1,767.10, which is probably right around what I paid for the Onkyo years ago. The sales pitch was that 1) NAD believes in keeping it simple and 2) Some of the boards are swappable, allegedly making it possible to upgrade to 8k (it currently works great with 4k).

It also lacks a phono preamp, which is a minor inconvenience for me. It also includes only the latest Dolby Surround option, which I thought sounded good enough for music...until I compared it to the Surround Master in Involve mode, at which point Dolby suddenly sounded a LOT less appealing.

Oh, it also has MQA, which arguably contradicts with the philosophy of keeping it simple and for which I have no use.

It can stream from a local library, but after years of using LMS, it seems clunky and pointless. I tried it once, heard a tiny glitch at a track transition and never used it again.

If I sound like I'm badmouthing it, I'm just trying to think of every possible shortcoming someone might care about. I'm actually very, very happy with it. And boy, am I done with Onkyo!

Reading this, I had to laugh at your description of the HDMI board problems that used to plague Onkyo.
I had a TX-NR609 that I managed to get fixed under warranty just before the warranty expired, that is, replace/repair the HDMI board.

Onkyo eventually offered, if you could find about it in time, an offer of a replacement AVR for several models with severe or recurring HDMI problems. You were given a choice between two AVR's.
I took advantage of this, peeled off the Serial Number strip and sent it along with $200 to Onkyo and they sent me a TX-NR656, which is a 5.1.2 Atmos capable AVR and was actually my introduction to Atmos. I still have it, although not in use because I bought last December a TX-RZ50.

But I never had any problems from the TX-NR656 so that satisfied me that Onkyo had apparently fixed the HDMI board problems. I will also point out that even Denon AVR's had some problems because of a certain chip on the board, that they eventually corrected in later models. Stuff happens.

The TX-NR609 HDMI board I recapped with more heat tolerant caps, tested for a while and eventually gave to my adult Daughter who still uses it with no problems. Fortunately no problem with the BGA chip on the board that also plagued some Onkyo's from a decade ago, and resides on the HDMI board.

But so far my TX-RZ50 has performed without problems of any sort, and the built in Dirac Live speaker correction has been a real game changer in my smallish audio room. It will amp 9 channels but will process Atmos 11 channels, and has preouts for all of which I patch two to another AVR (side surrounds) for my Atmos 7.1.4 setup.


I hope you enjoy your NAD and it brings you much listening pleasure.