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Karajan's 1975-1977 Beethoven Symphony Cycle coming to Blu-ray Audio...in Dolby Atmos

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Franklin

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Aug 10, 2013
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1,509
There's nothing in that announcement or the attached quotes to say it's a remix. Is it possible it's just an upmix? Other classical upmixes are already out there.
 

Franklin

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Aug 10, 2013
Messages
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Of course if you wanted all the Beethoven symphonies in genuine, honest to goodness quad your only real option is the complete, and rather fine, Rudolf Kempe set on EMI. I’ve had mine since buying it new in the mid-seventies (at some astronomical price):

View attachment 36005

I wonder if this was the reason that there was never a competing set from Karajan (also an EMI artist)?
1. What's the mix like?

2. Karajan was with DGM at this point, I believe.
 

Soundfield

900 Club - QQ All-Star
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Messages
923
Location
Essex, UK
1. What's the mix like?

2. Karajan was with DGM at this point, I believe.

Very much of the EMI house style of the time - a tight studio acoustic but with a realistic sense of space nonetheless. The Choral symphony is very impressive. These are excellent lyrical performances, Kempe was an underrated conductor without the bombast of Karajan.
 

Franklin

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
Joined
Aug 10, 2013
Messages
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I was listening to Beethoven's 6th yesterday from a 1958(?) recording conducted by Bruno Walter and when I played Karajan's 1963 (?) interpretation I think I felt the latter was more agressive. I've no idea about his 70's go at it though. Shame about the tape wow on the Walter conducted 5th.
 

McCrutchy

Well-known Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
Messages
118
Location
East Coast, USA
I received my copy today. I haven't had a chance to listen yet, but outside of Dolby Atmos (for which I have no capability), I can confirm that this is a 2xBD-50 set, with Symphonies 1-5 on the first disc, and Symphonies 6-9 on the second disc. While I'm unable to personally confirm that Atmos is present, I do see the Dolby TrueHD 7.1 core, which is 48/24, and the DTS-HD MA 5.1 and LPCM 2.0 tracks, which are both 192/24. Below is the BDInfo scan for both discs.

The second Blu-ray also contains two audio interviews with Karajan--one in German and the other in English--that were originally included on a bonus LP in some versions of the 1977 vinyl box set. The release comes in a trifold digipak with a booklet (the same style as the Quadraphonic Blu-ray Audio of The Planets) that contains a mixture of black and white and color photographs and a text essay in German and English, although there appears to be significantly more photos and scholarship in the booklet that was included in the vinyl box set.

BDInfo scan:

Please note that my standalone version of BDInfo does not display Dolby Atmos metadata, so I only see the Dolby TrueHD core. As I do not have Atmos capability, I cannot personally verify that Dolby Atmos is present on the discs as advertised, though obviously, I assume it is.

This release contains no video content, only static menu screens with a selectable tracklist.

Disc 1: Symphonies 1-5


Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                           
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
00000.MPLS                                                      AVC     2:44:31 39,287,322,624  39,298,718,076  31.84   0.95    Dolby TrueHD 7.1 5408Kbps (48kHz/24-bit)  DTS-HD Master 5.1 12704Kbps (192kHz/24-bit)
Code:
DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC1
Disc Size:      39,298,718,076 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes
BDInfo:         0.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00000.MPLS
Length:                 2:44:31.127 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   39,287,322,624 bytes
Total Bitrate:          31.84 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description   
-----                   -------             -----------   
MPEG-4 AVC Video        950 kbps            1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description   
-----                           --------        -------         -----------   
Dolby TrueHD Audio              German          5408 kbps       7.1 / 48 kHz / 5408 kbps / 24-bit (AC3 Embedded: 5.1-EX / 48 kHz / 640 kbps)
DTS-HD Master Audio             German          12704 kbps      5.1 / 192 kHz / 12704 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
LPCM Audio                      German          9216 kbps       2.0 / 192 kHz / 9216 kbps / 24-bit

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate 
----            -------         ------          ----            ------------- 
00000.M2TS      0:00:00.000     0:23:22.734     5,621,821,440   32,062        
00001.M2TS      0:23:22.734     0:30:28.459     7,423,180,800   32,478        
00002.M2TS      0:53:51.194     0:48:09.920     11,437,977,600  31,663        
00003.M2TS      1:42:01.114     0:32:23.908     7,581,038,592   31,199        
00004.M2TS      2:14:25.023     0:30:06.104     7,223,304,192   31,995        

