HiRez Poll King Crimson - Lizard [DVD-Audio/Blu-Ray Audio]

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Rate the DVD-A/BDA of King Crimson - LIZARD

  • 5:

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 4:

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 3:

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 2:

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 1: Poor Surround, Poor Content, Poor Fidelity

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    103

ArnoldLayne

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2004
Messages
276
Location
Madrid, Spain
It was going to be yet another strong 9 from me, for the slight problem with transients (I think) in the 48k mixes. But it is vastly compensated by being simply the best surround mix I have ever heard and I give it a weak 10. It's breathtaking and intense, to a level that made me having to take a short break at about minute 15 into my first listening-through. I have no dog nor cat, so I cannot confirm the eventual impacts on domestic animals :D

Listening to "Lizard" expanded into its full capacity, I now notice how it anticipates many of the flavours in some progressive music that was to come during the 70's. And the obvious connections with much more recent groups, I'm for example not surprised to find out that Steven Wilson is a big fan of this album.

A million thanks to everybody involved in the making of this fantastic musical experience :)
 

Almen

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Sep 26, 2006
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530
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Göteborg, Sweden
I am really, really impressed with this production. Kudos to all involved!

I did not like it the first time I heard it in the 70s (after being blown out by Court and Poseidon), and I can still hear the weaknesses, though I am more forgiving now. Comes with age, I guess. However, it will never be a favourite KC album.

The surround mix brings out everything with nice clarity, and makes it a pleasure to listen to. My only problem is a harshness in the vocals, but I guess that's from the source material. No problem with 48 kHz in my ears...

It'll be nice having this as a sort of reference material and comparing with other KC records - what happened after Poseidon, recording material never played live before, working with musicians of other versatility in polyrythm and technical ability, lots of guest musicians.

(y) :phones
 

AZK

Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
10
Location
Warszawa Poland
I am happy owner of Lizard DVD-Audio pack!!!
First impression - the card box is worse than Red. Paper is much more thinner and is not so stiffy like in Red. It is really very hard to get out and put in the cds.
I have been Lizard lover since this cd was released. I was always sure that Lizard was understimated - music is not very easy and in the seventies such kind of music was far beyond common sense of modern music.
Quality and richness of music are really awesome. This music can you blow away!!! Unfortunately I have gaps (denon 1400). Gave solid 9. Sonically the best DVD-Audio I have ever heard.
 
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doppelbock

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Jul 1, 2005
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Albuquerque, NM
I am one one of those that never cared for this album too much so I approached my first listen cautiously, not wanting to dismiss the "hype" from Fripp and all those that worked on the mixes but not wanting to get carried away by it either...I wanted as neutral thought and preconceptions as I could muster.

After one listen I was a *lot* more impressed by the music on the disc than I ever had been in the past. Being able to spread the instruments around a bit really brought it to life for me, and the panning was cool in many places and not over-used either.

Solid 9 on the first listen, and I am going to give the stereo mixes a listen tomorrow.
 

zabble

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Since 2002/2003
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Mar 1, 2003
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Chicago
Lizard was the first album I ever bought by King Crimson. I saw the ornate cover in a resale shop in the 80’s and decided to give it a go. I was instantly drawn to the lavish multi-textured opener “Cirkus”. I am in the camp with those who prefer the first side of the vinyl to the second. In fact, I would usually listen to just the first three songs and then start getting bored during “Lady of the Dancing Water” and put on a different record (even though I do like the “Last Skirmish” part in “The Battle of Glass Tears”). That said, I was surprised to recently learn that so many people really didn’t like this album at all. Certainly there must be something here for everybody—prog, jazz, classical, Jon Anderson, mellotrons,---no? No, not a perfect album, but oh what a candidate for surround! I can’t believe this day has come.

Upon first listen to the surround mix, I was taken aback a bit by the opening reverb-drenched vocals of “Cirkus” travelling from the rear speakers to the front and finally settling into the center speaker stripped of all effects. This vocal panning is a little unsettling at first, but as soon as Andy McCulloch’s drums kick in and the evil mellotron follows, I forget my initial misgivings and I’m in surround heaven! Even the songs that I grew tired of take on a new life in the 5.1 mix. I just may end up playing more than half the album from here on forward.

While “Cirkus" will always be my favorite song on the album, the best surround mix honors have to go to the song “Indoor Games” which ranks up there with some of the greatest surround mixes of all-time. Every instrument is spread throughout the entire five-speaker soundfield perfectly.

Kudos to all that made this happen!
 

JohnA

Well-known Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2006
Messages
181
Location
Greater London
Gave it a 9.
Somehow I can't bring myself to award the full '10', even though they've done an excellent job.
When I first listened to the DSOTM in 5.1 the experience was hair-raising, it brought a tear to my eye.
These ones are very good, but not spooky.
Maybe it's just me.

And another thing: why don't they have the option to display the lyrics while the music is playing? You can do this on DVD-A, the Queen disks do it for example. Maybe they missed a trick there...
 

JohnA

Well-known Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2006
Messages
181
Location
Greater London
Maybe it would have been spookier if you had turned the TV and the lights off as I did when first listening to DSOTM SACD.
I did that too, alone in the hourse, absolute silence and darkness, SPL peaks of 110db.
The lizard was staked by the throat alright.

