HiRez Poll Harrison, George - ALL THINGS MUST PASS [Blu-Ray Audio (Dolby Atmos)]

[4-earredwonder]

A 10++++ FOR SURE. As I was listening to the DOLBY ATMOS mix on my 5.1 set up, I was reading the excellent article "The Making Of ALL THINGS MUST PASS" in the August/September 2021 issue of Sound & Vision [A MUCH EXPANDED version of the article can be found on soundandvision.com] and reveling at the immense cast of who's who musicians which participated on the project. The MIND BOGGLES! And then there was this paragraph: "When it came time to create a new mix for the new 50th Anniversary release, George's son, Dhani and engineer Paul Hicks briefly considered a "de~Spectorized" mix, eliminating all the strong reverb and effects. But ultimately, says Hicks, it just doesn't sound right so a mix more faithful to the original was preferred."

And of course when listening to the entirety of George's GRAND OPUS, one REALLY wonders why Beatles Paul and John sorta squeezed him out of songwriting chores/contributions as pertains to the Beatles' albums. IMO, ALL THINGS MUST PASS has to be considered on par with some of the best, if not the best, of what the Beatles' core albums had to offer.

Sonically, I'm thrilled with Paul Hick's masterful remix of ATMP and quite agree with the choice of selecting DOLBY ATMOS as the de facto codec on which to play this BD~A ..... even on 5.1 equipped systems. But I'm sure it's an absolute thrill in FULL DOLBY ATMOS.

 

[tlake6659]

The atmos is preferred because it isn't as digitally compressed as the DTS 5.1 and the rear channels are at the proper level on the Atmos mix. The DTS rear channels are too low making it sound front-centric. Same issue with the Lennon Blu-rays.

 

[edisonbaggins]

The atmos is preferred because it isn't as digitally compressed as the DTS 5.1 and the rear channels are at the proper level on the Atmos mix. The DTS rear channels are too low making it sound front-centric. Same issue with the Lennon Blu-rays.

Define digitally compressed please. Dynamic compression?

 

[tlake6659]

Define digitally compressed please. Dynamic compression?

Yes dynamic compression.

 

[stobo222]

I think it sounds great! I have a couple of Dune boxes, and the navigation for this disc works poorly on both. Anyone else with this issue?

 

[4-earredwonder]

I think it sounds great! I have a couple of Dune boxes, and the navigation for this disc works poorly on both. Anyone else with this issue?

Even on my OPPO 205, I did find the navigation of the BD~A of ATMP FRUSTRATING. Next time, SIMPLICITY, SIMPLICITY, SIMPLICITY! And the sheer fact you cannot change the audio codecs from the remote is puzzling ... instead receiving the message "The disc doesn't allow it."

 

[hipp]

I have ripped the blue ray ATMP using DVD Audio Extractor. The relevant area that includes the 2 surround sound files shows as follows:
Dolby true HD 8 channels at 48khz sampling and the DTS HD Master 6 channels at 192khz sampling. That’s a big sampling difference per channel!
I play the files from my Windows 10 Server using ROON and using my 5.1 analogue ROON ready streamer then through a 5.1 analogue processor (ROON itself down mixing the 7.1 stream (not Atmos obviously) to 5.1 for my system.)
Thinking that the 192 would outdo the 48, I was surprised to,find the Atmos mix is more open more “discrete’, and the bass a bit tighter. Almost as if the Atmos mix has a greater dynamic range. (And I am listening to a downmix to 5.1 so they are both playing as a 5.1 mix).
Both mixes are excellent and both get a 10 from me.
BTW John Lennon is similar with it’s 2 mixes Atmos (7.1) being more ‘discrete’ but not as obvious.

 

[Sashaaa]

Okay so I'll admit that I haven't spent toooo much time listening to this new version of the album but I do have some first impressions.

The atmos and 5.1 is really awesome, certainly up there with the best. Everything is nice and descrete and it feels like a very natural way to expand this album to more immersive formats. It almost feels like the album was meant for this, especially with all of the layering and overdubbing in the music. It's still definitely a new take on the album, but a very good one at that.

The stereo on the other hand I really don't know what I think of it. They removed a lot of the reverb which is really dissapoiting to me because the whole wall of sound of the album is one of the biggest reasons why I like it. On the other hand though it's really nice to have a lot more deeper low end. I think that I'd optimally want the album with this new mix but with all of that original reverb, because without it, I feel like it goes against a lot of what the original album was going for. Also, the stereo is rather loudly mastered (could be worse to be sure, still not great though), which doesn't make me feel much better on it.