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------
1               0:00:00.000     0:07:51.637     950 kbps        1,353 kbps      00:07:50.069    1,031 kbps      00:07:46.065    990 kbps        00:07:41.060    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:00:00.967  
2               0:07:51.637     0:06:07.133     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      00:13:56.902    1,073 kbps      00:13:52.898    1,011 kbps      00:13:47.893    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:07:52.605  
3               0:13:58.771     0:03:41.020     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      00:17:37.890    1,077 kbps      00:17:33.886    1,013 kbps      00:17:28.881    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:13:59.738  
4               0:17:39.792     0:05:42.942     950 kbps        1,514 kbps      00:23:20.932    1,063 kbps      00:23:16.928    1,006 kbps      00:23:11.923    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:17:40.759  
5               0:23:22.734     0:10:19.652     950 kbps        1,302 kbps      00:33:40.852    1,020 kbps      00:33:36.848    985 kbps        00:33:31.843    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:23:23.702  
6               0:33:42.387     0:10:00.833     950 kbps        1,373 kbps      00:43:41.585    1,035 kbps      00:43:37.581    992 kbps        00:43:32.576    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:33:43.354  
7               0:43:43.220     0:03:43.022     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      00:47:24.341    1,077 kbps      00:47:20.337    1,013 kbps      00:47:15.332    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:43:44.188  
8               0:47:26.243     0:06:24.951     950 kbps        1,494 kbps      00:53:49.426    1,059 kbps      00:53:45.422    1,004 kbps      00:53:40.417    3,962 bytes     89,916 bytes    00:47:27.211  
9               0:53:51.194     0:13:33.078     950 kbps        1,403 kbps      01:07:22.705    1,041 kbps      01:07:18.701    995 kbps        01:07:13.696    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:53:52.162  
10              1:07:24.273     0:16:33.826     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      01:23:56.164    1,077 kbps      01:23:52.160    1,013 kbps      01:23:47.155    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:07:25.241  
11              1:23:58.099     0:06:12.905     950 kbps        1,494 kbps      01:30:09.270    1,059 kbps      01:30:05.266    1,004 kbps      01:30:00.261    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:23:59.067  
12              1:30:11.005     0:11:50.109     950 kbps        1,443 kbps      01:41:59.413    1,049 kbps      01:41:55.409    999 kbps        01:41:50.404    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:30:11.973  
13              1:42:01.114     0:10:32.732     950 kbps        1,333 kbps      01:52:32.345    1,027 kbps      01:52:28.341    988 kbps        01:52:23.336    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:42:02.082  
14              1:52:33.847     0:10:05.338     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      02:02:37.349    1,073 kbps      02:02:33.345    1,011 kbps      02:02:28.340    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:52:34.814  
15              2:02:39.185     0:05:53.786     950 kbps        1,443 kbps      02:08:31.236    1,049 kbps      02:08:27.232    999 kbps        02:08:22.227    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    02:02:40.152  
16              2:08:32.971     0:05:52.051     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      02:14:23.221    1,069 kbps      02:14:19.217    1,009 kbps      02:14:14.212    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:08:33.939  
17              2:14:25.023     0:07:10.596     950 kbps        1,353 kbps      02:21:34.052    1,031 kbps      02:21:30.048    990 kbps        02:21:25.043    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:14:25.991  
18              2:21:35.620     0:09:35.241     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      02:31:09.093    1,069 kbps      02:31:05.089    1,009 kbps      02:31:00.084    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:21:36.588  
19              2:31:10.861     0:04:38.077     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      02:35:47.037    1,077 kbps      02:35:43.033    1,013 kbps      02:35:38.028    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    02:31:11.829  
20              2:35:48.939     0:08:42.188     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      02:44:29.359    1,069 kbps      02:44:25.355    1,009 kbps      02:44:20.350    3,963 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:35:49.907  

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets       
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----         
00000.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1402.601                950                     166,577,551     910,869       
00000.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1402.601                6,137                   1,075,980,864   6,828,126     
00000.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1402.601                12,907                  2,262,865,048   12,516,679    
00000.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1402.601                9,223                   1,617,090,200   8,977,600     
00001.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1828.327                950                     217,133,281     1,187,315     
00001.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1828.327                6,409                   1,464,720,476   9,263,696     
00001.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1828.327                13,013                  2,974,002,364   16,447,877    
00001.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1828.327                9,223                   2,107,860,216   11,702,208    
00002.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     2889.787                950                     343,183,827     1,876,576     
00002.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            2889.787                5,943                   2,146,849,174   13,894,180    
00002.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            2889.787                12,612                  4,555,669,364   25,209,516    
00002.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            2889.787                9,223                   3,331,534,360   18,495,680    
00003.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1943.775                950                     230,843,042     1,262,283     
00003.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1943.775                5,721                   1,389,958,898   9,030,541     
00003.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1943.775                12,404                  3,013,735,368   16,685,565    
00003.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1943.775                9,223                   2,240,939,448   12,441,024    
00004.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1805.971                950                     214,478,501     1,172,798     
00004.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1805.971                6,138                   1,385,631,236   8,956,775     
00004.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1805.971                12,711                  2,869,516,148   15,872,496    
00004.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1805.971                9,223                   2,082,020,204   11,558,752
Disc 2: Symphonies 6-9

Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                           
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
00000.MPLS                                                      AVC     2:44:01 39,009,165,312  44,580,758,644  31.71   0.95    Dolby TrueHD 7.1 5448Kbps (48kHz/24-bit)  DTS-HD Master 5.1 12554Kbps (192kHz/24-bit)
Code:
DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC2
Disc Size:      44,580,758,644 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes
BDInfo:         0.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00000.MPLS
Length:                 2:44:01.531 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   39,009,165,312 bytes
Total Bitrate:          31.71 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description   
-----                   -------             -----------   
MPEG-4 AVC Video        950 kbps            1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description   
-----                           --------        -------         -----------   
Dolby TrueHD Audio              German          5448 kbps       7.1 / 48 kHz / 5448 kbps / 24-bit (AC3 Embedded: 5.1-EX / 48 kHz / 640 kbps)
DTS-HD Master Audio             German          12554 kbps      5.1 / 192 kHz / 12554 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
LPCM Audio                      German          9216 kbps       2.0 / 192 kHz / 9216 kbps / 24-bit

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate 
----            -------         ------          ----            ------------- 
00000.M2TS      0:00:00.000     0:38:35.980     9,115,963,392   31,489        
00001.M2TS      0:38:35.980     0:33:31.509     7,983,949,824   31,753        
00002.M2TS      1:12:07.489     0:24:52.624     5,921,839,104   31,739        
00003.M2TS      1:37:00.114     1:07:01.417     15,987,412,992  31,805        

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------
1               0:00:00.000     0:09:12.084     950 kbps        1,494 kbps      00:09:10.349    1,059 kbps      00:09:06.345    1,004 kbps      00:09:01.340    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:00:00.967  
2               0:09:12.084     0:11:28.287     950 kbps        1,514 kbps      00:20:38.570    1,063 kbps      00:20:34.566    1,006 kbps      00:20:29.561    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:09:13.052  
3               0:20:40.372     0:05:41.040     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      00:26:19.611    1,069 kbps      00:26:15.607    1,009 kbps      00:26:10.602    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:20:41.340  
4               0:26:21.413     0:03:29.542     950 kbps        1,423 kbps      00:29:49.320    1,045 kbps      00:29:45.316    997 kbps        00:29:40.311    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:26:22.380  
5               0:29:50.955     0:08:45.024     950 kbps        1,474 kbps      00:38:34.278    1,055 kbps      00:38:30.274    1,002 kbps      00:38:25.269    3,962 bytes     89,945 bytes    00:29:51.923  
6               0:38:35.980     0:11:29.689     950 kbps        960 kbps        00:38:36.013    952 kbps        00:38:36.013    951 kbps        00:38:36.013    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:38:36.947  
7               0:50:05.669     0:08:03.349     950 kbps        1,607 kbps      00:58:07.050    1,081 kbps      00:58:03.046    1,016 kbps      00:57:58.041    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:50:06.636  
8               0:58:09.018     0:07:20.173     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      01:05:27.356    1,073 kbps      01:05:23.352    1,011 kbps      01:05:18.347    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    00:58:09.986  
9               1:05:29.191     0:06:38.297     950 kbps        1,607 kbps      01:12:05.487    1,081 kbps      01:12:01.483    1,016 kbps      01:11:56.478    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:05:30.159  
10              1:12:07.489     0:08:59.238     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      01:21:04.926    1,069 kbps      01:21:00.922    1,009 kbps      01:20:55.917    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:12:08.457  
11              1:21:06.728     0:03:51.497     950 kbps        1,403 kbps      01:24:56.658    1,041 kbps      01:24:52.654    995 kbps        01:24:47.649    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:21:07.696  
12              1:24:58.226     0:05:19.318     950 kbps        960 kbps        01:24:58.259    952 kbps        01:24:58.259    951 kbps        01:24:58.259    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:24:59.194  
13              1:30:17.545     0:06:42.568     950 kbps        1,353 kbps      01:36:58.546    1,031 kbps      01:36:54.542    990 kbps        01:36:49.537    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:30:18.513  
14              1:37:00.114     0:15:23.656     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      01:52:21.935    1,073 kbps      01:52:17.931    1,011 kbps      01:52:12.926    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:37:01.081  
15              1:52:23.770     0:10:09.909     950 kbps        1,403 kbps      02:02:32.078    1,041 kbps      02:02:28.074    995 kbps        02:02:23.069    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:52:24.737  
16              2:02:33.679     0:16:57.016     950 kbps        960 kbps        02:02:33.713    952 kbps        02:02:33.713    951 kbps        02:02:33.713    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    02:02:34.647  
17              2:19:30.695     0:06:27.887     950 kbps        1,474 kbps      02:25:56.881    1,055 kbps      02:25:52.877    1,002 kbps      02:25:47.872    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:19:31.663  
18              2:25:58.583     0:18:02.948     950 kbps        1,607 kbps      02:43:59.563    1,081 kbps      02:43:55.559    1,016 kbps      02:43:50.554    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:25:59.550  

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets       
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----         
00000.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     2315.847                950                     275,027,300     1,503,888     
00000.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            2315.847                6,068                   1,756,472,746   11,219,330    
00000.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            2315.847                12,391                  3,587,059,256   19,855,993    
00000.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            2315.847                9,223                   2,669,838,688   14,822,144    
00001.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     2011.376                950                     238,870,780     1,306,178     
00001.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            2011.376                6,158                   1,548,302,594   9,904,951     
00001.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            2011.376                12,526                  3,149,200,012   17,430,803    
00001.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            2011.376                9,223                   2,318,880,256   12,873,728    
00002.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1492.491                950                     177,252,144     969,240       
00002.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1492.491                6,233                   1,162,874,638   7,462,626     
00002.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1492.491                12,402                  2,313,825,116   12,808,159    
00002.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1492.491                9,223                   1,720,703,864   9,552,832     
00003.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     4021.284                950                     477,551,363     2,611,314     
00003.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            4021.284                6,011                   3,021,563,378   19,403,341    
00003.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            4021.284                12,721                  6,394,311,320   35,381,584    
00003.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            4021.284                9,223                   4,635,841,100   25,736,800
Das Interview - Herbert von Karajan im gespräch mit Joachim Kaiser

