HiRez Poll Tears For Fears - THE SEEDS OF LOVE [Blu-Ray Audio]

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Rate the BDA of Tears for Fears - THE SEEDS OF LOVE

  • 7

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 6

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 5

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 4

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 3

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 2

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 1: Terrible Content, Surround Mix, and Fidelity

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    105
This was a release I’d been hearing rumors of for years and kept saying I wasn‘t going to pick it up, despite a Steven Wilson mix. I remember not really liking the title track back in the day. This was definitely a COVID purchase. Being stuck in the house got me listening in surround much more frequently. I rearranged my room and tuned the speakers for a good listening experience. so when this was announced, I was primed for new music.

I am so glad I made this purchase. The album is a revelation to me. As I said in the thread about the album, I have no idea how this could have been contained in stereo. Content 3, Fidelity 3, surround mix 3. Overall package loses a point for not having the lyrics. With all of the printed material, why not include them? As a newbie to the album I would love to have them.
 
can not hear all the low level voices nor the lack of cohesiveness anywhere...
brilliant album and brilliant mixes..
Will, however, detract "ahn puan"(excuse ma Francais) because of lack of lyrics anywhere in sight!!! (if this were a "babybabybaby i loveyoubaby" kind of album , well.. cool...but it ain't!)
A niner!
 
This is a 10. Let me just get one thing out of the way before i get into specifics: with ALL that is included in the package (i'm thinking of the three CDs worth of extras, the glorious book, and the tour program[me] repro), i can't fathom deducting a point for a lack of printed lyrics.

This album came out the September of my first year teaching high school students. I spent many a late night grading papers with this playing in the background . . . truth be told, sometimes in the foreground. My daughter was born in 1996, and she and i used to dance to the title track when she was newly peripatetic. I mention these tidbits to say i know this album well, and it has brought me much bliss over the years. Perhaps, having sung along to the album hundreds of times, i am less irritated by not having lyrics included.

When i first found QQ and read of the existence of a Steven Wilson mix of this Tears for Fears masterpiece, it became one of my most-hoped-for releases. Although i can't really say there aren't things about it that i wish were better done, i can say it ultimately brings me such joy that i can't help but rate it a 10.

"Woman in Chains" kicks things off with a sonically delicious use of the surround channels (highlighting Phil Collins's driving drumming), and Oleta Adams and Roland Orzabal's vocal performances come through the lushness of production clearly and powerfully; this opening track transcendentally sets the scene for all that follows, laying the foundation for the vast spectrum (the sun and the moon, the wind and the rain) of themes filtered through a lens of social consciousness.
Adams is again featured on "Badman's Song" with continued stellar use of the surround field from Wilson, playfully integrating more deft drumming (this time from Manu Katche) and some awesome bass work (from Pino Palladino) simultaneously holding it down and driving it forward. I love the gospel-like vocal stylings and Nicky Holland's jazzy piano work ("Birdland" anyone?). So many layers in all of these songs; Wilson is having so much fun throughout!
The monumental title track, as noted in previous posts, does have some problems, but--for me--its majesty is retained as it builds to its transcendent refrain, out Beatle-ing the Beatles, taking the social/political to the spiritual, riding the rising wave of horns and strings multi-tracked everything! I can't help but believe in LOVE POWER!
Despite having sung "Kick out the style, bring back the jam" in the titular song, "Advice for the Young at Heart" reminds me of much that is wonderful about the Style Council--an elegant and driving coupling of pop and jazz with smooth and soulful (blue-eyed, that is!) vocals.
Each track switches gears from what precedes it; "Standing on the Corner of the Third World" starts with some playful world music trumpet and ultimately morphs into sophisticated jazzy pop with hints of folk and rock, highlighted by some great vocals from the dynamic duo.
Yet another sonic and tonal shift with more of Wilson's effective use of surrounds in "Swords and Knives," which couples prog elements with a driving, almost Afro-Cuban beat over which the duo's vocals again soar magically and mysteriously, playfully accompanied by trippy, proggy guitar.