But I'm nitpicking here, we're so lucky for having these versions at last(y):banana:
 

peterzach

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Aug 27, 2003
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burnaby bc canada
I think I can put my vote in now as I have given it 5 listens now. I did not know this album at all so everything is new and fresh. I had some real reservation whether I should order this title based on what some people were posting about this album(e.g. read that someone in college days said him and buddies would listen to the Lp but by time second side came on only one person left listening to it). Well I am glad I ordered this and have it now as if the music can draw you into the mix and doesn't let go till the end and you want to relisten right aways again, well, than that is something worthy of some praise, this is that kind of album. Some of the jazz/rock fusion parts are a bit of a challenge for me but after each listen it is getting more enjoyable. The surround and mix are top notch again as this is my second KC after hearing ITCOTK first I give this one a 10 as well, I can't imagine it sounding better than what has been done. I look forward to listening to this some more as there is alot to take in.

peter
 

ssully

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Since 2002/2003
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Jul 2, 2003
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in your face
First listen...surround mix is very nice, and an improvemnt on the old 2ch mix, but Lizard's probably still not ever going to be one of my favorite KC albums. Call it a 7.

Also, did anyone notice yet that 'Big Top' in the 5.1 remix, does not gradually speed up and change pitch the way it did on the original stereo mix?

(ADDED: nor does it speed up on Steve Wilson's new 2 ch mix)
 
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MartinGr

Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2003
Messages
19
I have a strange playback problem with "Lizard" on my Pioneer 656A (European model). Sometimes a new track starts (in 5.1 MLP) and it remains silent. But the timer in the display is counting. After skipping back, the track is audible. And after reloading the disc the problem seemed to be gone - but it's still unstable. Is my player on its way down??
The disc itself seems to be o.k. - I've just done a PI/PO and a Beta/Jitter test.
Any ideas?

Martin
 

neil wilkes

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Feb 6, 2004
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London, England
I have a strange playback problem with "Lizard" on my Pioneer 656A (European model). Sometimes a new track starts (in 5.1 MLP) and it remains silent. But the timer in the display is counting. After skipping back, the track is audible. And after reloading the disc the problem seemed to be gone - but it's still unstable. Is my player on its way down??
The disc itself seems to be o.k. - I've just done a PI/PO and a Beta/Jitter test.
Any ideas?

Martin
Check your firmware revision - are you on the newest version?
 

MartinGr

Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2003
Messages
19
Check your firmware revision - are you on the newest version?
Hi Neil,
while you're reading: congratulations for the fantastic job you've done with the KC DVD-As!!
Firmware updating on a Pioneer is not simple, as far as I know. But I've never had playback problems with any of my over 100 DVD-A and SACD.
But if it was the firmware... shouldn't I be able to reproduce the error everytime I play it?
Could it be a problem with watermark detection?

At work, I have a 575A - that one is much more famous for problems than the older 656A (but "Lizard" runs fine). I've once received a 575A firmware update from the support but it still skips some titles on certain Sony SACDs.

Regards,
Martin
 

wanners

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Jan 15, 2009
Messages
399
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Pittsburgh, PA (Steeler Country)
Just got lizard yesterday. Playback on the oppo is fine luckily:smokin

a mixed bag for me music wise. the mix is great, don't want to vote yet, but i'm thinking maybe a 9. Hard to tell since I'm still getting used to some of that experimental jazz. song lizard is great with jon anderson on vocals.

the ITCOCK version of the band went to prog rock heaven and came back as louis armstrong.
 

Angrom

New member
Joined
Jun 29, 2005
Messages
8
Location
Orleans, France
I give it a ten.
For the moment i think it's on this CD that the Remix / remastering process is the more impressive
 

stormchaser

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QQ Supporter
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Jun 18, 2006
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Kansas
My comments will echo several others in this thread. The music here is a bit challenging for me and the second half of the album is much more interesting than the first half. As a result, my score will only be a 8. However, the fidelity, the care with which this package was made, and the surround mix are all excellent and consistent with the other two KC offerings thus far. I need to listen some more, but this may be to my ears the most interesting surround mix yet with fairly aggressive use of the surround speakers.
 

EduBH

New member
Joined
Oct 20, 2009
Messages
2
Lizard has always been my favorite KC album, and the 5.1 mix is simply stunning. I don't have much to add to what has been said before, the surround mix really brings a lot of detail that were buried in the stereo mix. Cirkus is stunning , my favorite track, and the whole disc is fantastic.

I have one major problem though. I only have a DVD player, and I'm listening to the DTS tracks. On my player, there is a pause between each song. This is tolerable in some instances, but is very aggravating when listening to the Lizard suite, and also when switching from Indoor Games to Happy Family (there is a cut right at the end of Haskell's manic laugh, before Happy familiy kicks in, this transition is seamless on the CD). I know this is a player related issue, and that some players do the transitions seamlessly, but I also know that this could be avoided - for instance, this does not happen on the Genesis discs.

I urge Neil to take a close look at this so it can be avoided on future releases. Other than that, a perfect ten!

PS. Same problem with ITCOTCK and RED.
 

bazcrim

New member
Joined
Oct 14, 2009
Messages
1
I think the DTS problems have been addressed. There was a posting on Facebook from Guy Manning that he was working with the King Crimson DVD creators to rectify problems in the DTS mastering. He didn't say what the problems were but I assume its what has been discussed here. I wonder if that means there will be a re-release and if so what the consequences are for those with existing discs.
 
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