Code:
QUICK SUMMARY:

Disc Title: DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC2
Disc Size: 44,580,758,644 bytes
Protection: AACS
BD-Java: Yes
Playlist: 00001.MPLS
Size: 3,066,734,592 bytes
Length: 0:16:03.996
Total Bitrate: 25.45 Mbps
Video: MPEG-4 AVC Video / 21961 kbps / 1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1
Audio: German / LPCM Audio / 2.0 / 48 kHz / 2304 kbps / 24-bit
Karajan in conversation - Herbert von Karajan talks to Richard Osborne (presented in English, not German)

Code:
QUICK SUMMARY:

Disc Title: DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC2
Disc Size: 44,580,758,644 bytes
Protection: AACS
BD-Java: Yes
Playlist: 00002.MPLS
Size: 2,493,007,872 bytes
Length: 0:13:33.813
Total Bitrate: 24.51 Mbps
Video: MPEG-4 AVC Video / 21060 kbps / 1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1
Audio: German / LPCM Audio / 2.0 / 48 kHz / 2304 kbps / 24-bit
 

4-earredwonder

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Messages
13,893
I received my copy today. I haven't had a chance to listen yet, but outside of Dolby Atmos (for which I have no capability), I can confirm that this is a 2xBD-50 set, with Symphonies 1-5 on the first disc, and Symphonies 6-9 on the second disc. While I'm unable to personally confirm that Atmos is present, I do see the Dolby TrueHD 7.1 core, which is 48/24, and the DTS-HD MA 5.1 and LPCM 2.0 tracks, which are both 192/24. Below is the BDInfo scan for both discs.

The second Blu-ray also contains two audio interviews with Karajan--one in German and the other in English--that were originally included on a bonus LP in some versions of the 1977 vinyl box set. The release comes in a trifold digipak with a booklet (the same style as the Quadraphonic Blu-ray Audio of The Planets) that contains a mixture of black and white and color photographs and a text essay in German and English, although there appears to be significantly more photos and scholarship in the booklet that was included in the vinyl box set.

BDInfo scan:

Please note that my standalone version of BDInfo does not display Dolby Atmos metadata, so I only see the Dolby TrueHD core. As I do not have Atmos capability, I cannot personally verify that Dolby Atmos is present on the discs as advertised, though obviously, I assume it is.

This release contains no video content, only static menu screens with a selectable tracklist.

Disc 1: Symphonies 1-5


Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                        
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
00000.MPLS                                                      AVC     2:44:31 39,287,322,624  39,298,718,076  31.84   0.95    Dolby TrueHD 7.1 5408Kbps (48kHz/24-bit)  DTS-HD Master 5.1 12704Kbps (192kHz/24-bit)
Code:
DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC1
Disc Size:      39,298,718,076 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes
BDInfo:         0.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00000.MPLS
Length:                 2:44:31.127 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   39,287,322,624 bytes
Total Bitrate:          31.84 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description
-----                   -------             -----------
MPEG-4 AVC Video        950 kbps            1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description
-----                           --------        -------         -----------
Dolby TrueHD Audio              German          5408 kbps       7.1 / 48 kHz / 5408 kbps / 24-bit (AC3 Embedded: 5.1-EX / 48 kHz / 640 kbps)
DTS-HD Master Audio             German          12704 kbps      5.1 / 192 kHz / 12704 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
LPCM Audio                      German          9216 kbps       2.0 / 192 kHz / 9216 kbps / 24-bit

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate
----            -------         ------          ----            -------------
00000.M2TS      0:00:00.000     0:23:22.734     5,621,821,440   32,062     
00001.M2TS      0:23:22.734     0:30:28.459     7,423,180,800   32,478     
00002.M2TS      0:53:51.194     0:48:09.920     11,437,977,600  31,663     
00003.M2TS      1:42:01.114     0:32:23.908     7,581,038,592   31,199     
00004.M2TS      2:14:25.023     0:30:06.104     7,223,304,192   31,995     