A cheering crowd connects the anthemic, driving rocker "Year of the Knife" with the preceding cut(s). If you thought that what came before was lush and layered, this cut pulls out all stops: vocals, percussion, guitars, synths, strings, samples, sumbitch i think i even hear the kitchen sink! Surrounded by swirling WALLS of sound--it's ALL there: the sun and the moon, the wind and the rain roiling in the building cacophony!
And it's almost all stripped away for "Famous Last Words," which begins with Eno-esque ambiance, a distant piano, and cryptic whispers. Orzabal brings it all home with a beautiful, heartfelt vocal that is eventually joined by swelling strings. Two minutes in he sings "When the light from above/ Burns a hole straight through our love/ We will laugh/ We will sing/ When the saints go marching in/ And we will carry war--" the musical accompaniment explodes ". . . no more," and his vocals soar: "All our love and all our pain/ Will be but a tune/ The Sun and the Moon/ The Wind and the Rain/ Hand in hand we'll do and die/ Listening to the band that made us cry/ We'll have nothing to lose/ We'll have nothing to gain/ Just to stay in this real life situation/ For one last refrain," and the accompaniment fades back to ambience and a piano for the famous last words: "As the day hits the night/ We will sit by candlelight/ We will laugh/ We will sing/ When the saints go marching in/ And we will carry war no more"


The whole remains so much greater than the sum of its parts, elevating pop culture to the realm of beaux arts, healing hearts and salving souls, re-membering fragments into realized wholes. I began with a simple proclamation; i offer it again: this is a 10 Stay Surrounded, Comrades!
 
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This is not only a gorgeous set, but the "bang for your buck" level is sky high here. Seriously......4 CDs with more demos, b-sides and outtakes that you ever thought you'd need (but it turns out you did), and the the SW 5.1 blu-ray on top of it all.

There's only a dozen or so albums that I would say belongs in everyone's collection, and this is one of them. The surround mix does extremely well by the album. I wouldn't call it the most "aggressive" mix, but the rears are used very well and it's a solid immersive experience.

I would give the surround mix an 8.5, possibly a 9. However, when you factor in the wealth of content on the CDs, the detailed reading and beautiful packaging, and the fact that you likely can get this for under $60, this gets a resounding 10 from me. A great number of artists releasing (or planning to release) deluxe box sets like this should take notes......this is how you make your fans truly happy.
 
There is a ton of content, but I consider myself a TFF die hard fan and I probably won't listen to 75% of that content more than a few times. There are however a few gems that will remain in my rotation of their music.
 
Wow. I didn't know this album at all so i listened to a copy in the car for several weeks while awaiting my Burning Shed delivery. Just to get to know the songs you know. Finally got to sit down and listen to it properly this morning.

I read the booklet while listening as per normal, and it struck me that Steven Wilson has achieved in this mix exactly what Roland and Curt were after from the outset - an organic sound.

I've always been a fan of Steven's mixing, but to me this outdoes them all. The way he manages discreet sounds while maintaining an enveloping 'wholeness' is just astounding. And while the band were trying to move away from the typical 80s sound of the time, the mix backs that ideal up perfectly with the level of fidelity that's been achieved.

A well deserved 10.
 
After several listens to the 5.1 mix, I’m prepared to cast a “9” vote. Needless to say, I’m thrilled this was finally released after sitting in limbo for five years!

I don’t know if I’d say this is Steven Wilson’s best 5.1 mix, but it’s a very good one--especially considering all the limitations and difficulties with the source material (be sure to read SW’s notes about the making of the 5.1 mix in the booklet). There are some incredible moments and others that left me wanting a bit more. I’ll get into more detail below, but my two biggest gripes overall are that it’s a bit bright-sounding and the lead vocals are frequently too low in the mix.

“Woman In Chains” - It’s a bit weird not having the drum hits bounce back-and-forth in the beginning (not SW’s fault), but otherwise I can’t really fault this. I would describe it as just a really well-done “3-D” version of the original stereo mix. The guitars that enter at around 2:20 are only in the rears and sound fantastic. The vocals tend to get a bit obscured once it gets really busy, but that’s fixable by turning up the center channel a notch or two. Both Roland & Oleta’s vocals are isolated in the center channel, giving the listener the ability to mute everything and hear the duet on it’s own--which is incredible.​

“Badman’s Song” - My favorite aspect of this is the way the drum kit is spread around the room. During the reprise of the piano melody at around 5:15, the kick drum actually moves a bit from the left side back to center front. The general layout places the main guitars the front channels, while the backing vocals, brass, organ, and additional percussion are assigned to the rears. At the part where they sing “look at yourself, see how you lie”, Oleta’s vocal is in the center and Roland’s is in the rears(!). My only critique here is that the synth brass sounds a lot faker than it did in the original stereo mix.​

“Sowing The Seeds Of Love” - I was expecting the be-all-end-all ultimate surround demo, but--for better or for worse--this isn’t quite it (in my opinion, of course). The intro with the static sounds panning around the room and reverse drums in the rears sounds great, but once the vocals enter it sounds...different. The balance between certain elements seems off at a few points and I agree with the comments saying that some of the lead vocals could be from alternate takes (the “so nice to eat, so nice to taste” line in particular seems different to me). I was expecting Curt’s vocals to be placed in the rears, but instead they’re kind of everywhere at once--an unusual choice for SW. There are some really good moments though, like the organ popping up in the rears at 3:25 and the panning guitar solo that leads into the “time to eat all your words…” vocal section.​