Still one of my favorite albums of all time, and definitely my favorite Beatles related record.

10/10 for the atmos and 5.1, and probably a 4/10 for the stereo.

 

[ngv99]

Superb discrete mix, amazing fidelity. The Atmos mix sounded better on my 5.1 system than the DTS-MA. As far as the stereo mix, I'll keep my digital rip of the Toshiba vinyl when I want that. This is nothing less than a 10.

 

[jimfisheye]

Disclaimer: I wasn't a big fan of the original. Probably the absolute amateur hour appalling mix from Phil Spector didn't help much!

I had the HD release of the stereo mix from a few years ago. Phil's work sounds really bad.

Listened to some of the stereo files first to see if there was any improvement. Oh... it can get worse?! Well then! Volume war loud, run away sub bass rumble, and an overall choked quality. I guess these are stereo reductions of the new mix and not a better copy of the original.

The 5.1 mixes are an improvement, I guess? Listening to the track Wah Wah, for example, the 5.1 remix is a night and day improvement! That original mess of a mix... just, wow. There's an overall choked quality. I hear how the sub bass went wrong in the fold down from this! There was a big struggle here! Better mixes, no question. Most of the original mixes, frankly make you reach for the stop button. But there's an overall sound of a big fidelity struggle over the whole thing. So... overall a huge night and day improvement and basically the first real release of an effectively unheard Beatles solo album.

And I mention some of that because once again I have to wonder if someone didn't deliver a full mix with no problems whatsoever and the fidelity damage comes from mastering blunders. The loud muddy stereo rumble fest they included sure suggests that.

Edit: There's a big huge bass bump in the front L/R! Boosted a good 10db in front of everything else. A low shelf up to 170Hz. (See comments below from 2nd listening session.)

 

[sjcorne]

I voted an "8" for the 5.1 mix. I think it's a good effort - certainly more adventurous than the recent Lennon 5.1's from the same mixing team - but you can definitely hear the limitations of the source material holding them back. It sounds to me like they compensated for the baked-in Spector reverb on the instrument tracks by making the vocals much louder and drier, which can be a bit jarring at times. It is pretty cool to hear some previously-obscured details, like the strings on "My Sweet Lord" and eerie backing vocals in "Let It Roll".

My biggest gripe is definitely the weird overabundance of low-end (I took 5 dB of bass out of the front channels for my digital copy), but one other thing I noticed that hasn't been mentioned yet is that the front soundstage is very narrow on most tracks. Drums, bass, horns, lead vocal, and slide guitar are almost always centered upfront, while the guitars are mixed wide out towards the back. I'd assume they purposely left a bit of the stereo guitar track in the fronts to mask this. I was also kind of disappointed that the backing vocals in "My Sweet Lord" came from the front channels instead of the rears.

 

[edisonbaggins]

Going with an 8 on this one. Content could be a wee bit stronger (double album curse). Package could deliver higher value. Must listen, though, if one can afford it.
LiS review:

 

[sjcorne]

Going with an 8 on this one. Content could be a wee bit stronger (double album curse). Package could deliver higher value. Must listen, though, if one can afford it.

Hopefully this isn't perceived as 'shooting the messenger', but I wouldn't necessarily say the Atmos/7.1 mix has greater channel separation than the 5.1 mix. The rear channels are definitely louder on the 7.1, no argument there - but that's only because the instruments that were fully confined to the front speakers in 5.1 (drums, bass, lead vocal, horns, etc) are evenly distributed between front and rear on the Atmos fold-down. The volume of the rear-panned elements (guitars, backing vocals, etc) is unchanged. I bet the drums & bass being moved to the center of the room is a result of them being assigned as objects in the Atmos mix, but that's merely speculation on my part.

If you listen to the 7.1 mix on headphones with the front channels sent to the left ear and rear channels sent to the right, you'll hear most of the instruments in the center of your head and a few only in the right ear. Conversely - If you listen to the dedicated 5.1 mix on headphones the same way, you'll hear most of the instruments in your left ear and a few somewhere between the center of your head and right ear. I knocked out some crude graphics below to illustrate this a bit better.

