Japanese qx matrix

[steelydave]

I had always assumed these were just another RM/QS rebrand, so I was kind of intrigued by the recent string of posts started by @bigbillquad 's post in the What Is Your Latest Matrix LP? thread, so the did some digging through old trade magazine articles and came across a bunch of news items that I think shed a lot of light on the development and chronology of this series.

A couple of the articles reference an April 1971 AES presentation by D. H. Cooper that forms the theoretical basis for this matrix - according to @Mark Anderson 's list of quad publications, this was "T. Shiga. M. Okamoto, and D. H. Cooper, "Dual-Triphonic Matrix Stereo System," presented April 27, 1971 at the 40th Convention of the Audio Engineering Society, Los Angeles, preprint 783.". It would be nice to get a copy of this paper so one (or some) of the more technically-minded people here could go through it and confirm for sure what sort of matrix this is. Do we have any AES members here who could search through the AES e-library for it? @DuncanS maybe?

The reason I think it's worth finding is because while (as mentioned above) some of the text inside the album sleeves references EV-4, Sansui claimed these LPs were QS in their "The Complete Works of QS 4-Channel Stereo" advertisements (which purported to list every QS title ever released) in 1973 and 1974 issues of Billboard Magazine.

Billboard Magazine, August 7th, 1971 - I believe this is the first announcement of the release of any of these QX titles

Billboard Magazine, October 2nd, 1971 - information on new Japanese quad hardware, mentioning that the QX system features a "special placement" of speakers.

Radio Electronics Magazine, October 1971 - mentioning the five-speaker layout of QX

Billboard Magazine, August 12th, 1972 - information about the history of QX with what sounds like a suggestion that it's being sold as RM when it actually isn't (?)

Billboard Magazine, May 12th, 1973 - Interesting news item that suggests Decca's classical QS releases are actually QX.

Billboard Magazine, August 4th, 1973 - another mention of QX being based on D. H. Cooper's "dual triphonic" research.

Billboard Magazine, August 11th, 1973 - article announcing that both King and Columbia were ceasing RM (QS) LP production. King would switch to CD-4 for the remainder of their quad LP releases, while Columbia would switch to their newly unveiled UD-4 format, which I believe is a kind of discrete-matrix hybrid.

Billboard Magazine, March 30th, 1974 - excerpt from Sansui's 3-page "The Complete Works of QS 4-Channel Stereo" listing all the Columbia QX releases.

 

[bigbillquad]

Hi. steelydave
Once again you have come through with more substantial information on this subject the LP I refer to is Q (P)-9013-ML and the date corresponds to the the date on your information.
Thanks Bill....

PS. I forgot to add that these QX LP`s do a grate job through my Sansui DS-D1000 QS & my SM v2. QS
discret instruments sound in the back channels and if a instrument goes from the FL to FR to BR to BL it does so convincely.
Bill...

 

[DuncanS]

I had always assumed these were just another RM/QS rebrand, so I was kind of intrigued by the recent string of posts started by @bigbillquad 's post in the What Is Your Latest Matrix LP? thread, so the did some digging through old trade magazine articles and came across a bunch of news items that I think shed a lot of light on the development and chronology of this series.

A couple of the articles reference an April 1971 AES presentation by D. H. Cooper that forms the theoretical basis for this matrix - according to @Mark Anderson 's list of quad publications, this was "T. Shiga. M. Okamoto, and D. H. Cooper, "Dual-Triphonic Matrix Stereo System," presented April 27, 1971 at the 40th Convention of the Audio Engineering Society, Los Angeles, preprint 783.". It would be nice to get a copy of this paper so one (or some) of the more technically-minded people here could go through it and confirm for sure what sort of matrix this is. Do we have any AES members here who could search through the AES e-library for it? @DuncanS maybe?

The reason I think it's worth finding is because while (as mentioned above) some of the text inside the album sleeves references EV-4, Sansui claimed these LPs were QS in their "The Complete Works of QS 4-Channel Stereo" advertisements (which purported to list every QS title ever released) in 1973 and 1974 issues of Billboard Magazine.

Billboard Magazine, August 7th, 1971 - I believe this is the first announcement of the release of any of these QX titles

View attachment 50207


Billboard Magazine, October 2nd, 1971 - information on new Japanese quad hardware, mentioning that the QX system features a "special placement" of speakers.

View attachment 50208


Radio Electronics Magazine, October 1971 - mentioning the five-speaker layout of QX

View attachment 50209


Billboard Magazine, August 12th, 1972 - information about the history of QX with what sounds like a suggestion that it's being sold as RM when it actually isn't (?)

View attachment 50210


Billboard Magazine, May 12th, 1973 - Interesting news item that suggests Decca's classical QS releases are actually QX.

View attachment 50211


Billboard Magazine, August 4th, 1973 - another mention of QX being based on D. H. Cooper's "dual triphonic" research.

View attachment 50212


Billboard Magazine, August 11th, 1973 - article announcing that both King and Columbia were ceasing RM (QS) LP production. King would switch to CD-4 for the remainder of their quad LP releases, while Columbia would switch to their newly unveiled UD-4 format, which I believe is a kind of discrete-matrix hybrid.

View attachment 50213


Billboard Magazine, March 30th, 1974 - excerpt from Sansui's 3-page "The Complete Works of QS 4-Channel Stereo" listing all the Columbia QX releases.

View attachment 50214

Due to CV-19 I'm down to a 4 day week until the end of June, so Fridays off, and it looks like it is going to rain here then. So Friday is a good day to have a hunt through the AES library for QX stuff.
I'll just go and check my AES membership subscription hasn't lapsed, my IEEE one has and it was supposed to be on auto-renewal!