“Advice For The Young At Heart” - I actually never realized the chorus vocals were doubled. On the 5.1 mix, you can hear the main vocal in the center channel and doubled parts in the rears. This is fairly straightforward mix-wise, but effective: the rears generally feature backing vocals and percussion, and there’s even a fun bit where a harp(?) pans from left rear to right rear.​

“Standing At The Corner Of The Third World” - I’ve never been a huge fan of this song, but it’s amazing in 5.1! Super-atmospheric and powerful. SW noted on his “Album Years” podcast that this is one of his favorite tracks on the album and it shows in the 5.1 mix.​

“Swords & Knives” - Again, this was never a standout track for me but it’s certainly more interesting in surround. Lots of fun panning effects.​

“Year Of The Knife” - SW mentions in the liner notes that this is the most complicated mix he’s ever done. I won't even bother to try and describe exactly what’s happening in the 5.1 mix, but--needless to say--it’s very discrete and almost overwhelming at times. There’s some really creative use of surround with the guitar delay trails sort of wash over the listener. The “this is the year of the knife” backing vocals come blasting from the rears, just as I’d hoped. My only issue here is that the cymbal hits towards the end get to be really shrill at high volume.​

“Famous Last Words” - The intro sounds great with the ambient sounds in the rears and Roland’s voice coming through the center channel with striking clarity.​

Like everyone else said, there’s really no reason not to go for this if you’re a fan of the material. I suppose one could quibble about price, but as far as ‘Super Deluxe Editions’ go this is one of the better examples--nice, compact packaging and interesting extras (single mixes, instrumentals, hi-res stereo, etc). The ‘Townhouse Jams” on disc 4 are probably the highlight in terms of extras. Definitely one of the best releases of 2020!
 
I'm going to give it a 9. It really is an amazing mix, especially considering the limitations and challenges in getting it together. Steven Wilson is probably my go-to at this point for surround mixes, but lately I have noticed on a few of his mixes that there are some weird parts where some bits of music don't quite seem to come in where they are supposed to. For example, Advice for the Young at Heart has some strange contrast between the loud surround bits and the centre channel, and they don't seem to be quite in the right time. This happened in his mix of Brave by Marillion as well. Possibly, this can also be chalked up to problems with dealing with and finding all the original masters. Overall I love this album and really love the mix but I feel like I have to take that point off since some parts just sound... off... Hard to fully explain? Sorry for being a bit vague. I think that I will further justify taking the point off due to the lack of content on the Blu-Ray (maybe some videos, or a concert, just to justify it even being a Blu-Ray in the first place?), and not having Hi-Res stereo masters. All the extra CDs are nice, but I'm not sure how much play they'll get. Honestly, I'm a big fan of the way Marillion has been doing their deluxe editions lately - Hi-Res stereo and 5.1 on the Blu-ray, the original mix of the album, some bonuses, and then a new mix of a previously unreleased live recording.

As for the vocals being a bit lost in the sheer quantity of tracks and channels playing all at once; I think I've pretty much set my system to the "SW default", i.e., the centre channel is always bumped up a few db for me so I had no issues hearing the main vocals above everything else.
 
I will say that I grabbed all 8 of the FLAC file tracks from my rip of the disc and boosted the center channel volume on all 8 of them. I boosted the center in Sowing The Seeds of Love by twice as much as the other seven songs. Overall the mix of voices to music (on my system at least) sounds much better.
 
For example, Advice for the Young at Heart has some strange contrast between the loud surround bits and the centre channel, and they don't seem to be quite in the right time.

I noticed the same thing on "Head Over Heels" from Songs From The Big Chair and a few tracks on Marillion's Misplaced Childhood (I think "Heart Of Lothian" was one?). When the double-tracked vocal parts are split wide between the center and rear channels, the 'blend' between voices somehow seems less precise than in the original stereo mix. I kinda like the effect though, it's as if you're surrounded by a chorus of the same singer.
 
Sorry, I am just not feeling the Love.
Think I have the same issues as @marpow.

It sounds too bright on my system (had to muck with my EQ) and there is so much instrumental saturation in every speaker on the more uptempo parts. Almost fatiguing even at lower speaker levels.

I do appreciate the mix on the more down tempo parts and drums sound fantastic.

Favorite track, the closing song “Famous Last Words”.

Least Favorite track, “Seeds” - I thought the surround mix would make it less chaotic and more majestic. Still sounds like threw too many things in the mix.

In regards to the content of the box set:
It would have been appreciated if they could have mixed the few b-sides into surround.