Atmos/7.1:


5.1:


As for the dynamic range - the 5.1 mix is definitely louder than I prefer, but I think the bass-heavy EQ is more to blame than compression or limiting. Pulling 5 dB of bass out of the front channels increases their DR value 2-3 points, depending on the track.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

I cant vote yet. I received the package on Saturday, and ripped everything that day. I ripped both the 7.1 and the 5.1 tracks so I could compare. Anyone have recommended audition tracks? I didn't bother with the stereo as I already have the 1st edition CD pressing (from back in the 80s?), and by the sounds of it, that betters the stereo tracks on this release. I did get to hear the demos and outtakes while driving in the car on Sunday. There is not a lot there that will get replays. Isn't It So Shitty is a hoot though.

 

[jimfisheye]

Google image search "Potato Jesus".
This is just a blunt example of the difference between the hand of the original painter and the hand of the "restorationist". (It was someone developmentally disabled.)

I hear that kind of difference between the mix and the "mastering" presentation here!
The mix is mostly still in here. It was just mastered by someone who apparently wanted to hear it as a bass bumpin in da club kind of thang. The person who mixed this did not do that final work. Just like we can obviously tell that potato Jesus wasn't made to look like that by the original artist. I obviously don't have access to any pre-mastered mix and I can't point to anything technical to prove it. I just know this is the case. The same hand and mind that made the mix moves contained in these tracks would not have made these mastering moves. This is "Potato All Things Must Pass".

The fronts have what sounds like at least a 10db low shelf boost from 170Hz on down. Kick and bass are bumping way in front of everything. The midrange meat is pushed into the next room. The center is a couple db too loud after that and that adds to the effect. The fronts are then hit with some limiting to allow the levels to come up a little too much and that further makes it front biased.

Pull the bass back a good 10db with a linear phase crossover eq.
Pull the center back 2db.
Turn your volume control up 6 - 10db more vs the original as delivered to listen to it.

This puts it more in the 1970s than the 2021 club scene. The mix is genuinely pretty darn good! There's a lot of midrange material. As there should be for something like this from 1970! Damn kids need to hear everything mid scooped nowadays so their soundbars don't fart out or something. I made these moves last night and the album suddenly became very inviting! And there's a really good immersive surround stage!

I have to say though, they still get a couple points for not doing the shrill high end eq blast that's in vogue right now! That does permanent damage. This would not have been possible to adjust into place as well in that scenario. Yeah, have even another point! Your mastering sucks and you should feel bad but I'm giving a few points for not taking the destruction to that level!

I really genuinely listened to this album for the first time last night. Not the Beatles by any stretch but there's good stuff in here! Phil Spector really ruined some highly acclaimed music. We got one back!

Did I say pretty darn good? I meant a stunning upgrade to the original wall of mud and saturation and noise that was originally released. Just what in the hell was going on in the scene back then where this Spector guy could turn in a mix so amateur and bluntly terrible and no one bumped it back or said a word?! "Potato All Things Must Pass" out of the box is still a stunning upgrade over the original mix, mind you! Maybe the mastering here is a nod of the head to Spector?

 

[Strilo]

I honestly don't understand why anyone would listen to any of George Harrison's music if they would use the phrase "embarrassing Hari Krishna garbage." His spirituality is such an integral part of his life, his music (Beatles and solo) that such a resounding rejection of it seems to reject the very essence of George and his work.

 

[markshan]

Going with an 8 on this one. Content could be a wee bit stronger (double album curse). Package could deliver higher value. Must listen, though, if one can afford it.
LiS review:

I haven't had a chance to listen yet, but it is refreshing to see someone give a new release something other than a 10. I think that people here often review these things from a place of excitement at a new issue rather than looking at it subjectively.

 

[markshan]

Pull the bass back a good 10db with a linear phase crossover eq.

Is it possible that someone forgot to -10 the LFE track? Has anyone done waveform captures on this yet?

 

[edisonbaggins]

Is it possible that someone forgot to -10 the LFE track? Has anyone done waveform captures on this yet?

FWIW, the bass sounds perfect on my Atmos system. Maybe the way the mix has been mastered caused problems for some set ups, but not others? Like, particulars about bass management and such?

 

[jimfisheye]

Is it possible that someone forgot to -10 the LFE track? Has anyone done waveform captures on this yet?

I had that same thought!
However, this is baked into the front L/R pair, not a too hot Lfe channel. So, not that.
And that boost extends up to 170Hz.

The most forgiving thing I can speculate is someone wanted to master this with a bumpin' club bass vibe. I guess I have to mention again though, points earned for not doing the ear bleeding high end eq boost that's in vogue!