Dutton Vocalion September 2022 Surround Sound SACDs (3)

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keywhiz

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In looking over Mark Anderson's invaluable Quadraphonic Discography listing of all Carpenter QUAD releases, it would seem logical that somewhere in the world there still exists those Carpenter QUAD masters ......



THE CARPENTERS -
A Song for You. A&M 8Q-53511 (Q8), Y8QAM-63511 (Q8) [UK],
SAML 934561Q (SQ) [New Zealand]
Close to you. A&M 8Q-54271 (Q8), Y8QAM 998 (Q8) [UK]
Horizon. A&M QU-54530 (CD4), 8Q-54530 (Q8)
Now & Then. A&M QU-53519 (SQ), 8Q-53519 (Q8), A&M 4D-1 (CD4)
[Japan], 4CHA (M)-15 (Q8) [Japan], 4CHA(R)-15 (QR) [Japan]
The Carpenters. A&M 8Q-53502 (Q8), Y8QAM-63502 (Q8) [UK]
The Singles 1969-1973. A&M QU-53601 (SQ), 8Q-53601 (Q8), 4D-22 (CD4)
[Japan], A&M SAMX 2112 (SQ) [Brazil]
And lets not forget how well Michael Dutton has done when only having Q8 copies available to work with.

If the Quads are gone, I'll will take a CD mastered from a good Q8 copy as the best way to preserve what is left.
 

4-earredwonder

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HIGHLY DOUBTFUL, Whiz, The Wizard of Watford would never remaster a QUAD SACD* from a Q8 tape. But if D~V could access those QUAD masters, if they DO exist, from Japan or even the UK [where the Q8s were mastered from], then we'd really be in business! After all, 2 of his recent Friends of Distinction QUAD SACDs were INDEED obtained from Japanese QUAD masters as they were never issued, even on LP, in the states.

*Most if not all of D~V's QUAD masters are from original 15 ips analogue tape sources!
 
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fredblue

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And lets not forget how well Michael Dutton has done when only having Q8 copies available to work with.

If the Quads are gone, I'll will take a CD mastered from a good Q8 copy as the best way to preserve what is left.
do we know that he used Q8s or is it just speculation? i think maybe he may have had opportunity to use discrete Quad tape replication masters or Safeties for something like "Sextant" and possibly 1 or 2 of the CTI titles where they stated the original master could not be located but i'm not sure they took domestic use/consumer grade Q8s as the source. if they did, i'd love to know how to get a Q8 to sound like their SACD of "Sextant"! wowzers! 😅
 

fredblue

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Unfortunately, according to Richard Carpenter himself all multitracks utilized in the creation of SINGLES were dutifully returned, as requested, to the UMG vaults and perished in the 2007 fire.

Ah, what could've BEEN!

As steelydave has suggested perhaps UMG Japan still has some of those CARPENTER QUAD masters safely preserved!
i'm guessing whatever tracks were used to make the 5.1 mixes (were they 16-track originals? maybe the odd 24-track i don't know?) may be stored on a hard drive somewhere. let's hope they made backups of the multi's at any rate! 🤞
 

keywhiz

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do we know that he used Q8s or is it just speculation? i think maybe he may have had opportunity to use discrete Quad tape replication masters or Safeties for something like "Sextant" and possibly 1 or 2 of the CTI titles where they stated the original master could not be located but i'm not sure they took domestic use/consumer grade Q8s as the source. if they did, i'd love to know how to get a Q8 to sound like their SACD of "Sextant"! wowzers! 😅
hmmm. You're probably right. I remember some here speculating that Sextant might have been sourced from Q8, but I don't recall the exact source ever being confirmed.

IIRC, all we were ever told was this:

N.B. In addition to both the original stereo and discrete quadraphonic mixes, the SACD and PCM layers on this disc include the original SQ-encoded quadraphonic mix [tracks 4-6]. The original discrete quadraphonic master no longer exists. Therefore, the best available discrete quadraphonic sources have been used for this reissue.
 

4-earredwonder

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i'm guessing whatever tracks were used to make the 5.1 mixes (were they 16-track originals? maybe the odd 24-track i don't know?) may be stored on a hard drive somewhere. let's hope they made backups of the multi's at any rate! 🤞
Unless R. Carpenter is being mum on the issue, AFAIK, he had to access all the Carpenter multitracks to remix SINGLES...and if he did make digital 'safety' copies he's not saying! Even though some studios in that time period [early 00's] were making digital safety masters of all their multitracks [MOST notably SONY with their DSD remastering], have no idea if UMG or even Warners were that diligent...probably focusing more on their STEREO and NOT QUAD analogue master tapes!
 

fredblue

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the Deodato SACDs are hissy and they use the original Quad master tapes 🙂

aamof, i noticed a really rather curious thing, there's very noticeable hiss that stops and starts with each track on both sides of the Deodato 2 Japanese CD-4 LP! the hiss is nothing to do with the CD-4 system because it magically disappears at the beginning and end and in the bands between each track!! its quite something to hear 🤯

(in other words i think the hiss may be baked into the mixes)
 

fredblue

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There's definitely some hiss (at least more than the stereo mix) on the Grover Washington Soul Box 4.0 layer.
there's some sorta warble as well, to me it felt like a copy tape but may well have been a Quad reel. either way i prefer it to the SQ LPs because its so much more convenient and its oh so discrete-o-matic too! 😋
 

4-earredwonder

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the Deodato SACDs are hissy and they use the original Quad master tapes 🙂

aamof, i noticed a really rather curious thing, there's very noticeable hiss that stops and starts with each track on both sides of the Deodato 2 Japanese CD-4 LP! the hiss is nothing to do with the CD-4 system because it magically disappears at the beginning and end and in the bands between each track!! its quite something to hear 🤯

(in other words i think the hiss may be baked into the mixes)
I was going to mention the DEODATO disc as well Adam ..... Hissy from the start. But once the music gets going and all those instruments swirl out of the rears ... the hiss becomes HISS....tory!
 

4-earredwonder

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Hissssssssssssssss. Generally, hiss does not bother me unless it is really bad like Ralph mentions above. Clicks, pops, too much compression, hot high end...those are worse sins for me.
Playing ALL my SACD discs lately DSD out into my all analogue Parasound P7 PRE~AMP and am really thrilled by what I hear ....... seems to tame a lot of anomalies present on some of those discs...and of course accentuates the really BAD ones. But I do find 99% of all my SACDs, especially those mastered by D~V, just sound STUNNING!

And don't get me started on ticks and pops and LOSSY codecs!
 
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esimms86

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Received my triple double (or is it a double triple?) in the mail today (here in Massachusetts). All arrived safe and sound with no cracks, as an exception to GOS's law. They were packed like a mini pyramid or how you would lay a set of three bricks; maybe that's the trick. :unsure: Have yet to have a listen but first I need to rip them to iso files. Should be a fun weekend!
 
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