HiRez Poll Love and Rockets - SEVENTH DREAM OF TEENAGE HEAVEN [Blu-Ray Audio]

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Rate the BDA of Love and Rockets - SEVENTH DREAM OF TEENAGE HEAVEN

  • 7

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 6

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 5

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 4

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 3

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 2

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 1: Poor Content, Surround Mix, and Fidelity

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    40

jamesc

Active Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2015
Messages
75
Location
US
A) it's great they did this
B) Very surprised they didn't do EARTH, SUN, MOON instead (since it was their "breakthrough" record).
C) Still, I would much rather have TONES ON TAIL in 5.1 (IMO The better post-Bauhaus band).
Would love to see Tones On Tail in surround!

I can highly recommend the 2021 24/96 stereo release of Pop available from 7digital and the likes. The dynamics are intact and I thought it compared very nicely with my original UK vinyl.
 

C.C. 95

Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2018
Messages
16
Location
USA
Would love to see Tones On Tail in surround!

I can highly recommend the 2021 24/96 stereo release of Pop available from 7digital and the likes. The dynamics are intact and I thought it compared very nicely with my original UK vinyl.
Yes! How wonderful it would be to have the TOT EVERYTHING disc in 24/96 or surround! (On an actual SACD, blu ray or DVD. Need HARD COPY!)
 

fetchmybeer

Active Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2021
Messages
96
Location
DFW
I guess I never posted my review of this. I've always liked this album a lot. This one, Express, and ES&M are great albums. This one always suffered from some fidelity issues. It's kind of typical of the time, awash with reverb and delay. Express and ES&M also have that, but sound loads better (and yes, please give me ES&M and Peter Murphy's "Deep" in surround sound. I will die a happy man with those). This transfer is pretty much the same way, only in surround sound. Some songs lend themselves to the surround experience better than others. That's not a knock on the mix or anything. Apart from giving it a cleaner sound, which I'm not sure is even possible if the source tracks are reverbed (Neil Wilkes indicates earlier on this thread that the reverb washes were added to existing tracks, at least in some tracks), about the only thing that maybe could be done is to make it sound thicker. But again, how do you do that? And where is the fine line between making it sound "thicker" and keeping it as close to the original balance as possible? It's kind of like what Giles Martin talked about in remixing the White Album. They got it sounding all clean and pretty and he realized that it lacked the character of the original mix.

There are some obvious highlights-- Private Future, Dog-End (I had forgotten what a killer, killer song that is), Saudade... The best use of surround I thought was surprisingly in the mix of Ball of Confusion. I wasn't expecting that, though I could do without the rest of the bonus tracks. I'm glad they're there, but they do feel like filler and just aren't very good songs.

So I'm a bit torn here since I normally throw out scores based on what could actually be done with the mix and how the mix sounds relative to my expectations of how it should sound. In terms of what could be done, I think a 9 is fair. The psychedelia of L&R really doesn't come from weirdness in their mixes, but from the moods they convey (w/ reverb, droney vocals, etc), so there's really no expectation or need for a lot of movement in these mixes. Ultimately, they are a rock band, and rock bands generally have pretty straightforward surround mixes. In terms of meeting my expectations, a 7. I just wanted this to sound a bit better. It still sounds better than any previous release, mind you, as you're getting better fidelity and separation from a surround mix with BR-level audio, but it lacks a punch that I was hoping for. Overall, an 8 and well done.
 

cbmmm3

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
Joined
Apr 2, 2011
Messages
1,639
Location
West Carlisle Michigan
I guess I never posted my review of this. I've always liked this album a lot. This one, Express, and ES&M are great albums. This one always suffered from some fidelity issues. It's kind of typical of the time, awash with reverb and delay. Express and ES&M also have that, but sound loads better (and yes, please give me ES&M and Peter Murphy's "Deep" in surround sound. I will die a happy man with those). This transfer is pretty much the same way, only in surround sound. Some songs lend themselves to the surround experience better than others. That's not a knock on the mix or anything. Apart from giving it a cleaner sound, which I'm not sure is even possible if the source tracks are reverbed (Neil Wilkes indicates earlier on this thread that the reverb washes were added to existing tracks, at least in some tracks), about the only thing that maybe could be done is to make it sound thicker. But again, how do you do that? And where is the fine line between making it sound "thicker" and keeping it as close to the original balance as possible? It's kind of like what Giles Martin talked about in remixing the White Album. They got it sounding all clean and pretty and he realized that it lacked the character of the original mix.