The release features lots of demo cuts and instrumentals, etc... I would have liked to see something in the booklet providing some providence on the cuts (when and where in the process they came about).

The in-depth interview/history also mentions some aborted recording with Langer & Winstanley. It would have been interesting to hear at least some snippets of that work.

The lyrics would have been a + also (but I won’t deduct a point for that;)).

And while this really has nothing to do with the 5.1 mix, I do not understand the fake live crowd noise intro to Year of the Knife.

Bottom line: I was disappointed in the mix and sonics with this one but can’t argue that Wilson didn’t give it a good try. Maybe there was just too much to work with. Going with 8
 
Least Favorite track, “Seeds” - I thought the surround mix would make it less chaotic and more majestic. Still sounds like threw too many things in the mix.

I feel like this album is divided between people who either only love Sowing the Seeds of Love, or only love every other song on the album except Sowing the Seeds of Love 😁. For the record, it's probably my least favourite song on the album, but I suppose it has its place.
 
Both Roland & Oleta’s vocals are isolated in the center channel, giving the listener the ability to mute everything and hear the duet on it’s own--which is incredible.

Playing around with the album in Audacity, I've found a few pretty neat arrangements. I agree about isolating the vocals in the centre channel, it sounds really striking on most songs when you mute all other channels, especially with the duets. Year of the Knife is, unsurprisingly, quite intriguing. For example, the guitar riff in the first verse is actually spaced out in one note intervals between the rears and fronts, so that you only hear half the notes if you leave just the fronts or just the rears. I honestly couldn't have guessed that just listening to the song, since the mix is just so dense. I also learned only right now that Roland is shouting "Hooray! Hooray! Hooray!" and not "Too late! Too late! Too late!" near the end of the song. Weird.
 
I just looked up who said it and found out it´s Oscar Wilde:

"Moderation is a fatal thing. Nothing succeeds like excess."

...this is one of the most dense albums EVER..and I love it...can listen to it hundreds of times and still find something new, ESPECIALLY in Surround...bravo!
 
Year of the Knife is, unsurprisingly, quite intriguing. For example, the guitar riff in the first verse is actually spaced out in one note intervals between the rears and fronts, so that you only hear half the notes if you leave just the fronts or just the rears. I honestly couldn't have guessed that just listening to the song, since the mix is just so dense. I also learned only right now that Roland is shouting "Hooray! Hooray! Hooray!" and not "Too late! Too late! Too late!" near the end of the song. Weird.

It's fascinating. During the first chorus, you can hear him sort of 'scatting' along in the center. During the psychedelic middle section, there's an eerie distorted guitar in the center channel that doubles the string lines.

Playing just the front channels on "Sowing The Seeds Of Love" is really interesting too. It's basically a karaoke track with just a touch of reverb from the lead vocal in the center. I never knew there was an acoustic guitar playing in that song, but you can hear it in the front right speaker. It's also kinda cool hearing the processed vocal overdubs ("feel the pain, talk about it, etc") on their own.

I've always wondered how SW decides which elements should end up in the center channel, aside from vocals. Like in "Badman's Song", the piano pops up in the center during the reprise of the 'jazz' section midway through the track, but not at the beginning when it's playing the same melody. Or in "The Working Hour" on Songs From The Big Chair, the sax is only in the front channels during the intro, but also appears in the center during the outro.
 
Can’t say much about this music that hasn’t already been covered here. Also not that familiar with this as some are.

It does sound sublime on my system, don’t feel I need to make any adjustments, and love the packaging for a box set. Really appreciate the on screen layout and menu and graphics.
I actually have to look away from the screen to concentrate on the music; because I have a more one track mind and the lovely graphics can divert my attention from the music.

Liked all the songs, but thought the mix on ‘year of the knife’ was a stand out.

A 10 for me!
 
Exactly this... and unfortunately, I'm in the former camp. :( I sorely wish individual 5.1 song downloads were a thing -- I'd immediately pay the $5 or whatever for Sowing The Seeds, as it's one of my favorite songs of the 80s. But, a $60 set... can't do it. Oh well.

(And it's strange, 'cause I *love* the Big Chair album.)
I don't think that's strange. This is by far my favourite album of theirs. I like Big Chair but it's just not quite there for me and some of the songs I feel are meh. I can't even listen to The Hurting. So, to each their own.
 
I wanted to drop in another opinion on this mix; I'm still going to give it a 9 since I am scoring the whole package, but I think there isn't enough appreciation for how good this mix is as a 2014-2015 mix. Because, this is when it was made of course. Just to clarify, he has remixed approximately 27 albums since he made this mix! In this context, the quality of the mix simply defies belief.
 
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