Does this guy have any clue?

QuadraphonicQuad

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Quad D

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Well, tonight I had an example of surround/atmos experience from a high-end system using only two speakers. Wilson Alexia V speakers, on some material it sounded as if sound is coming from the sides, as well from the ceiling. $70000 dollars speakers can provide quite interesting stereo listening......:). Anyway, my point is that stereo only is no limitation when price is no object.
 

Kal Rubinson

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Well, tonight I had an example of surround/atmos experience from a high-end system using only two speakers. Wilson Alexia V speakers, on some material it sounded as if sound is coming from the sides, as well from the ceiling. $70000 dollars speakers can provide quite interesting stereo listening......:). Anyway, my point is that stereo only is no limitation when price is no object.
If I can presume it was the same rig that I heard earlier in the day, I disagree. When I played one of the same demo tracks (provided by the host) back home, it was a bit different, arguably equally impressive but not inferior. OTOH, when I switched to the multichannel version of the same performance (also provided by the host), it was clearly superior.
 

Quad D

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If I can presume it was the same rig that I heard earlier in the day, I disagree. When I played one of the same demo tracks (provided by the host) back home, it was a bit different, arguably equally impressive but not inferior. OTOH, when I switched to the multichannel version of the same performance (also provided by the host), it was clearly superior.
I know that 5 speakers of that calibre would sound better than 2, my point was that stereo can sound great on high end speakers and than it is not necessarily inferior to surround on average speakers, and that it is possible to get sound like there is more speakers in the room from exceptional speakers in a good setup.
I only wonder if people dismissing stereo ever heard two channel playback in a pure audiophile, sound quality first setup.
 

par4ken

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I know that 5 speakers of that calibre would sound better than 2, my point was that stereo can sound great on high end speakers and than it is not necessarily inferior to surround on average speakers, and that it is possible to get sound like there is more speakers in the room from exceptional speakers in a good setup.
I only wonder if people dismissing stereo ever heard two channel playback in a pure audiophile, sound quality first setup.
I would have to agree with you on that. But if you multiply those exact same ultra expensive audiophile speakers by two or more then you really have something!

The problem with average surround systems is the poor quality of the surround speakers. Quality over quantity. (y)
 
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Rickenbacker

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At the top of the article, it mentioned it was a five minute read. It only took me less than a minute to determine he is a clueless, dim-witted clod.
Every time I have played a surround mix to a friend, the reaction ranges from favourable to jaw-dropping.

Can we start a "Go Fund Me" for the author? I'm not a doctor, but I get the impression that whatever crawled up his backside is clearly so far up there it will need medical professionals to remove it.
 

Tres Discrete

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I know that 5 speakers of that calibre would sound better than 2, my point was that stereo can sound great on high end speakers and than it is not necessarily inferior to surround on average speakers, and that it is possible to get sound like there is more speakers in the room from exceptional speakers in a good setup.
I only wonder if people dismissing stereo ever heard two channel playback in a pure audiophile, sound quality first setup.
I don’t think anyone here is dismissing stereo - audiophile or otherwise - we are dismissing the author’s dismissive statement “Music sounds awful in surround.”
 

boondocks

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I have been fortunate to hear one really high end stereo system, in a very large room with a 4 speaker setup (think more like a quad setup) and it was indeed impressive.
Discussing components, speakers, cost etc with the host I wondered aloud how much better it might sound with a surround setup but he was unmoved by my arguments.
It did indeed sound very good and I could see why my arguments held no sway with him.

But still...I suppose I've been hooked on surround sound since I discovered Quad back when and no way going back to stereo.

Although I was thinking that it's possible I've only ever owned one stereo AVR since my Quad days, bought on a tight budget just to get sound of any kind going at the time I relocated to my present abode, I think was a little JVC AVR with a pair of speakers included in the deal for about $600 circa early 80's.
Actually the speakers were surprisingly good for what I paid and I eventually gave them to a young work-friend as a sort of house warming present when he and wife bought their first home.

But I digress. Stereo can sound very good, as the point was made in an earlier post, especially if you throw some real money at it. But I would still take that money and go surround instead.
 

ar surround

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Well, tonight I had an example of surround/atmos experience from a high-end system using only two speakers. Wilson Alexia V speakers, on some material it sounded as if sound is coming from the sides, as well from the ceiling. $70000 dollars speakers can provide quite interesting stereo listening......:). Anyway, my point is that stereo only is no limitation when price is no object.
My (overblown)* stereo rig given the proper material (I.e. Eye In The Sky), and sitting in the sweet spot, can sound as if it’s playing in surround sound. There have been a few occasions when I was fooled and didn’t notice until I turned my head a bit. It has to do with phasing in the recording. With my now defunct Lexicon processor, when i downmixed a quad to stereo I still got all sorts of surround sound effects.

I don’t think one needs $70k speakers or even a system of my size to get a huge soundstage, but rather a properly set up system in a properly treated room and fed the right material will do.

* 53“ tall speakers fed by 400 wpc…ultra-mega-low WAF.
 

barfle

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I’ve heard pretty good stereo. Hell, I’ve heard pretty good mono, quad, and 5.1. And Atmos, although that’s still to come in my room (update coming soon, I promise). When I was a kid, back in my first 60s, my dad built a hi-fi with a Harmon-Kardon tuner preamp, a University coaxial speaker, and an amplifier of his own design (he was an electronic engineer). It sounded better than anything else I’d heard. Stereo was a new revelation, and when I was in the Army, after a few promotions, I had enough cash and good px prices that I could buy a halfway decent stereo system. A couple of years working for Altec-Lansing exposed me to an “audiophile” grade stereo (all electronics and speaker cabinets desogned and built by the engineer I worked with), and I understood how my Army-bought setup wasn’t all that great.

