New Member - Revisiting Quad

[49thdiver]

Peter here, Vancouver Island, BC, Canada.
I started in Quad almost 45 years ago thanks to my friend Henry. This was also the beginning of my love for Opera and and not long after that Laserdisc. Of course in the intervening years technology has changed a lot and my hearing is not as good as it once was. I certainly have a substantial collection of recordings on vinyl, CD, DVD and Laserdisc. My friend Henry has just gifted me his collection of Laserdiscs and the reason I am here his SQ collection of vinyl. Wow what a gift. I am interested in recording this collection to discrete 4 channel. It occurs to me that Hard drives are so big and cheap these days that it should not be an issue to just simply skip the decoding and record 4 channel. I have a couple of SQ decoders from the old days as well as thanks to Henry a space and image composer. I see a few have attempted conversions using software and converting them to 5.1 etc etc.
I can't help but think with my diminished hearing that what was good in 1980 is still going to be good enough today.
Any thoughts, links or otherwise appreciated. I will end my introduction with that my audio experience is powered by Vintage 1980 Tube Luxman power and preamps with Dalquist DQ10 to push the sound waves. Ahhh the Joys of fine music, thanks for the forum.

 

[Fourplay]

Hi Peter - welcome to the forum! I also have a pair of DQ10s as my fronts. They sound great!

OK, my first recommendation is to look for the content you have on vinyl in an official digital format. Reason being, even if you prefer the sound of analog vinyl, you cannot get the level of separation that the master tapes can offer by decoding an SQ source. For instance, Dark Side of the Moon was an SQ vinyl, but the SQ decode cannot touch the digital version found in the Immersion box set of this title. And we are strictly speaking about quad now. There are also 5.1 and Atmos mixes of DSOTM.

Generally for quad, your media options are these:
8 Track cartridge - great separation but compromised fidelity
Vinyl - depending on the type, reduced separation but improved fidelity
Open Reel tape - the best of both worlds if the title was released in this format
Digital conversions of the above - many titles have been converted to digital already
Official digital releases of quad sources, usually (but not always) from the quad master. And not always without flaws.
These latter come in the following flavors:
DTS CD
DVD-Video
DVD-Audio
SACD
Blu-ray
Digital download
Digital streaming
For most of the above you will obviously need a multi-format disc player, preferably (to me) with analog outputs. In order to check your sources, just try the QQ search function to see what comes up. Not only can you find available formats for a given title, but also reviews of the mix, and sometimes reviews of the music as well.

You mention opera in your post. If most of your content is classical you might check Dutton Vocalion which releases many legacy quad recordings on SACD and usually for very reasonable prices.

Once you have exhausted all other "off the shelf" options for your quad content, then you can look into recording your media to 4 channels for digital playback. This forum has many tutorials and discussions about doing just that. It's an area in which I have no expertise. I will say based on your post that in order to record 4 channel quad your recorder will have to be downstream of your decoder - in other words you can't just skip the decoding and still hear the quad from vinyl. Also and finally, many here swear by the Surround Master for their decodes. Others will have opinions about whether any generation of this decoder does a better job than a legacy decoder.

I hope this helps!

 

[49thdiver]

Hi Peter - welcome to the forum! I also have a pair of DQ10s as my fronts. They sound great!

OK, my first recommendation is to look for the content you have on vinyl in an official digital format. Reason being, even if you prefer the sound of analog vinyl, you cannot get the level of separation that the master tapes can offer by decoding an SQ source. For instance, Dark Side of the Moon was an SQ vinyl, but the SQ decode cannot touch the digital version found in the Immersion box set of this title. And we are strictly speaking about quad now. There are also 5.1 and Atmos mixes of DSOTM.

Generally for quad, your media options are these:
8 Track cartridge - great separation but compromised fidelity
Vinyl - depending on the type, reduced separation but improved fidelity
Open Reel tape - the best of both worlds if the title was released in this format
Digital conversions of the above - many titles have been converted to digital already
Official digital releases of quad sources, usually (but not always) from the quad master. And not always without flaws.
These latter come in the following flavors:
DTS CD
DVD-Video
DVD-Audio
SACD
Blu-ray
Digital download
Digital streaming
For most of the above you will obviously need a multi-format disc player, preferably (to me) with analog outputs. In order to check your sources, just try the QQ search function to see what comes up. Not only can you find available formats for a given title, but also reviews of the mix, and sometimes reviews of the music as well.

You mention opera in your post. If most of your content is classical you might check Dutton Vocalion which releases many legacy quad recordings on SACD and usually for very reasonable prices.

Once you have exhausted all other "off the shelf" options for your quad content, then you can look into recording your media to 4 channels for digital playback. This forum has many tutorials and discussions about doing just that. It's an area in which I have no expertise. I will say based on your post that in order to record 4 channel quad your recorder will have to be downstream of your decoder - in other words you can't just skip the decoding and still hear the quad from vinyl. Also and finally, many here swear by the Surround Master for their decodes. Others will have opinions about whether any generation of this decoder does a better job than a legacy decoder.

