• QuadraphonicQuad welcomes you and encourages your participation! Treat all members with respect. Please keep all discussions civil, even when you have a strong opinion on a particular topic.

    Do not offer for free, offer for sale, offer for trade, or request copies or files of copyrighted material - no matter how rare or unavailable to the public they might be. We do not condone the illegal sharing of music. There are many places on the internet where you can participate in such transactions, but QuadraphonicQuad is not one of them. We are here to encourage and support new multichannel releases from those companies that still provide them and as such the distribution of illegal copies of recordings is counter-productive to that effort. Any posts of this sort will be deleted without notification.

    Please try to avoid discussions that pit one format against another. Hint for new users: make liberal use of the search facilities here at QuadraphonicQuad. Our message base is an incredibly rich resource of detailed information on virtually all topics pertaining to surround-sound. You will be surprised at what you can find with a little digging!

J. Gordon Holt on Circle Surround

Help Support QuadraphonicQuad:

4-earredwonder

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Messages
12,374
Just found this tidbit from Brian Moura from 2014:


Acoustic Sounds is offering a deal on three Circle Surround encoded CDs on the DMP Label, starting at 99 cents.
They are:

Something Borrowed, Something Blue - Jerry Vivino (of the Max Weinberg 7) - 99 Cents
Jerry Vivino-Something Borrowed Something Blue-CD|Acoustic Sounds

DMP Surround Sounds Sampler - $1.99
Various Artists-DMP Surround Sounds-CD|Acoustic Sounds

Carved In Stone - DMP Big Band - $1.99
DMP Big Band-Carved In Stone-CD|Acoustic Sounds


Not sure how long these 3 CDs will last at this pricing. So drop by and check them out if you're interested.


Ironically, the Jerry Vivino Circle encoded CD is STILL available from Acoustic Sounds for $.99!Jerry Vivino-Something Borrowed Something Blue-CD|Acoustic Sounds
 
Last edited:

Sonik Wiz

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
QQ Supporter
Joined
May 30, 2005
Messages
1,044
Location
Kansas City
There seem to be a number of Circle Surround rack mount decoders , ones apparently aimed at DJs on fleabay at the moment. Starting at opening bids of $20.
Some new in box or claimed never used. Balanced ins and outs.

Yup I went looking for Circle Surround encoded music and found none. But I did discover this encoder/decoder pair.

$100.00 I wonder what age these units are? I'm not very familiar with CS stuff so I don't know the older units from new.
 

4-earredwonder

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Messages
12,374
Circle Surround, HDCD, Ambisonics UHJ Encoded discs, etc ..........not to mention Dolby Surround encoded CDs, ETC, ETC ..... It boggles the mind how many of these disparate decoders found their way into the market only to be short lived. HDCD probably produced the MOST physical discs [Reference Recordings is currently utilizing it for their RBCDs and RBCD layers of their mch SACDs] and of course the OPPO 203/205 series has eliminated HDCD decoding altogether so those searching for these decoders should choose wisely based on how many of these encoded discs one actually has in their collection and is it really worth it.

I can decode HDCD and Ambisonics but only have a smattering of Circle Surround RBCD discs [from the DMP label] and really have no imperative to add a decoder into my already overcrowded system. And then of course there's MQA encoded titles which streaming service TIDAL has added to their menu.

Here's a list of Circle Surround RBCDs, Cassettes and LPs: Circle Surround Discography

IMO, not a choice of titles I'd be in any rush to go out and buy!
 

par4ken

500 Club - QQ All-Star
Joined
May 28, 2011
Messages
583
Location
NW Ontario
MO, not a choice of titles I'd be in any rush to go out and buy!
You miss the point, I would not buy a circle surround decoder just (or at all) for decoding circle surround recordings either, but as a means of stereo enhancement I sure would. I even have a Roctron unit in one of my vehicles. It sure beets the crap out of Dolby PL for music! And at a bargain basement price! I do have other decoders such as the QSD-1, and even the Involve (evaluation board) and this compares favourably with them, maybe not better but not that far off, and the effect is adjustable. On the other-hand Circle Surround decoders with fixed settings IMHO are probably on par with Dolby.
 

jaybird100

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
QQ Supporter
Joined
Apr 27, 2006
Messages
1,054
Location
Pembroke Pines, FL
I have a Marantz receiver with Circle Surround built in. It does sound good with CS-encoded discs, but I also found it did interesting things with QS-encoded music.
 

J. PUPSTER

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
QQ Supporter
Joined
May 30, 2017
Messages
4,206
Location
CALIFORNIA (CENTRAL)
You miss the point, I would not buy a circle surround decoder just (or at all) for decoding circle surround recordings either, but as a means of stereo enhancement I sure would. I even have a Roctron unit in one of my vehicles. It sure beets the crap out of Dolby PL for music! And at a bargain basement price! I do have other decoders such as the QSD-1, and even the Involve (evaluation board) and this compares favourably with them, maybe not better but not that far off, and the effect is adjustable. On the other-hand Circle Surround decoders with fixed settings IMHO are probably on par with Dolby.
I also have a Marantz receiver with the built in CS-II; I’ve gone back and forth many times between it and the Dolby settings as to which sounds better (just different mostly.). For me it comes down to the source it’s feed. I once tried a Japanese Allan Holdsworth CD (Hard Hat Area) that is on Mark Anderson’s list for CS encoded, but found it to be very poor as to any discrete action. I still need to try one of those few titles that actually have the CS logo on them to evaluate how they sound. Chuck Loeb has one.
But at the end of the day; I still feel using the Involve mode on the Surround Master will almost always have more discrete sounding action.
 
