eBay "Shockers" discussion (formerly Shocker Log)

[Clint Eastwood]

I'm not talking about the list price, I'm talking about the hammer price (what it sold for.. )

That one that was listed was never sold for $4,000...the seller couldn't even find it in their heart to give the buyer free shipping:ugham:...that really put me off...you would have to be "hammered to spend $1600 for that one

 

[der_angsthase]

This all got me thinking. What is it, other than brilliant sound, that drives these kinds of people? Let alone what drives someone to buy that specific album, in that specific format for a price one could go skiing for. Or on any kind of other holiday.

You know – in case of the Scorpions – there are plenty of other options for this specific album to choose from. There's a CD, DVD and even a Blu Ray; all with more or less the same content. And can Music, even for a die hard fan, be so good that it justifies shoving out 1.000 € or $ or more for ONE plastic disc?

Is it really that good? Can nothing else match it? Not even remotely?

For that price, and especially the other prices it was supposedly sold for, you could fly to Germany (from all over Europe) to a Concert of them, stay in a fancy hotel and listen to them front row. And maybe even get an autographed CD copy of the same album. And you'd still have something left over for the ones you love.

I mean, I've been there. I've payed ridiculous amounts of cash for other stupid things (girlfriends, booze, food). And I know that it's probably never good to ask such a subjective question in the first hand. But right now it kind of bugs me! :-D

What do you think?

– Moritz

 

[ji eff]

This all got me thinking. What is it, other than brilliant sound, that drives these kinds of people?

Probably a completist of some sort, the kind of "sick" collector Steven Wilson describes in his song "Index" on Grace for Drowning..
That.. or just plain vanity. (although I ain't rich... maybe it's just "candy money" for a grieving billionaire widower trying to puzzle back a part of his past :violin )


my 0.02$

 

[seilerbird]

Last week I found the Talking Heads Brick listed for $99.99 the day before payday. I decided to wait till the next day and pay cash on payday rather than use my credit card. That was a really really stupid idea, it was gone that afternoon.

 

[fredblue]

This all got me thinking. What is it, other than brilliant sound, that drives these kinds of people? Let alone what drives someone to buy that specific album, in that specific format for a price one could go skiing for. Or on any kind of other holiday.

You know – in case of the Scorpions – there are plenty of other options for this specific album to choose from. There's a CD, DVD and even a Blu Ray; all with more or less the same content. And can Music, even for a die hard fan, be so good that it justifies shoving out 1.000 € or $ or more for ONE plastic disc?

Is it really that good? Can nothing else match it? Not even remotely?

For that price, and especially the other prices it was supposedly sold for, you could fly to Germany (from all over Europe) to a Concert of them, stay in a fancy hotel and listen to them front row. And maybe even get an autographed CD copy of the same album. And you'd still have something left over for the ones you love.

I mean, I've been there. I've payed ridiculous amounts of cash for other stupid things (girlfriends, booze, food). And I know that it's probably never good to ask such a subjective question in the first hand. But right now it kind of bugs me! :-D

What do you think?

– Moritz

You'd probably be better off starting a separate thread..?

Its a great question!

Why do people spend so much money on that kind of stuff..

Ps. You've probably got it already but just in case you haven't and are curious, there's a rip of the Scorpions 5.1 'out there'.. its not bad, not worth anymore than RRP to me though.

 

[fredblue]

Last week I found the Talking Heads Brick listed for $99.99 the day before payday. I decided to wait till the next day and pay cash on payday rather than use my credit card. That was a really really stupid idea, it was gone that afternoon.

Sorry to hear that mate..

We find out the hard way "you snooze you lose" with this surround game..

I'll say it again; "they only made as many copies of this 5.1 stuff as they could sell".. :ugham:

Hopefully you'll find another "Brick" for your Talking Heads' wall come the next payday :upthumb

 

[fredblue]

Probably a completist of some sort, the kind of "sick" collector Steven Wilson describes in his song "Index" on Grace for Drowning..
That.. or just plain vanity. (although I ain't rich... maybe it's just "candy money" for a grieving billionaire widower trying to puzzle back a part of his past :violin )


my 0.02$

I might be offended if I were a different temperament..

Only joking!

I'm a proud collector (of many things, not just surround music) and derive great joy from playing/using (etc) things from those various collections of stuff.. though I do know people in different spheres who collect various things and never do anything with them ever, which is some seriously sickening vanity candy.. my tooth's not that sweet!

 

[bossfan]

Actually I think it was once listed at over $4,000...

There is one for $200.00 cdn near me.I bought the blue ray for 12.00

 

[fredblue]

There is one for $200.00 cdn near me.I bought the blue ray for 12.00

Aren't they different.. SACD is studio recording, Blu-ray is live performance w/video?

 

[bossfan]

I was talking about the blu ray of the Grace For Drowning and the blue box deluxe version..

 

[cupboy]

Does this count?