There are some obvious highlights-- Private Future, Dog-End (I had forgotten what a killer, killer song that is), Saudade... The best use of surround I thought was surprisingly in the mix of Ball of Confusion. I wasn't expecting that, though I could do without the rest of the bonus tracks. I'm glad they're there, but they do feel like filler and just aren't very good songs.

So I'm a bit torn here since I normally throw out scores based on what could actually be done with the mix and how the mix sounds relative to my expectations of how it should sound. In terms of what could be done, I think a 9 is fair. The psychedelia of L&R really doesn't come from weirdness in their mixes, but from the moods they convey (w/ reverb, droney vocals, etc), so there's really no expectation or need for a lot of movement in these mixes. Ultimately, they are a rock band, and rock bands generally have pretty straightforward surround mixes. In terms of meeting my expectations, a 7. I just wanted this to sound a bit better. It still sounds better than any previous release, mind you, as you're getting better fidelity and separation from a surround mix with BR-level audio, but it lacks a punch that I was hoping for. Overall, an 8 and well done.

Agree with you on everything written and quadruple agree with you on the wish for Peter Murphy "Deep" in surround. Thanks for the great review
 

neil wilkes

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Joined
Feb 6, 2004
Messages
4,370
Location
London, England
I guess I never posted my review of this. I've always liked this album a lot. This one, Express, and ES&M are great albums. This one always suffered from some fidelity issues. It's kind of typical of the time, awash with reverb and delay. Express and ES&M also have that, but sound loads better (and yes, please give me ES&M and Peter Murphy's "Deep" in surround sound. I will die a happy man with those). This transfer is pretty much the same way, only in surround sound. Some songs lend themselves to the surround experience better than others. That's not a knock on the mix or anything. Apart from giving it a cleaner sound, which I'm not sure is even possible if the source tracks are reverbed (Neil Wilkes indicates earlier on this thread that the reverb washes were added to existing tracks, at least in some tracks), about the only thing that maybe could be done is to make it sound thicker. But again, how do you do that? And where is the fine line between making it sound "thicker" and keeping it as close to the original balance as possible? It's kind of like what Giles Martin talked about in remixing the White Album. They got it sounding all clean and pretty and he realized that it lacked the character of the original mix.

There are some obvious highlights-- Private Future, Dog-End (I had forgotten what a killer, killer song that is), Saudade... The best use of surround I thought was surprisingly in the mix of Ball of Confusion. I wasn't expecting that, though I could do without the rest of the bonus tracks. I'm glad they're there, but they do feel like filler and just aren't very good songs.

So I'm a bit torn here since I normally throw out scores based on what could actually be done with the mix and how the mix sounds relative to my expectations of how it should sound. In terms of what could be done, I think a 9 is fair. The psychedelia of L&R really doesn't come from weirdness in their mixes, but from the moods they convey (w/ reverb, droney vocals, etc), so there's really no expectation or need for a lot of movement in these mixes. Ultimately, they are a rock band, and rock bands generally have pretty straightforward surround mixes. In terms of meeting my expectations, a 7. I just wanted this to sound a bit better. It still sounds better than any previous release, mind you, as you're getting better fidelity and separation from a surround mix with BR-level audio, but it lacks a punch that I was hoping for. Overall, an 8 and well done.
Thank you for the comprehensive review of this album, and I have to say that this is a very fair & honest review - some of the issues mentioned are on me, especially the whole vexed question of movement so I thought I would take some time out from the mixing of their unreleased 1988 performance at the London Dominion Theatre to address this and in some way to try & explain what was going on in my mind at the time.
'Ball Of Confusion' was so much fun to do, and a lot of the parts definitely lent themselves to some serious movement (plus it's a superb version of the track) but in the main the biggest issues I faced was the bouncing that had been done at recording. Where we get multiple vocal parts a lot of these had already been comped down to a single track, thus tying my hands there - a real shame as one of the things I wanted to do before getting the multitracks was to really move those vocals around in the mix - the counterplay between Daniel & David would have been a lot of fun to play with, but this was not possible.
A similar thing applied on other parts too (it has been a few years so without trying to reload the multitracks that were mixed 5 versions of my DAW back, in the days when we still used 32-bit plugins, would be a lot of aggravation but one day I should give it all a look just the same.
So instead I went for depth.

