Quad LP/Tape Poll Washington Jr., Grover: Soul Box [SQ/Q8/QR]

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Rate "Soul Box"

  • 10: Tops!

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 6

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 5 So-So

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 4

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 3

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 2

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 1 Utterly sux

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    5

EMB

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Kudu KSQX-1213, from 1972.

Side 1:

Aubrey
Masterpiece

Side 2:

Trouble Man

Side 3:

You are the Sunshine of My Life
Don't Explain

Side 4:

Easy Living/Tain't Nobody's Business if I Do
Taurian Matador

The Q8 modifies the sequencing Thus:


Tape 1, Program 1:

Aubrey
Masterpiece

Program Two:

You are the Sunshine of My Life
Don't Explain

Tape 2, Program 1:

Trouble Man
Easy Living/Tain't Nobody's Business if I Do (Part 1)

Program 2:

Easy Living/Tain't Nobody's Business if I Do (Part 2)
Taurian Matador


ED :)
 

steelydave

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No votes!

Having grown up in the era of smooth jazz like Kenny G, I was really apprehensive about sax-fronted jazzy R&B. Before I ever heard this album I remember looking at the tracklist and being kind of scared by the track lengths, 15 minutes of Trouble Man? 13 minutes of Masterpiece?

If you've heard the 5.1 of Winelight then you know there's nothing to worry about - Washington, Jr. is a remarkable soloist, he somehow has taste and chops in equal measure, and he seems to know exactly when to switch gears. He'll often start a solo and I'll think "this is a bit simple, he's being really melodic not doing much" but by the end I understand exactly what he's doing - it's almost like he's telling a story with his playing, and through peaks and valleys it builds toward a crescendo at the end. There's a reason a lot of these tracks are long, and it's not so that he can spend 80% of the song playing 16th and 32nd note Coltrane ripoff scales.

If you like the CTI quad SACDs that D-V have done (Deodato, George Benson, etc.) this one is well worth seeking out - it shares a lot of the same musicians and other CTI regulars (Bob James, Ron Carter, Idris Muhammad, Billy Cobham, etc.) and the quad mix shares the same peerless Creed Taylor/Rudy Van Gelder aesthetic - that is to say it's great, but also unmistakably their work.
 

winopener

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Surely it's not a high-profile mainstream title, i'm still waiting the D-V treatment since July 2018.


A classy and classic CTI-Kudu release. Quality-wise the Q8 sounds fine but it was for me a HTF set. Very recommended listening. Solid 8.
 

winopener

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Surely it's not a high-profile mainstream title, i'm still waiting the D-V treatment since July 2018.

A classy and classic CTI-Kudu release. Quality-wise the Q8 sounds fine but it was for me a HTF set - first to find it then to massage it properly in digital. Very recommended listening. Solid 8.
 

steelydave

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Surely it's not a high-profile mainstream title, i'm still waiting the D-V treatment since July 2018.
I'm sure you would've seen it from D-V by now if it were controlled by Sony, but the Grover Washington back catalog is owned by UMG, who seem to work at a much slower pace compared to Sony when it comes to licensing reissues.

When CTI's self-distribution scheme fell apart in 1974, they signed a deal with Motown to distribute their music (which is why some CTI Q8's have a circular white sticker on them that say 'Distributed by Motown' on them) but relations between the two companies quickly soured and I think less than a year later they were both suing each other. By the time the dust had settled CTI was bankrupt, so the judge awarded Motown (where Washington had signed after leaving CTI) the rights to all of Washington's CTI/Kudu albums (including Soul Box) in lieu of financial compensation. I think after that he ended up turning around and suing both Motown and CTI to be released from his contract (basically saying that their squabbling was ruining his career) after which he signed with Elektra, where he really hit it big with Winelight in 1980. Anyway, I digress - Motown was sold to MCA in the late 80s, then MCA was was sold to PolyGram a few years later, who were then bought by Seagram, who renamed it Universal Music shortly after that.