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------
1               0:00:00.000     0:07:51.637     950 kbps        1,353 kbps      00:07:50.069    1,031 kbps      00:07:46.065    990 kbps        00:07:41.060    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:00:00.967
2               0:07:51.637     0:06:07.133     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      00:13:56.902    1,073 kbps      00:13:52.898    1,011 kbps      00:13:47.893    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:07:52.605
3               0:13:58.771     0:03:41.020     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      00:17:37.890    1,077 kbps      00:17:33.886    1,013 kbps      00:17:28.881    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:13:59.738
4               0:17:39.792     0:05:42.942     950 kbps        1,514 kbps      00:23:20.932    1,063 kbps      00:23:16.928    1,006 kbps      00:23:11.923    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:17:40.759
5               0:23:22.734     0:10:19.652     950 kbps        1,302 kbps      00:33:40.852    1,020 kbps      00:33:36.848    985 kbps        00:33:31.843    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:23:23.702
6               0:33:42.387     0:10:00.833     950 kbps        1,373 kbps      00:43:41.585    1,035 kbps      00:43:37.581    992 kbps        00:43:32.576    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:33:43.354
7               0:43:43.220     0:03:43.022     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      00:47:24.341    1,077 kbps      00:47:20.337    1,013 kbps      00:47:15.332    3,962 bytes     89,918 bytes    00:43:44.188
8               0:47:26.243     0:06:24.951     950 kbps        1,494 kbps      00:53:49.426    1,059 kbps      00:53:45.422    1,004 kbps      00:53:40.417    3,962 bytes     89,916 bytes    00:47:27.211
9               0:53:51.194     0:13:33.078     950 kbps        1,403 kbps      01:07:22.705    1,041 kbps      01:07:18.701    995 kbps        01:07:13.696    3,962 bytes     89,917 bytes    00:53:52.162
10              1:07:24.273     0:16:33.826     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      01:23:56.164    1,077 kbps      01:23:52.160    1,013 kbps      01:23:47.155    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:07:25.241
11              1:23:58.099     0:06:12.905     950 kbps        1,494 kbps      01:30:09.270    1,059 kbps      01:30:05.266    1,004 kbps      01:30:00.261    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:23:59.067
12              1:30:11.005     0:11:50.109     950 kbps        1,443 kbps      01:41:59.413    1,049 kbps      01:41:55.409    999 kbps        01:41:50.404    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:30:11.973
13              1:42:01.114     0:10:32.732     950 kbps        1,333 kbps      01:52:32.345    1,027 kbps      01:52:28.341    988 kbps        01:52:23.336    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:42:02.082
14              1:52:33.847     0:10:05.338     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      02:02:37.349    1,073 kbps      02:02:33.345    1,011 kbps      02:02:28.340    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:52:34.814
15              2:02:39.185     0:05:53.786     950 kbps        1,443 kbps      02:08:31.236    1,049 kbps      02:08:27.232    999 kbps        02:08:22.227    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    02:02:40.152
16              2:08:32.971     0:05:52.051     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      02:14:23.221    1,069 kbps      02:14:19.217    1,009 kbps      02:14:14.212    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:08:33.939
17              2:14:25.023     0:07:10.596     950 kbps        1,353 kbps      02:21:34.052    1,031 kbps      02:21:30.048    990 kbps        02:21:25.043    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:14:25.991
18              2:21:35.620     0:09:35.241     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      02:31:09.093    1,069 kbps      02:31:05.089    1,009 kbps      02:31:00.084    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:21:36.588
19              2:31:10.861     0:04:38.077     950 kbps        1,584 kbps      02:35:47.037    1,077 kbps      02:35:43.033    1,013 kbps      02:35:38.028    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    02:31:11.829
20              2:35:48.939     0:08:42.188     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      02:44:29.359    1,069 kbps      02:44:25.355    1,009 kbps      02:44:20.350    3,963 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:35:49.907

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets    
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----      
00000.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1402.601                950                     166,577,551     910,869    
00000.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1402.601                6,137                   1,075,980,864   6,828,126  
00000.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1402.601                12,907                  2,262,865,048   12,516,679 
00000.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1402.601                9,223                   1,617,090,200   8,977,600  
00001.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1828.327                950                     217,133,281     1,187,315  
00001.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1828.327                6,409                   1,464,720,476   9,263,696  
00001.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1828.327                13,013                  2,974,002,364   16,447,877 
00001.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1828.327                9,223                   2,107,860,216   11,702,208 
00002.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     2889.787                950                     343,183,827     1,876,576  
00002.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            2889.787                5,943                   2,146,849,174   13,894,180 
00002.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            2889.787                12,612                  4,555,669,364   25,209,516 
00002.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            2889.787                9,223                   3,331,534,360   18,495,680 
00003.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1943.775                950                     230,843,042     1,262,283  
00003.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1943.775                5,721                   1,389,958,898   9,030,541  
00003.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1943.775                12,404                  3,013,735,368   16,685,565 
00003.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1943.775                9,223                   2,240,939,448   12,441,024 
00004.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1805.971                950                     214,478,501     1,172,798  
00004.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1805.971                6,138                   1,385,631,236   8,956,775  
00004.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1805.971                12,711                  2,869,516,148   15,872,496 
00004.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1805.971                9,223                   2,082,020,204   11,558,752
Disc 2: Symphonies 6-9

