Tangerine Dream SQ

[alkazaba]

Hello! I'm a new member on this forum, my location is Spain.

I have a SQ double LP by Tangerine Dream: "Alpha Centauri" & "Atem", and a lots of doubts in my head. My pressing is the Virgin VD2504, without quad specifications on the labels (but some discographies refers it's quad), the atem cover says "Quadrophonishe Produktion", and I tested it with a full logic decoder (Motorola Ic's) made by me (and the help of Thomas Bechteler), the quad results not are very special.

What pressings are quad?? I have read that OHR, Brain and Virgin, but i find confussion. Exists a stereo mix and quad mix?? The OHR was in quad and is the first release.

Another question: it's possible to find a SQ test in the web?? I need check the decoder and adjust the variable blend circuit with more precission.

Thanks,

Antonio Perez

 

[winopener]

I have one, write at my ad winopener(at)yahoo.com and i'll send it to you as attached file (need a single message mailbox over 3 Mb)

 

[AllAroundSurround]

I have the exact same 2 albums sets and the exact same confussion as to what is or isn't quad. I'll have to set them up and try them with the Tate II 101A and see what I come up with! Winopener! Can I get a copy of the test also. I want to see how my tate is decoding! If they are Quad, I'll have to do a d.t.s. conversion of them!
Rob

 

[alkazaba]

This information is take from www.vinylattic.co.uk

"2-LP. Only issued in quadrophonic format. Double LP reissue of Alpha Centauri, Polydor Super 2383 314, and Atem, Polydor Super 2383 297. "Alpha Centauri" was issued with the 4th label design, whilst "Atem" had the 4th label design, but coloured in green, rather than red, and similar to the subsequent 5th label design, but without the white rim. The album numbers are getting sillier. LP 1's label has the following legend: Album no. 257. Underneath this, in larger and heavier type is VD 2504. Underneath this is VD 257. The matrix number is VD 257. LP 2's label has the following legend: Album no. 258. Underneath this, in larger and heavier type is VD 2504. Underneath this is VD 258. The matrix number is VD 258. Set included black, poly-lined inner sleeves with the Roger Dean 'girl and dragon' illustration"

Mi release of these lp's is not the original, labels are red for one side and green for other side, and matrix number differents. More confussion.....

Antonio Perez

 

[proufo]

Hola Antonio. Un saludo. Ya no estoy solo ;-)

Can you provide a description of your home-made decoder?

Thanks in advance.

 

[alkazaba]

More details for the SQ decoder (Motorola IC's) courtesy by Thomas F. Bechteler: people.sabanciuniv.edu/~t...uadro.html

Oh yes, please, something can put any file with the SQ test at the yahoo quad group (files, of course)?? I have the other LP "introduction Quad World..." but it's not for checking!!

Proufo, for favor, contacta conmigo!! tienes mi dirección de correo en mi página:
www.supercable.es/~alkazaba

Best regards / Saludos.

 

[AllAroundSurround]

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>MY release of these lp's is not the original, labels are red for one side and green for other side, and matrix number differents. More confussion.....[/quote]
This is the one I also have and it is
SQ- And decodes perfectly with the tate ! I have side 1 recorded and getting ready to do side 2 and then will do a 5.1 d.t.s. encoded cdr, and then do the Alpha C. 2 record set next. Very Clean recording! Both Albums are very very clean low surface noise- Gone with C.E.Pro no noise at all no clicks or pops! I did very little noise reduction To the first side and the second side looks to be the same ! One of the cleanest albums I've ever bought off Ebay! Looks and sounds as if it was never played !
Rob

 

[alkazaba]

In last times I have notices from a lot of LP releases of these ambums that's are SQ incoded: the mentioned Virgin (2lp), OHR, Brain(2lp) and PDU labels...

Probably these records are SQ in the original master, only quad version??

I don't have the CD release. Please, any have it and can check??