About that time, a neighbor had heard my setup, and decided to upgrade, and have me a couple of pretty tinny dipole speakers that I paralled with the fronts, and ended up with my first surround setup. It was interesting and pleasing, but definitely not high-end. I upgraded to being able to play SQ and have continued to improve ever since. Somewhere along the line, I got invited to a listening session of shellac 78s. This guy had almost as many 78s as Michael Fremer has LPs! And the recording of Jose Mojica sounded absolutely sublime.

Bottom line is that the performance matters to me far more than the equipment it’s played on. There are people who play music to listen to their equipment, qnd there are people who use their equipment to listen to music. While I may swing towards the former from topime to time, it’s really the music that matters most to me.
 

Todd 987

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I’m selling all my surround discs. This guy is funny. On the one hand he rips surround music and then goes on to say or imply when the tech catches up it could be a good thing. Respectfully sir, we are there!
 
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Going from Monophonic to Stereo one can hear a greater amount of separation of the instruments just because the speakers are separating and producing the sound on more channels without competing with each other. This is one of the main benefits of Stereo when it replaced mono. Another benefit of stereo is instruments can be recorded and enhanced by playing the same instrument on the different channels with only a slight phase shift in the two recordings. This sometimes yields a greater separation in the recording. The recording can also play with the effects of positioning the instrument anywhere in between the two speakers of stereo to have a greater effect. The listener can then be surprised by instruments moving between the speakers and this effect can add to the listening pleasure and lets the artist be more creative.

Introducing multi-channel/ Quad, you achieve more of the same benefits as going from Mono to Stereo, plus sculpting a resonance of the music hall for a live sound by an effect that stereo cannot achieve at all volumes and played in very different size rooms with very different acoustic properties.

Further, recorded music can be and usually is very different from a live performance. Live music usually does not use the phase shift technique to enhance separation. Live music does not usually have the same instrumentalist playing multiple parts of the same instrument, other than loop pedals and such. As a matter of fact some live performers have extra musicians playing those extra parts just to have the live sound seem more like the recording.

Listening to a concert is very different than listening to a recording, and as a musician myself, playing music with others is also heard differently than as an audience member either live or recorded. When playing music, I hear my own instrument more than I do others, but I usually hear a greater amount of separation coming from my right, left back and front than I would when I am just a passive listener.

Filling the room with music, for the myself as the listener, is what multi-channel/ Quadraphonic does and it is a much better experience for me.
 
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ar surround

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Bottom line is that the performance matters to me far more than the equipment it’s played on. There are people who play music to listen to their equipment, qnd there are people who use their equipment to listen to music. While I may swing towards the former from topime to time, it’s really the music that matters most to me.
Yes. A good bit of the material I listen to was meant to sound best on AM radio. :eek:
 

bookofsaturdays

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I disagree with this guy fully, but I still do value stereo listening almost as much as surround. Hell, I’d say most of my listening is in stereo be it driving to work, or listening on headphones late at night on Spotify.

I do believe you can achieve a very convincing 3-D soundstage with stereo. I’ve heard it first hand, but I wouldn’t spend the amount of money you’d need to achieve this in my setup. I’m perfectly fine with going over to other people’s houses and enjoying their stereo system, while investing in surround.
 

MidiMagic

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Here is a real setup I am trying to build with real rear firing speakers:

delay10v.png
 

barfle

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I have been fortunate to hear one really high end stereo system, in a very large room with a 4 speaker setup (think more like a quad setup) and it was indeed impressive.
Discussing components, speakers, cost etc with the host I wondered aloud how much better it might sound with a surround setup but he was unmoved by my arguments.
It did indeed sound very good and I could see why my arguments held no sway with him.

But still...I suppose I've been hooked on surround sound since I discovered Quad back when and no way going back to stereo.

Although I was thinking that it's possible I've only ever owned one stereo AVR since my Quad days, bought on a tight budget just to get sound of any kind going at the time I relocated to my present abode, I think was a little JVC AVR with a pair of speakers included in the deal for about $600 circa early 80's.
Actually the speakers were surprisingly good for what I paid and I eventually gave them to a young work-friend as a sort of house warming present when he and wife bought their first home.

But I digress. Stereo can sound very good, as the point was made in an earlier post, especially if you throw some real money at it. But I would still take that money and go surround instead.
I’ve posted a couple of times about a colleague’s home-built stereo setup. He made his own amps (tri-amped!) and speaker enclosures. That was around 1973 or so, when quad was just rearing its head. His room really couldn’t accommodate quad, and it was remarkably good without it, so he never went into multichannel playback. I didn’t have the investment in either time or money that he had, so upgrades to my setup included quad.
 

esimms86

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bah, i wouldn't give much credence to the witterings of a hippy in need of a haircut - if he got those luscious locks away from his ears he could start using them properly to listen without prejudice 😂

should he tackle such a subject in future he should probably learn to present his case based on actual facts to backup his misinformed opinion 🧐

ultimately i'm glad i don't bother subscribing to such drivel but thank you for the handy reminder by way of sharing it here! 👍
C’mon Adam, give the guy a break. He is, after all, an expert in the field, what with his bio touting a Bachelors Degree in English in 2018 as his sole credential.
 
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