Code:
                                                                                                                Total   Video                                        
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
00000.MPLS                                                      AVC     2:44:01 39,009,165,312  44,580,758,644  31.71   0.95    Dolby TrueHD 7.1 5448Kbps (48kHz/24-bit)  DTS-HD Master 5.1 12554Kbps (192kHz/24-bit)
Code:
DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC2
Disc Size:      44,580,758,644 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes
BDInfo:         0.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00000.MPLS
Length:                 2:44:01.531 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   39,009,165,312 bytes
Total Bitrate:          31.71 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description
-----                   -------             -----------
MPEG-4 AVC Video        950 kbps            1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description
-----                           --------        -------         -----------
Dolby TrueHD Audio              German          5448 kbps       7.1 / 48 kHz / 5448 kbps / 24-bit (AC3 Embedded: 5.1-EX / 48 kHz / 640 kbps)
DTS-HD Master Audio             German          12554 kbps      5.1 / 192 kHz / 12554 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
LPCM Audio                      German          9216 kbps       2.0 / 192 kHz / 9216 kbps / 24-bit

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate
----            -------         ------          ----            -------------
00000.M2TS      0:00:00.000     0:38:35.980     9,115,963,392   31,489     
00001.M2TS      0:38:35.980     0:33:31.509     7,983,949,824   31,753     
00002.M2TS      1:12:07.489     0:24:52.624     5,921,839,104   31,739     
00003.M2TS      1:37:00.114     1:07:01.417     15,987,412,992  31,805     

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------
1               0:00:00.000     0:09:12.084     950 kbps        1,494 kbps      00:09:10.349    1,059 kbps      00:09:06.345    1,004 kbps      00:09:01.340    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:00:00.967
2               0:09:12.084     0:11:28.287     950 kbps        1,514 kbps      00:20:38.570    1,063 kbps      00:20:34.566    1,006 kbps      00:20:29.561    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:09:13.052
3               0:20:40.372     0:05:41.040     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      00:26:19.611    1,069 kbps      00:26:15.607    1,009 kbps      00:26:10.602    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:20:41.340
4               0:26:21.413     0:03:29.542     950 kbps        1,423 kbps      00:29:49.320    1,045 kbps      00:29:45.316    997 kbps        00:29:40.311    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:26:22.380
5               0:29:50.955     0:08:45.024     950 kbps        1,474 kbps      00:38:34.278    1,055 kbps      00:38:30.274    1,002 kbps      00:38:25.269    3,962 bytes     89,945 bytes    00:29:51.923
6               0:38:35.980     0:11:29.689     950 kbps        960 kbps        00:38:36.013    952 kbps        00:38:36.013    951 kbps        00:38:36.013    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:38:36.947
7               0:50:05.669     0:08:03.349     950 kbps        1,607 kbps      00:58:07.050    1,081 kbps      00:58:03.046    1,016 kbps      00:57:58.041    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    00:50:06.636
8               0:58:09.018     0:07:20.173     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      01:05:27.356    1,073 kbps      01:05:23.352    1,011 kbps      01:05:18.347    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    00:58:09.986
9               1:05:29.191     0:06:38.297     950 kbps        1,607 kbps      01:12:05.487    1,081 kbps      01:12:01.483    1,016 kbps      01:11:56.478    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:05:30.159
10              1:12:07.489     0:08:59.238     950 kbps        1,544 kbps      01:21:04.926    1,069 kbps      01:21:00.922    1,009 kbps      01:20:55.917    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:12:08.457
11              1:21:06.728     0:03:51.497     950 kbps        1,403 kbps      01:24:56.658    1,041 kbps      01:24:52.654    995 kbps        01:24:47.649    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:21:07.696
12              1:24:58.226     0:05:19.318     950 kbps        960 kbps        01:24:58.259    952 kbps        01:24:58.259    951 kbps        01:24:58.259    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    01:24:59.194
13              1:30:17.545     0:06:42.568     950 kbps        1,353 kbps      01:36:58.546    1,031 kbps      01:36:54.542    990 kbps        01:36:49.537    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:30:18.513
14              1:37:00.114     0:15:23.656     950 kbps        1,564 kbps      01:52:21.935    1,073 kbps      01:52:17.931    1,011 kbps      01:52:12.926    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:37:01.081
15              1:52:23.770     0:10:09.909     950 kbps        1,403 kbps      02:02:32.078    1,041 kbps      02:02:28.074    995 kbps        02:02:23.069    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    01:52:24.737
16              2:02:33.679     0:16:57.016     950 kbps        960 kbps        02:02:33.713    952 kbps        02:02:33.713    951 kbps        02:02:33.713    3,962 bytes     89,947 bytes    02:02:34.647
17              2:19:30.695     0:06:27.887     950 kbps        1,474 kbps      02:25:56.881    1,055 kbps      02:25:52.877    1,002 kbps      02:25:47.872    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:19:31.663
18              2:25:58.583     0:18:02.948     950 kbps        1,607 kbps      02:43:59.563    1,081 kbps      02:43:55.559    1,016 kbps      02:43:50.554    3,962 bytes     89,946 bytes    02:25:59.550