Alkazaba

 

[sqdave1975]

I bought the CD of Alpha Centauri from HMV's sale the other day, and played it through the Tate (in SQ).

I'm pretty much 100% sure that this CD has the SQ mix perfectly preserved!

Can anyone else A/B this to their vinyl? This issue came in a standard jewel case with a cardboard slipcase over it. Will post catalogue numbers once I get home.

Cheers.

 

[Marcsten]

This set is currently up on ebay. The seller has posted pics, but they aren't sharp enough to do much good. Can be seen to be the green label virgin. Seller also states that the labels state stereo, although the printed material suggest quadraphonic production. Not sure if this helps, as seller is honest enough to say he's not sure if its quad. Anyone have this set to a/b with the cd?
Marc

cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI...egory=1593

 

[bloop]

There is definately no Quad-LP existing of Tangerine Dream.
- the 3 LPs Alpha Centauri, Zeit and Atem where recorded at Dierks Studio Cologne. They got their Quad-Equipment early 1973.
- Alpha Centauri was recorded early 1971, Zeit in 1972 and Atem 12/72-1/73. So they are Stereo Recordings.
- My Original Copy of Atem on OHR says "Quadrophonische Produktion, Nur Stereo und Mono abspielbar" (that means only playable Stereo and Mono!).
- This printing was also used for the 2LP-issue of Alpha Centauri/Atem which was first on Brain (who never released a Quad recording) and issued by Virgin. But they omitted printing the 2nd sentence
- One of the first Quad Mixes from Dierks Studios which surfaced was Nektar Remember the Future in the end of 1973.
- OHR never released an SQ record. They began releasing in quad in the end of 1973 on their Label OHR-Sub-Label "Kosmische Musik". And the first 5 records weren't quad. The first one was Wallenstein "Cosmic Century". After that, the following 11 LPs are SQ with the exception of Popol Vuh "Einsjäger", which is only Stereo.
- There are some french pressings of the records which say quad, but they used this labelsticker for every record they released. Quad or not.
- Early Pressings on OHR of Klaus Schulze's "Irrlicht" says "Quadrophonische Symphony". This has a musical meaning and is no Quad-LP.

See www.krautwerk.de for label listings of OHR and Kosmische Musik

 

[zabble]

There is definately no Quad-LP existing of Tangerine Dream.

I have an Italian pressing of Tangerine Dream's "Zeit" on PDU (catalog # PIM-SQ 6010/11) which has "Quadro Stereo Mono" written on both the cover and the record label itself. Incidentally, it decodes beautifully on my Tate II.

- the 3 LPs Alpha Centauri, Zeit and Atem where recorded at Dierks Studio Cologne. They got their Quad-Equipment early 1973.
- Alpha Centauri was recorded early 1971, Zeit in 1972 and Atem 12/72-1/73. So they are Stereo Recordings.

Assuming that this is true, it is possible that these were remixed for quad. I have the 2 L.P. reissue of Alpha Centauri/Atem on (Virgin VD 2504 Great Britain). This was released in 1976, which means that if the original releases were indeed issued in stereo only, they could have feasibly gone back and remixed them from the original multi-tracks into quad, using their already-acquired quad gear. Same goes for my "Zeit" pressing (which was issued in 1974). My Alpha Centauri/Atem L.P. certainly decodes well through my Tate. The best track to listen for quad separation is the last track on side four "Wahn". There are distinct, separate voices in the front and rear.

 

[ssully]

I have an Italian pressing of Tangerine Dream's "Zeit" on PDU (catalog # PIM-SQ 6010/11) which has "Quadro Stereo Mono" written on both the cover and the record label itself. Incidentally, it decodes beautifully on my Tate II.
Assuming that this is true, it is possible that these were remixed for quad. I have the 2 L.P. reissue of Alpha Centauri/Atem on (Virgin VD 2504 Great Britain). This was released in 1976, which means that if the original releases were indeed issued in stereo only, they could have feasibly gone back and remixed them from the original multi-tracks into quad, using their already-acquired quad gear. Same goes for my "Zeit" pressing (which was issued in 1974). My Alpha Centauri/Atem L.P. certainly decodes well through my Tate. The best track to listen for quad separation is the last track on side four "Wahn". There are distinct, separate voices in the front and rear.