 

[DuncanS]

I renewed my AES and had a quick hunt. From the Paper the Dual-Triphonic System

 

[winopener]

Seems to be a squared version of Dolby Surround, instead of
X...X...X
..............
......X.....


......X.....
X..........X
......X.....

 

[par4ken]

Seems to be a squared version of Dolby Surround, instead of
X...X...X
..............
......X.....


......X.....
X..........X
......X.....

Looks like the original Dyna Quad as well, just with the QS style phase shift. Dolby surround was really nothing new!

 

[MidiMagic]

I investigated this a couple of years ago.

They used acoustic tricks to combine the speakers instead of using the Dynaco diamond circuit.

The simple passive box had left and right speakers connected to the amplifier, two front speakers connected the same way, but were placed next to each other (acoustically matrixed), and two back speakers, each hooked across the hot terminals of the amp. but in opposite phase. Each back speaker was placed closer to the side speaker it was in phase with. Later they used just one back speaker. The controls are L-Pads.

The 90 degree phase shift was added later.

These were sold in 1971 and 1972.

Use any RM matrix to play the record (including Dolby Surround).

 

[Arconada]

Duane Cooper was the man behind the UD-4 (aka UMX) system. The system was basically a matrix system like RM, but it had extra information phase modulated to deliver a discrete listening experience. So, you could step in with a low cost matrix solution called BMX and upgrade it to a discrete system QMX later. The extra audio information was modulated on a carrier of 38 KHz, similar but not equal to CD-4. Cooper developed this system indepentantly. So if accepted, it could have changed the quad market. The commercial battle between SQ an QS decided differently. More info in Journal of the AES, June 72, volume 20 number 5 page 346

 

[par4ken]

I just wonder exactly why reference was made to EV-4 on a QX record insert, both being unrelated systems. Perhaps it's just to show that those records, which were likely the most prevalent in 1971 would sound good through their system?

 

[MidiMagic]

The basic RM or QM record can be played correctly on QS, EV-4, DQ, DY, DS, QX, and XM systems with at most moving some of the speakers or the listener chair small amounts.

They are all closely related systems.

 

[national-kid]

I have the following as a Vinyl/CD labeled QX.

1. 101 STRINGS-The Soul Of Spain Vinyl:Q(P)-9014-ML
2. Tokyo Cuban Boys-Dynamic Latin Vinyl:QC-9008
3. Hiroshi Ishimaru-Joy Of Music+Concrete Vinyl:QB-9002
4. Norio Maeda-Revolution CD:QIAG-70050

(4) has high reproducibility of the rear left and rear right.
However, (1 to 3) is close to monaural in the back,
and QX recording in the early days may be different from QS.

Incidentally,
"Soul Of Spain" had the notation "ELECTROVOICE STEREO 4 SYSTEM".

 

[Sonik Wiz]

I have the following as a Vinyl/CD labeled QX.

1. 101 STRINGS-The Soul Of Spain Vinyl:Q(P)-9014-ML
2. Tokyo Cuban Boys-Dynamic Latin Vinyl:QC-9008
3. Hiroshi Ishimaru-Joy Of Music+Concrete Vinyl:QB-9002
4. Norio Maeda-Revolution CD:QIAG-70050

(4) has high reproducibility of the rear left and rear right.
However, (1 to 3) is close to monaural in the back,
and QX recording in the early days may be different from QS.

Incidentally,
"Soul Of Spain" had the notation "ELECTROVOICE STEREO 4 SYSTEM".

Wow Tokyo Cuban Boys! I haven't thought of that name in years. I only heard some samples back in the 70's. My 1st introduction to J music, sort of. Really cool they put out something in quad even if it's not that great.

Still a big fan of YMO & all things Harry Hosono, Chisato Moritaka, Radwimps, TM Network, Ayumi Hamasaki, Every Little Thing, etc. Odd & a shame that so many good surround SACD's come from Japan but there are so many Western releases & nothing I can find of newer J music in surround.

 

[quadsearcher]

Wow Tokyo Cuban Boys! I haven't thought of that name in years. I only heard some samples back in the 70's. My 1st introduction to J music, sort of. Really cool they put out something in quad even if it's not that great.

Still a big fan of YMO & all things Harry Hosono, Chisato Moritaka, Radwimps, TM Network, Ayumi Hamasaki, Every Little Thing, etc. Odd & a shame that so many good surround SACD's come from Japan but there are so many Western releases & nothing I can find of newer J music in surround.

OK. Hosono! I somehow missed out on him until the past year (although knew YMO), now my soundtrack for afternoons at work or dinners at home.
Has anyone ever compared him to Kevin Ayers? I'm late to the party. Many of his albums could be great in surround, I'll try the SM.

 

[national-kid]

Wow Tokyo Cuban Boys! I haven't thought of that name in years. I only heard some samples back in the 70's. My 1st introduction to J music, sort of. Really cool they put out something in quad even if it's not that great.

Still a big fan of YMO & all things Harry Hosono, Chisato Moritaka, Radwimps, TM Network, Ayumi Hamasaki, Every Little Thing, etc. Odd & a shame that so many good surround SACD's come from Japan but there are so many Western releases & nothing I can find of newer J music in surround.

I once heard about "Cuban Boys" & "Sharps & Flats" live. (The vocal at that time was Hatsumi Shibata)
By the way, I think it was in the '70s that Japanese music was lively, evolved and was at its peak. However, mysteriously, in Japan, since the late '80s, music other than Japan has tended not to be handled so much on TV / radio. (Maybe it was because of that era) I think that the music form called J-POP suddenly occurred around that time.