I hope this helps!

Hi, thanks for the detailed reply this was really helpful to get me up to speed and consider my options. From this "whether any generation of this decoder does a better job than a legacy decoder." I take it that my Audionics space and image composer upstream of whatever recording system I decide to use is probably a good place to start. I am trying to avoid getting to much new gear and stick with "vintage 4 channel sound" I may go up to scad or beyond if I want more later. It;s as much fun thing to try as much as seeking the ultimate audio experince.

 

[Fourplay]

Just making sure you are making informed choices. Have a blast!

 

[barfle]

@49thdiver And welcome to a site full of amazing sounds and interesting people.

I concur that searching out digital releases is going to result in better digital files of your quad collection, but sometimes you have to just try your own ideas. IIRC, a few laserdiscs had digital surround tracks, and of course any stereo recording can be run through a QS or RM decoder and give you a probably pleasant effect, even if it’s not the “artist’s intent” (which is usually the goal of hifi).

One thing you’re liable to run across is the fact that SACDs are special, and their file format is not compatible with a lot of hardware. Oppo DVD players can rip the DSD files from an SACD, and can play them back via USB inputs, but not Ethernet (go figure). Also, depending on your player, seamless playback could be an issue, which is important if the recording has somgs that blend into one another. I imagine that a DSD file can be converted into PCM (.WAV), but it could result in degraded sound.

Not that any of this should discourage you from embarking on this journey! There may well be twists and turns ahead, but that’s part of the fun. Please post often about your process and progress.

 

[49thdiver]

Thanks for the encouragement.

 

[49thdiver]

Still here, almost finished building a computer to handle the recording and play back. I landed on a ESI Maya44 eX 4-In/4-Out PCIe Audio Interface Sound Card. Looks like it will do the trick at this startup stage anyway.
Looking for some simple software. Straight forward 4 channel recording and 4 channel playback. So far I have seen a lot of full on studio recording systems aimed at musicians, do not need all that over head or bells and whistle.
The software and "free" download that came with it are all the same. Foobar2000 looks like a great player but does not record, happy to use a separate recorder if that's best. Suggestions appreciated.

 

[par4ken]

Adobe Audition 3 was available as a free download for awhile. It has many nice features like the Surround Mixer.

At one time I used n-track studio but found it to be a bit buggy,

Audacity is supposed to support multi-channel, I haven't used it in awhile when I clicked on it I didn't see how to select more than two channels. Maybe someone else can help.

 

[49thdiver]

Adobe Audition 3 was available as a free download for awhile. It has many nice features like the Surround Mixer.

At one time I used n-track studio but found it to be a bit buggy,

Audacity is supposed to support multi-channel, I haven't used it in awhile when I clicked on it I didn't see how to select more than two channels. Maybe someone else can help.

Yeah the lawyers according to the website said they could not continue to allow free downloads of Audition 3 so it's gone. I did not look to see if someone has it posted elsewhere ?
I have tried to use audacity it seems ok so far you just select two stereo tracks to get 4 channel.
I have not tested the audio quality yet.
Thanks for the tip.

 

[Old Quad Guy]

Audacity is a good program for what it is. I haven’t dug too deep with what it can or cannot do. But it’s supposed to be able to do quite a few things. I found a ton information and videos about Multi-Channel and Audacity with a Google search. But here’s a good place to start:

https://manual.audacityteam.org/man/multi_channel_recording.html

Also try different Google searches using different terms, depending on what exact info you need. I used this term to search:

instructions how to set up your computer for multichannel sound using audacity

 

[barfle]

Still here, almost finished building a computer to handle the recording and play back. I landed on a ESI Maya44 eX 4-In/4-Out PCIe Audio Interface Sound Card. Looks like it will do the trick at this startup stage anyway.
Looking for some simple software. Straight forward 4 channel recording and 4 channel playback. So far I have seen a lot of full on studio recording systems aimed at musicians, do not need all that over head or bells and whistle.
The software and "free" download that came with it are all the same. Foobar2000 looks like a great player but does not record, happy to use a separate recorder if that's best. Suggestions appreciated.

Goldwave.

www.goldwave.com

It’s not all that expensive, it handles a ton of formats (no DSD, alas), and I’ve gotten half a dozen free upgrades in about 12 years of using it. It also rips and can be used for quite a bit of the metadata in music files.

 

[par4ken]

Goldwave.

www.goldwave.com

It’s not all that expensive, it handles a ton of formats (no DSD, alas), and I’ve gotten half a dozen free upgrades in about 12 years of using it. It also rips and can be used for quite a bit of the metadata in music files.

I don't think that it does multi-channel recording, or at least it didn't years ago when I used to use it.

 

[barfle]

I don't think that it does multi-channel recording, or at least it didn't years ago when I used to use it.

7.1 is where my version (6.80) tops out when I start a new file.