Just as an aside, the same financial chaos at CTI that saw them lose Grover Washington's masters also allowed Bob James to recover ownership of his four albums for the label, as per an article in a 1978 issue of Billboard:

NEW YORK - CTI Records has apparently forfeited its ownership of four Bob James masters through a combination of events that ended with a federal judge deciding CTI had breached its contract with James and must deliver the masters and all out-takes to him "forthwith."

Judge John J. Galgay, who also is handling the reorganization of CTI under Chapter XI of the Bankruptcy Act, dismissed CTI's contention that it withheld James royalties because CBS Records, which distributes James' Tappan Zee label, had itself withheld monies due CTI on James' "Head" LP because CTI owed CBS' pressing division money.

Galgay ruled that James' 1977 contract with CTI governing ownership of the disputed masters provides that "any failure or refusal" to pay James' royalties within the time specified in the contract "automatically triggers the default provisions."

The dispute began prior to CTI's bankruptcy filing Dec. 8. 1978, when CTI's Jack Hauptman, on Aug. 29, 1978, asked for an accounting of royalties on the "Heads" LP, which CTI was entitled to under the 1977 agreement.

The next day, however, Hauptman followed with a letter saying that although James himself was due $2,732.51 on Sept. 1. no payment was being sent because CBS was refusing to pay "Heads" royalties due to a prior debt CTI owed to Columbia Record productions for pressing CTI product.

"Thus," says Judge Galgay, "according to the terms of the contract, CTI was in default," despite the fact CTI forwarded a check for James' royalties on Sept. 11 in an apparent change of heart that came too late.

CTI says it will appeal Galgay's decision.

Under the terms of the 1977 agreement, however, James must still pay $25,000 in order to get his masters back, the judge adds.

James is also entitled, the court says, to buy back whatever inventory remains in CTI's possession.

The Masters involved are for four LPs entitled "Bob James I" through "Bob James IV".


Amazing to think how much money those albums (which are some of James' most well-known work) have probably garnered for him since 1978, and that he was able to get them back over a tiny overdue debt ($2732.51) that CBS tried to pay 10 days late.
 

4-earredwonder

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I'm sure you would've seen it from D-V by now if it were controlled by Sony, but the Grover Washington back catalog is owned by UMG, who seem to work at a much slower pace compared to Sony when it comes to licensing reissues.

When CTI's self-distribution scheme fell apart in 1974, they signed a deal with Motown to distribute their music (which is why some CTI Q8's have a circular white sticker on them that say 'Distributed by Motown' on them) but relations between the two companies quickly soured and I think less than a year later they were both suing each other. By the time the dust had settled CTI was bankrupt, so the judge awarded Motown (where Washington had signed after leaving CTI) the rights to all of Washington's CTI/Kudu albums (including Soul Box) in lieu of financial compensation. I think after that he ended up turning around and suing both Motown and CTI to be released from his contract (basically saying that their squabbling was ruining his career) after which he signed with Elektra, where he really hit it big with Winelight in 1980. Anyway, I digress - Motown was sold to MCA in the late 80s, then MCA was was sold to PolyGram a few years later, who were then bought by Seagram, who renamed it Universal Music shortly after that.

Just as an aside, the same financial chaos at CTI that saw them lose Grover Washington's masters also allowed Bob James to recover ownership of his four albums for the label, as per an article in a 1978 issue of Billboard:

NEW YORK - CTI Records has apparently forfeited its ownership of four Bob James masters through a combination of events that ended with a federal judge deciding CTI had breached its contract with James and must deliver the masters and all out-takes to him "forthwith."

Judge John J. Galgay, who also is handling the reorganization of CTI under Chapter XI of the Bankruptcy Act, dismissed CTI's contention that it withheld James royalties because CBS Records, which distributes James' Tappan Zee label, had itself withheld monies due CTI on James' "Head" LP because CTI owed CBS' pressing division money.

Galgay ruled that James' 1977 contract with CTI governing ownership of the disputed masters provides that "any failure or refusal" to pay James' royalties within the time specified in the contract "automatically triggers the default provisions."