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets    
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----      
00000.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     2315.847                950                     275,027,300     1,503,888  
00000.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            2315.847                6,068                   1,756,472,746   11,219,330 
00000.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            2315.847                12,391                  3,587,059,256   19,855,993 
00000.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            2315.847                9,223                   2,669,838,688   14,822,144 
00001.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     2011.376                950                     238,870,780     1,306,178  
00001.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            2011.376                6,158                   1,548,302,594   9,904,951  
00001.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            2011.376                12,526                  3,149,200,012   17,430,803 
00001.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            2011.376                9,223                   2,318,880,256   12,873,728 
00002.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     1492.491                950                     177,252,144     969,240    
00002.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            1492.491                6,233                   1,162,874,638   7,462,626  
00002.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            1492.491                12,402                  2,313,825,116   12,808,159 
00002.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            1492.491                9,223                   1,720,703,864   9,552,832  
00003.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     4021.284                950                     477,551,363     2,611,314  
00003.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x83            TrueHD          deu (German)            4021.284                6,011                   3,021,563,378   19,403,341 
00003.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            4021.284                12,721                  6,394,311,320   35,381,584 
00003.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x80            LPCM            deu (German)            4021.284                9,223                   4,635,841,100   25,736,800
Das Interview - Herbert von Karajan im gespräch mit Joachim Kaiser

Code:
QUICK SUMMARY:

Disc Title: DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC2
Disc Size: 44,580,758,644 bytes
Protection: AACS
BD-Java: Yes
Playlist: 00001.MPLS
Size: 3,066,734,592 bytes
Length: 0:16:03.996
Total Bitrate: 25.45 Mbps
Video: MPEG-4 AVC Video / 21961 kbps / 1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1
Audio: German / LPCM Audio / 2.0 / 48 kHz / 2304 kbps / 24-bit
Karajan in conversation - Herbert von Karajan talks to Richard Osborne (presented in English, not German)

Code:
QUICK SUMMARY:

Disc Title: DGG_KARAJAN_BEETHOVEN_DISC2
Disc Size: 44,580,758,644 bytes
Protection: AACS
BD-Java: Yes
Playlist: 00002.MPLS
Size: 2,493,007,872 bytes
Length: 0:13:33.813
Total Bitrate: 24.51 Mbps
Video: MPEG-4 AVC Video / 21060 kbps / 1080i / 29.970 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1
Audio: German / LPCM Audio / 2.0 / 48 kHz / 2304 kbps / 24-bit
Would love your review of the Surround Sonics [discrete elements?] on these two BD~As. I have so many complete Beethoven Cycles, if this turns out to be ambience only, I will pass.
 
Last edited:

winopener

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Since 2002/2003
Joined
Mar 2, 2002
Messages
3,775
Karajan recorded a Beethoven cycle for EMI in the early 50s, and I suspect didn't want to record another one with them so soon on the heels of his SG cycle from the early 60s.

While it didn't get a quad release at the time, this is also true quad:



Pentatone also released the quads of almost all of Kubelik's cycle for DG from the 70s, but never got to the 3rd before discontinuing their series.

Edit to add: Huh, it seems Masur's cycle has gone out of print. Also, the 2-SACD set of him and the Leipzig orchestra doing the overtures is also quite good.
It was released as CD4 in Japan by JVC, both as Symphonies single LPs and as a complete boxset. Also bootlegged in China.
 

stormchaser

600 Club - QQ All-Star
QQ Supporter
Joined
Jun 18, 2006
Messages
656
Location
Kansas
Waiting to pull the trigger on this one. What does the Atmos add? A greater sense of the hall acoustics?
 

beerking

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
QQ Supporter
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Messages
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Just found this review on Amazon..

Most readers of this review are probably quite familiar with these renowned recordings, Karajan's second stereo Beethoven symphony cycle, so I won't bother to comment too much on the performances which are of classic status. The real buzz about this set is the remastering in LPCM surround and Dolby Atmos, a surround format that also provides overhead sound. Unfortunately, the liner notes say almost nothing about the remastering process or how surround sound was generated from a previously stereo recording. The ninth symphony has already been released in a surround SACD and was originally intended to be released as a quadrophonic recording back in the seventies. The real question is: has the Atmos surround ambience been faked with some kind of artificial reverb? DG tells us nothing in the booklet, but by this time in his recording career, Karajan was multi-miking recordings with the Berlin Philharmonic so that he could have more control over the final balance. I would imagine that a good multi-channel mix could plausibly be derived from the separate tracks. However it was finally done, the Atmos mix sounds quite good, with a hint of overhead ambience, but, at least on my system, not overkill. In fact, it opens up what I've always felt to be a congested, rather flat, untextured stereo mix. The 5.1 track is a little too wide for my taste, but the Atmos track renders a more natural, pleasing sound stage. The recording sounds more detailed and textured, and the masses of violins sound less shrill than on the original, though not as warm as on a more modern recording. Despite the tender loving care these mixes have received from DG engineers, they still sound a little dated. Karajan's wall of strings sometimes sounded a bit mushed as a result, making his Beethoven distinctly Karajan/Beethoven. This is big orchestra Beethoven, just what historically informed directors today try to avoid,; however, it is a classic of the period and includes some white hot music making. If you are equipped for Dolby Atmos and like Karajan's way with Ludwig, by all means buy this, especially for the price! The remix has been well executed. To my ears, it has significantly improved the listening experience. When you move from stereo to multi-channel, inevitable variables multiply the obstacles in trying to successfully duplicate the intentions of the engineers on your own system. On my DefTech ProCinema 1000 speaker system with add on Atmos upfiring speakers in my acoustically challenged listening space, this blu-ray delivers an exciting, somewhat broader than original listening experience. The ninth, especially, is among the very best available.
 

humprof

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So now we have two surround Beethoven cycles--Bernstein's and Von Karajan's--on DG, from roughly the same era, released within a year of each other. Has anyone done--or seen--a comparative review? (Thanks for passing on that detailed report from Amazon, @beerking .)
 