 

[krkier]

A compact disc?

-Kristian

 

[Snood]

A compact disc?

-Kristian

In original blister pack.....plastic has gone up in price

 

[seilerbird]

This all got me thinking. What is it, other than brilliant sound, that drives these kinds of people? Let alone what drives someone to buy that specific album, in that specific format for a price one could go skiing for. Or on any kind of other holiday.

You know – in case of the Scorpions – there are plenty of other options for this specific album to choose from. There's a CD, DVD and even a Blu Ray; all with more or less the same content. And can Music, even for a die hard fan, be so good that it justifies shoving out 1.000 € or $ or more for ONE plastic disc?

Is it really that good? Can nothing else match it? Not even remotely?

For that price, and especially the other prices it was supposedly sold for, you could fly to Germany (from all over Europe) to a Concert of them, stay in a fancy hotel and listen to them front row. And maybe even get an autographed CD copy of the same album. And you'd still have something left over for the ones you love.

I mean, I've been there. I've payed ridiculous amounts of cash for other stupid things (girlfriends, booze, food). And I know that it's probably never good to ask such a subjective question in the first hand. But right now it kind of bugs me! :-D

What do you think?

– Moritz

I can answer that question with some authority since I had a business selling records, CDs, baseball cards and football cards (different businesses) so I have been dealing with collectors all my life. Collectors are never interested in the item. They will claim they are but they are not. They are really not collectors, they are investors. They only buy because they think the price is going to go way up and they are going to get rich. Of course they only invest in things that have their interest, but still it is not about owning the item it is about a possible payday at some point in the future.

Case in point: I owned one of the very first CD players sold in the US, I bought it in December of 1983 less than 6 months after CD players were available for sale in the US. I bought a bunch of first edition CDs including the Japanese Abbey Road in 1984. 15 years later when I sold all my CDs and converted to mp3s I tried to sell my copy of Abbey Road. It was selling for around $500 at the time. Mine was in mint condition and I couldn't get $15 for it. No one wanted it. It didn't have the stupid OBI strip of paper. In case you don't know what that is, it is a worthless strip of paper that covers the spine of the CD package. It has nothing to do with the disc and no one in the US can even read it to understand what it says. But without it the CD was worthless.

 

[ubertrout]

I think that there's some collectors that just really don't mind shelling out serious money for the music that is their passion. But I think that for every item that commands such high prices, there are dozens for which it was asked where they don't sell.

Now, since we're doing this as a shocker non-log, I figure I'd put one in - the Esoteric SACD on Antonin Dvorak's 9th Symphony (AKA the New World Symphony) recently sold for $869 on eBay. This is a stereo-only SACD, about 40 minutes long, and it came with the OBI. Link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252326448521

From my perspective this is categorically insane...you can get numerous excellent recordings in excellent sound, with superior orchestras to the 1960s Vienna Philharmonic, which was still emerging from an era of postwar relative mediocrity, with conductors with their own insights to give - and with more music on the CD. Just to start you can get the Living Stereo SACD of Fritz Reiner with Chicago new and shipped for $10 (2 and 3 channel), and the modern DSD/surround recording of Ivan Fischer and his Budapest Festival Orchestra performing both the 8th and 9th symphonies for $17 new and shipped.

But clearly different people have different priorities. The eBay bid log shows 3 different bidders, all of whom were willing to pay $800 or more. For some people money is no object to having the ultimate version of their favorite recording. And while I don't share that attitude, I'm not sure I could fully refute it either.

 

[4-earredwonder]

I think that there's some collectors that just really don't mind shelling out serious money for the music that is their passion. But I think that for every item that commands such high prices, there are dozens for which it was asked where they don't sell.

Now, since we're doing this as a shocker non-log, I figure I'd put one in - the Esoteric SACD on Antonin Dvorak's 9th Symphony (AKA the New World Symphony) recently sold for $869 on eBay. This is a stereo-only SACD, about 40 minutes long, and it came with the OBI. Link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252326448521

From my perspective this is categorically insane...you can get numerous excellent recordings in excellent sound, with superior orchestras to the 1960s Vienna Philharmonic, which was still emerging from an era of postwar relative mediocrity, with conductors with their own insights to give - and with more music on the CD. Just to start you can get the Living Stereo SACD of Fritz Reiner with Chicago new and shipped for $10 (2 and 3 channel), and the modern DSD/surround recording of Ivan Fischer and his Budapest Festival Orchestra performing both the 8th and 9th symphonies for $17 new and shipped.

But clearly different people have different priorities. The eBay bid log shows 3 different bidders, all of whom were willing to pay $800 or more. For some people money is no object to having the ultimate version of their favorite recording. And while I don't share that attitude, I'm not sure I could fully refute it either.

Ubertrout, you're absolutely correct on ALL accounts and if one recalls, some of the Esoteric masters were derived from 96/24 transfers and NOT from the original analogue sources.