The dispute began prior to CTI's bankruptcy filing Dec. 8. 1978, when CTI's Jack Hauptman, on Aug. 29, 1978, asked for an accounting of royalties on the "Heads" LP, which CTI was entitled to under the 1977 agreement.

The next day, however, Hauptman followed with a letter saying that although James himself was due $2,732.51 on Sept. 1. no payment was being sent because CBS was refusing to pay "Heads" royalties due to a prior debt CTI owed to Columbia Record productions for pressing CTI product.

"Thus," says Judge Galgay, "according to the terms of the contract, CTI was in default," despite the fact CTI forwarded a check for James' royalties on Sept. 11 in an apparent change of heart that came too late.

CTI says it will appeal Galgay's decision.

Under the terms of the 1977 agreement, however, James must still pay $25,000 in order to get his masters back, the judge adds.

James is also entitled, the court says, to buy back whatever inventory remains in CTI's possession.


The Masters involved are for four LPs entitled "Bob James I" through "Bob James IV".


Amazing to think how much money those albums (which are some of James' most well-known work) have probably garnered for him since 1978, and that he was able to get them back over a tiny overdue debt ($2732.51) that CBS tried to pay 10 days late.
Fascinating overview, Dave. Wonder if those CTI Multis survived that Burbank Universal fire, however?
 

steelydave

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Well Sony's share of the CTI tapes would presumably be at one of their facilities (or one of Iron Mountain's storage vaults), whereas I'm guessing that Washington's CTI tapes that UMG hold are probably stored with his Motown tapes. I recall reading somewhere that the Motown vault is on the East Coast of the US somewhere, and is in good condition, well organized and properly indexed. I've never seen any suggestion anywhere that any Motown tapes perished in the 2008 UMG vault fire.
 

4-earredwonder

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Well Sony's share of the CTI tapes would presumably be at one of their facilities (or one of Iron Mountain's storage vaults), whereas I'm guessing that Washington's CTI tapes that UMG hold are probably stored with his Motown tapes. I recall reading somewhere that the Motown vault is on the East Coast of the US somewhere, and is in good condition, well organized and properly indexed. I've never seen any suggestion anywhere that any Motown tapes perished in the 2008 UMG vault fire.
The Motown tapes are 'supposedly' stored in New Jersey but there was talk a few years ago of a water main break within that facility and massive flooding inundated the area .... but at this juncture, who knows what is TRUE or FALSE.
 

Colin London

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This would be great on a SACD 4 Channel Mix
Made in the UK or Japan.
If ever possible

Great Engineer Rudy Van Gelder
made the sound perfect.


It came out on 24bit CD
2008 Verve Group/Universal Music

Very Rare Rob Carter on Electric Bass
as well as Acoustic Bass.
 
Last edited:

winopener

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Ok, so the best we can expect is a QR transfer...
 

J. PUPSTER

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Lush, funky, jazzy and just plain sexy!
That's how I feel about this one. And I only have a dts.wav conversion of the SQ LP; and I can't believe I've only taken the time to hear this a few times. This may be one of the best SQ conversions I've ever heard.

I believe steelydave covered most of the highlights above. I mean, are you freakin' kidding me, a Jazzy as you please nearly 16 minutes of Trouble Man by Grover... good lord people! One reason I believe some of the songs are long, is because there are so many great (and I mean great!) musicians on this one, that Grover & producer Taylor wanted to make sure they all had a chance to say something.

Here's a few more musicians on this to wet your whistle:

Hubert Laws - Flute
Richard Tee - Organ
Airto & Ralph MacDonald - Percussion
John Fadis & Randy Brecker - Trumpet
on and on... that's not even the half of them.

I did think the mix was a little left side heavy, but that's about the only thing I didn't like.
I can't even imagine what a great QR (reel to reel) version of this would sound like, but I know I'd love to know, and it would probably push it to a 10 for me - but as is, I'm going with a hot 9.

Have Mercy!

QRG.jpg
 

jefe1

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Are the CDs SQ encoded?

I have the Kudu stereo record box set but the run off etchings on all 4 sides are marked SQ making me think this was a single inventory quad recording.
 
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