I have been told that Express & ESM may well get done too - but first I have to deliver the Live Album.
 

fetchmybeer

Active Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2021
Messages
96
Location
DFW
Yeah, there isn't a whole lot you can do when the source tracks are already bounced.

I assume the Dominion Theater performance is going to be a stereo mix? There are just 3 of those guys....and live they are pretty bare bones.

I really hope Express and especially ESM get the surround treatment. ESM in particular is one of those albums like Peter Murphy's "Deep" or The Cure's "Kiss Me Kiss Me Kiss Me" (and "Disintegration" for that matter) that really shaped my memories of those years of my life. My cover band even does No New Tale To Tell and it always gets a great response. More people know and love that song than you would think.

Anyway, good luck with the mixes and thank you for your response.
 

neil wilkes

2K Club - QQ Super Nova
Joined
Feb 6, 2004
Messages
4,370
Location
London, England
Yeah, there isn't a whole lot you can do when the source tracks are already bounced.

I assume the Dominion Theater performance is going to be a stereo mix? There are just 3 of those guys....and live they are pretty bare bones.

I really hope Express and especially ESM get the surround treatment. ESM in particular is one of those albums like Peter Murphy's "Deep" or The Cure's "Kiss Me Kiss Me Kiss Me" (and "Disintegration" for that matter) that really shaped my memories of those years of my life. My cover band even does No New Tale To Tell and it always gets a great response. More people know and love that song than you would think.

Anyway, good luck with the mixes and thank you for your response.
I think if you check the small print, it is me who should be thanking you for the kind words on this project, which I had enormous fun doing too.

The live show is indeed going to be stereo only, unless (and this is a big 'unless') it turns out that the approach of simply putting the listener about 10 rows back in the Mosh Pit turns out to be acceptable as like you say, there ain't much to work with.

Still hoping that both Express & ESM will happen, as well as their 4th album as all of these are on Beggars Banquet.
It's a shame the latter albums never really got a UK release - on the US album 'Hot Trip To Heaven' there is an awesome 10 minute opener called 'Body And Soul' that I used to use as a PA setup track back in the days when I was still working as a live sound mixer - it builds beautifully and has everything I needed to get the sound really clear & tight.
Getting mugged in Memory Lane again!!
 

jamesc

Active Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2015
Messages
75
Location
US
I think if you check the small print, it is me who should be thanking you for the kind words on this project, which I had enormous fun doing too.

The live show is indeed going to be stereo only, unless (and this is a big 'unless') it turns out that the approach of simply putting the listener about 10 rows back in the Mosh Pit turns out to be acceptable as like you say, there ain't much to work with.

Still hoping that both Express & ESM will happen, as well as their 4th album as all of these are on Beggars Banquet.
It's a shame the latter albums never really got a UK release - on the US album 'Hot Trip To Heaven' there is an awesome 10 minute opener called 'Body And Soul' that I used to use as a PA setup track back in the days when I was still working as a live sound mixer - it builds beautifully and has everything I needed to get the sound really clear & tight.
Getting mugged in Memory Lane again!!
Instant sale on any of the above!
 

humprof

Junior Senior
Joined
Jun 10, 2016
Messages
3,991
Location
NoCal
Bravo to Mr. Wilkes for a job well done! (y) Hopefully this and the Pixies title sell enough copies to convince the folks at Beggar's Banquet to release more titles.
Hey @neil wilkes: got any updates for us?
BB also distributes Matador.....would love to get some Yo La Tengo....
Me too! I Can Hear the Heart Beating as One is 25 years old today! (Ulp.)
 
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