How people spend their $$$ IS their business but only a fool would pay such a king's ransom for this particular stereo SACD since the SACDs you cited from Reiner and Fischer are probably superior (and ridiculously less expensive).

Remember when Esoteric offered the Solti RING on multiple stereo SACDs for $800+ and then Universal released the exact same set on 1 BD~A complete with book for a fraction of the cost and posters actually preferred the sound of the BD~A to Esoteric's 'limited edition' SACDs {and BTW, it's now available for UNDER $60 from AmazonUS}. http://www.amazon.com/Wagner-Ring-N...ds=Solti+RING+on+blu+ray+audio&tag=acleint-20

 

[Lute]

I wouldn't be surprised if the buyer was from Japan. I regularly see used Esoteric SACDs go for high prices even at Diskunion in Tokyo. And Diskunion isn't in the habit of price gouging. Most of their used SACDs and CDs are very reasonably priced. Even mint condition, used SHM-SACDs can be bought for less than retail. I am not sure what's behind the Esoteric mystique, but they certainly do have a loyal following here.

Now, let's be fair. Esoteric fans aren't alone in being eager to pay outrageous prices for music. I have come across many many outrageously priced used LPs...which probably offer even worse sound quality!!!
And let's not forget all the over priced Pop & Rock SACDs, DVD-As, etc...

 

[4-earredwonder]

I wouldn't be surprised if the buyer was from Japan. I regularly see used Esoteric SACDs go for high prices even at Diskunion in Tokyo. And Diskunion isn't in the habit of price gouging. Most of their used SACDs and CDs are very reasonably priced. Even mint condition, used SHM-SACDs can be bought for less than retail. I am not sure what's behind the Esoteric mystique, but they certainly do have a loyal following here.

Now, let's be fair. Esoteric fans aren't alone in being eager to pay outrageous prices for music. I have come across many many outrageously priced used LPs...which probably offer even worse sound quality!!!
And let's not forget all the over priced Pop & Rock SACDs, DVD-As, etc...

Paying outrageous sums for OOP 'plastic' and 'Vinyl' and QUAD Open Reels (some going for as much as $1K on ebay) is a fact of life but IMO, I'd rather initiate 'rational' UPGRADES to my sound system than outlay such sums on music.......

And think how much new and HIGHER quality music one can buy for the price of ONE OOP outrageously priced ebay purchase. It simply boggles MY mind.

And you're correct Brett in assuming that Esoteric does (or must) have a loyal following to command such premiums for their discs. I, personally, NEVER bought into the Esoteric "mystique" and frankly, don't miss what I don't have. Makes one TRULY appreciate Pentatone's recent Philips/DGG QUAD remasters, beautifully packaged/annotated which I've been paying $11-13 on the average for and have NEVER been disappointed.

But then there's a market for EVERYTHING, I suppose. FOOL'S GOLD?

 

[Lute]

Paying outrageous sums for OOP 'plastic' and 'Vinyl' and QUAD Open Reels (some going for as much as $1K on ebay) is a fact of life but IMO, I'd rather initiate 'rational' UPGRADES to my sound system than outlay such sums on music.......

And think how much new and HIGHER quality music one can buy for the price of ONE OOP outrageously priced ebay purchase. It simply boggles MY mind.

And you're correct Brett in assuming that Esoteric does (or must) have a loyal following to command such premiums for their discs. I, personally, NEVER bought into the Esoteric "mystique" and frankly, don't miss what I don't have. Makes one TRULY appreciate Pentatone's recent Philips/DGG QUAD remasters, beautifully packaged/annotated which I've been paying $11-13 on the average for and have NEVER been disappointed.

But then there's a market for EVERYTHING, I suppose. FOOL'S GOLD?

I couldn't agree more, Ralph. I have slowly but steadily been collecting PentaTone's Quad SACDs. What a bargain! They are role models for the music industry...especially when it comes to reissuing old recordings.

Speaking of shockers, Penny Dreadful will finally be broadcast here later this month. :brew

 

[ubertrout]

And you're correct Brett in assuming that Esoteric does (or must) have a loyal following to command such premiums for their discs. I, personally, NEVER bought into the Esoteric "mystique" and frankly, don't miss what I don't have. Makes one TRULY appreciate Pentatone's recent Philips/DGG QUAD remasters, beautifully packaged/annotated which I've been paying $11-13 on the average for and have NEVER been disappointed.

I feel like in the classical realm the Pentatone quad remasters and RCA Living Stereo SACDs kind of get treated as if they must not be as good as the Japanese issues, merely because they go for regular prices. Nevermind that the RCA and Pentatone discs were all done from the master tape, something Esoteric can't claim.

This goes doubly so regarding modern recordings - I really enjoy some of the first-rate ensembles/interpreters on RCA Living Stereo. However, many of the Japanese issues are of second-rate interpretations from the 60s, and people are paying many multiples of what modern high-quality recordings go for. No clue why.