Wow, interesting stuff....especially if peopel have been wrong all these years about the early TD albums being quad.

One question is, does the Tate cause any albums *known* to be stereo, to behave in a quad-y manner? In other words, can it act like Dolby Pro Logic II, which produces surround out[put from stereo recordings, based on phase and level information?
If so, there would have to be some other way to prove that the source was quad.

 

[sspsandy]

I have both the Kosmishe Musik label version of Zeit that states quadraphonic, as well as the original Ohr stereo release. Will compare them through the Tate to see if there is any difference. Also, the quad lp version of Alpha Centauri was released with a different cover that is predominently white. It is a serious rarity that I've only seen for sale twice. That translation could also mean quadraphonic, playable on stereo and mono.

 

[bloop]

Rolf-Ulrich Kaiser (Manager of OHR/Kosmische Musik) sold many Stereo Recordings to PDU/Italy and OHR/France as Quad-recordings. These Companies released every record with these printings, if quad or not.
Kaiser was well known for his strange behaviour in music business.

I also got many Stereo Records, which encode nicely.

 

[ssully]

Rolf-Ulrich Kaiser (Manager of OHR/Kosmische Musik) sold many Stereo Recordings to PDU/Italy and OHR/France as Quad-recordings. These Companies released every record with these printings, if quad or not.
Kaiser was well known for his strange behaviour in music business.

I also got many Stereo Records, which encode nicely.

Interesting again, thanks.

The CDs of the early TD albums sound to me like they could be needle-drops from LPs. There are occasional pops and ticks. I emailed the official TD site about this some years back and got an ambiguous reply to the effect of 'what do you expect for such old albums"? Does anyone know what sources were used, and if the master tapes even exist any more for these classics?

 

[bloop]

Interesting again, thanks.

The CDs of the early TD albums sound to me like they could be needle-drops from LPs. There are occasional pops and ticks. I emailed the official TD site about this some years back and got an ambiguous reply to the effect of 'what do you expect for such old albums"? Does anyone know what sources were used, and if the master tapes even exist any more for these classics?

I think that the first releases on Jive were not transfered from the Masters.
The Castle Issues of the Nineties are said to be from the Masters.
Which copies do you have?

(Good resource for Tangerine Dream releases is: www.voices-in-the-net-de )

Rolf-Ulrich Kaiser owned most of the OHR-Masters. But by the time he was bankrupt, he stored them in an old garage and got unusable by time or got lost. Most reissues of the OHR-catalogue (mainly on ZYX) were done from Vinyl. Some Masters may be still in the archives of Dierks Studios.

Last month I heard the rumour that some of the Kosmische Musik records will be reissued in 5.1. Maybe a transfer from some still existing Quad-Masters?

 

[ssully]

I think that the first releases on Jive were not transfered from the Masters.
The Castle Issues of the Nineties are said to be from the Masters.
Which copies do you have?

(Good resource for Tangerine Dream releases is: www.voices-in-the-net-de )

Rolf-Ulrich Kaiser owned most of the OHR-Masters. But by the time he was bankrupt, he stored them in an old garage and got unusable by time or got lost. Most reissues of the OHR-catalogue (mainly on ZYX) were done from Vinyl. Some Masters may be still in the archives of Dierks Studios.

Last month I heard the rumour that some of the Kosmische Musik records will be reissued in 5.1. Maybe a transfer from some still existing Quad-Masters?

I have the 90's Castle remasters of Alpha Centauri, Zeit and Atem...which I've bought more than once (they keep repackaging the same old digital masters in new boxes). These are the ones that sound like needle-drops to me. I never heard the Jive issues.

It would be a shame if the original masters and multitracks were gone.