Last edited:

Sonik Wiz

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
QQ Supporter
Joined
May 30, 2005
Messages
1,044
Location
Kansas City
I also have a Marantz receiver with the built in CS-II; I’ve gone back and forth many times between it and the Dolby settings as to which sounds better (just different mostly.). For me it comes done to the source it’s feed. I once tried a Japanese Allan Holdsworth CD (Hard Hat Area) that is on Mark Anderson’s list for CS encoded, but found it to be very poor as to any discrete action. I still need to try one of those few titles that actually have the CS logo on them to evaluate how they sound. Chuck Loeb has one.
But at the end of the day; I still feel using the Involve mode on the Surround Master will almost always have more discrete sounding action.
I would most interested in your opinion as to how a CS encoded disc sounds on the Surround Master. One thing I learned from reading the various CS threads is that it was designed at the encode & decode points for independent left/right surrounds. That makes me wonder if playback on the SM would even be an improvement over actual CS decoding.
 

jefe1

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
Joined
Dec 14, 2004
Messages
1,746
Location
Los Angeles
Is there a stand alone CS II decoder or are all the separate decoders only the original version?

I have also noticed CS encoded CDs and picked up a few at thrift stores but they are all classical music selections.
 

Sal1950

Well-known Member
QQ Supporter
Joined
Jan 3, 2020
Messages
185
Location
Central FL
What a shame Gordon couldn't have had more influence on the editorial direction of Stereophile.
Imagine what things might be like today if Stereophile had promoted the factual superiority of multich music instead of the ridiculous promotion of vinyl they have pursued for the last 2 decades.
 

tcdriver

Well-known Member
Since 2002/2003
Joined
Aug 2, 2002
Messages
182
Location
Valley of Heart's Delight
...I purchased a standalone Circle Surround decoder for a Quadie in Australia to beat the import tax and had the opportunity to demo it before sending it off. I found it was a great for up-mixing stereo and really enjoyed it. I had a Tate and and Ambisonic UHJ decoder with Super Stereo as a reference at the time.
Later I picked up a Kenwood receiver with Circle Surround 2 and noticed a great improvement to the early Circle Surround decoder. The receiver has many adjustmets such as center width you can tinker with.,
I used this setup for years and always used the CS Music mode. Much better than DPLII and Neo....
I too have used Kenwood receivers (VR-410, VR-507 and VR-509) with built-in Circle Surround for about twenty years with very good results. In my experience, the Circle Surround decoder usually, but not always, gives the best results synthesizing multi-channel from a two-channel stereo source compared to Dolby Pro-Logic, Dolby Pro-Logic II or the other sound enhancement modes. My neighbor has a Kenwood VR-7070A that has Dolby Pro-Logic II, Neo 6 and Circle Surround II. His experience is similar to mine in finding the Circle Surround II decoder produces the best synthesis results, on most recordings.
 

Mark Anderson

Moderator
Joined
Mar 16, 2004
Messages
821
Location
aRMANIA
Is there a stand alone CS II decoder or are all the separate decoders only the original version?

I have also noticed CS encoded CDs and picked up a few at thrift stores but they are all classical music selections.
I have only seen CSII incorporated in receivers, no stand alone units
 

par4ken

500 Club - QQ All-Star
Joined
May 28, 2011
Messages
583
Location
NW Ontario
After much searching I found some information on Circle surround encoding, just as I thought It`s not too far removed from QS. No blending of L&R front signals though and the rear encode coefficient for the opposite side is variable depending on the dominance of Ls or Rs, it can range from .707 to .501. Circle surround decoding was first and foremost designed for unencoded music reproduction through 4 or 5 channels. Video mode was developed latter. This white paper contains likely everything that you would likely want to know about CS. Naelectronic - Circle Surround
 
Joined
Mar 25, 2014
Messages
297
Location
Massachusetts
Yup I went looking for Circle Surround encoded music and found none. But I did discover this encoder/decoder pair.
I've actually got one of those CSD-07 decoders. I wasn't impressed with it's synthesizing capabilities when I tried it (expanded stereo), but I can't pin the blame for that on that model of decoder. I may not have had it set up or adjusted right, it may have been a faulty unit, and I didn't own any Circle Surround recordings at the time, so it didn't really get a fair try. I've now managed to find a whopping four Circle Surround CD's in second hand stores, and when I get my system set up again, I'll be giving it another try. The $100 that auction combo of both an encoder and decoder sounded like a good price. Less than I payed for my decoder alone.

There are indeed many different Circle Surround decoders out there. I've now got an RSP Technologies Circle Surround 5.2.5 on my list to acquire someday. By the way, if anyone should be interested in a CSE or CSD-07, watch out, they both come in two flavors: as -07 (analogue) and -07D (digital). You know, as I had to look up the suffix to confirm I had my information right, I just discovered that both types are stated to be CSII (!) in their sales literature. Even my manual for the CSD-07 states so (!).

Dang, I didn't think that CSII was available outside of a receiver either. . .
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Group builder
Top