4-earredwonder

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I decided to PASS on the von Karajan Atmos Beethoven remasters as first of all, I'm NOT equipped for ATMOS and secondly I do have some of those performances on hi res Audio Discs.

If you are truly seeking idiosyncratic interpretations of Beethoven's Nine Symphonies in ultra discrete 5.1, TACET Records, having finally recorded all nine conducted by Wojciech Rajski and the Polish Chamber Philharmonic Orchestra, has finally released them on 3 BD~A discs.

Review from HR~Audio.net w/review and ordering links: https://www.hraudio.net/showmusic.php?title=11535#reviews

A most interesting review of this TACET BD~A set from an AmazonUK verified purchaser:

5.0 out of 5 stars A very important addition to the recorded catalogue of Beethoven symphonies
5 April 2019
Format: Blu-ray AudioVerified Purchase

I have over one hundred complete sets of the Beethoven symphonies.This one is outstanding and deserves much better currency than it has received. It has been reviewed favourably, mainly in the audiophile press but overall, I do not believe that its musical significance has been adequately represented.

Of course, there are many traversals of the Beethoven symphonies both of complete sets and of individual performances that have justly stood the test the test of time, in some cases over many decades. This set deserves to join the company of those celebrated recordings.

The elegance, subtlety, delicacy, transparency and colour in Beethoven is often missed or underplayed. Weingartner captures those qualities and so too Toscanini in many of his recordings. Rajski does the same.

Beethoven did represent a departure from Haydn but it was one that was far from complete. I think that Rajski makes that point once again, as did Weingartner and Toscanini before him. Like them, he treats his woodwinds, brass and tympani on an equal footing with his strings. So his sound is not an homogenised mass but rather an integrated collaboration that results in colour and the revelation of important compositional detail.

Rajski, aided by superb audio engineering, manages to convey an amazing range and gradation of dynamics. That is important from the point of view of demonstrating some of the complexity of Beethoven's scoring.

Furtwangler was an absolute genius in capturing Beethoven's almost cosmological profundity. Rajski's readings are profound but his approach is rather different.

These are very balanced interpretations that clearly have entailed very deep reflection on what Beethoven's music means. Weingartner, Toscanini, Furtwangler, Von Karajan (1962), Monteux, Leibowitz, Bernstein and others have been justly lauded. Rajski deserves to join the ranks of those who have had uniquely important things to say about Beethoven's symphonies.

 
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Kal Rubinson

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Now THIS is weird.

It looks like Deutsche Grammophon will release Herbert von Karajan's Beethoven Symphonies (1975-1977) on Blu-ray Audio, with a Dolby Atmos remix:



https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07H62PFS4

Clearly, this will be a remix, and there is no indication yet of how many channels will be utilized, but the safe bet is that it could be Dolby Atmos 7.1.4 with a Dolby TrueHD 7.1 core. Also, I don't believe Dolby has figured out how to go beyond 48/24 with Atmos, so high-resolution is not on the cards unless there is a secondary dedicated 5.1 or 2.0 mix.

Interestingly, this cycle was recently released on SHM-SACD in Japan from new 2018 DSD masters, so I assume that those are being converted and used here. A similar situation seems to be happening with Karl Böhm's 46 Mozart Symphonies, which were released as a Blu-ray Audio / CD set this past summer, and were just announced for release on SHM-SACD in December.



More information from the listing at Presto Classical:
This is the reason that I am re-installing my ATMOS system. Music in the Round #97: Hegel C53 and DSPeaker Anti-Mode X4 Recordings in the Round
 

CINERAMAX

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Is your system a 9.1.4?
Actually, with Denon Marantz, I prefer 5 plus wides no sub all full range, and the surround channel is split among 4 speakers in parallel, this eliminates focal points, the Dolby Director in the picture that launched atmos to the world actually liked the setup.

What is surprising is all the sound that wraps around the back of the room and the rear height, where there are no speakers.
 

Gmat25

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Back in the day, I had an LP box of these. I rebought them as a CD box. IMHO, these performances come alive much more than the 80's recordings.

I'm not sure I'll buy these, since I already own the 70's and 80's boxes. I also have a Barenboim/Berliner Statscapelle DVD-A set.
I also have the Barenboim/Berliner Staatscapelle DVDA's and really enjoy them!
 

ubertrout

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I also have the Barenboim/Berliner Staatscapelle DVDA's and really enjoy them!
The Barenboim DVD-A cycle is still the best Beethoven cycle recorded in high-res/multichannel - unless you want an active mix. Barenboim can be hit or miss, but this one hits hard, and the playing is excellent.
 
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