Shure HTS-5300 Acra-Vector Decoder

[jaybird100]

https://www.discogs.com/release/15503563-John-Obetz-Auditorium-Organ-Encores-Vol-1
https://www.discogs.com/release/8954306-Trammell-Starks-A-Copland-Portrait
https://www.discogs.com/release/10313781-Ferrante-A-Touch-Of-Art

I have several of these Stereosurround CD's. They sound great through the Surround Master.

 

[humprof]

Jeff, thanks for those links, Their is one I can add to the Dolby Surround discography. Humprof's question as to if the multitracks were used by Pro-arte is hard to answer as many company's would take a stereo recording and say upmix it to Dolby surround, HTS, etc. as I point out in my opening to the discography after communicating with the companies.

There are many methods used for creating a Dolby Surround Sound
compatible recording. One method is to use 4 channel Quadraphonic
recordings from the '70's. By running the 4 channel tape thru a Sound
Console and then output via 4 or 5 channels to a matrix encoder. Another
Method is to record the entire performance to 4 or more channels and mix
them from whatever number originally recorded to 4 channels that are fed
to the matrix encoder.
Some events are recorded with multiple stereo microphone groups placed
throughout the performance space in order to record the natural
acoustics, reverberant ques and phase data and do not use a Dolby
encoder at all. Others use the Spatializer system to widen the sound of
a stereo recording over 2 speakers that wraps around when played back on
a surround system.
One other approached is to record the performance via two channels.
After the recording is done, the two channels are sent to a computer
where room environments are added and then fed out of the computer
via 4 or 5 channels to a matrix encoder.

I suspect Pro-Arte did use a computer to manipulate the recording as they were under the umbrela of Intersound at this time and my conversations with them indicated they used upmixing of a sort to enhance playback for Dolby Surround. The companies that did use multitracks that I know of are RCA and Delos.

Thanks for that, Mark. (And @jaybird100.) I guess it's still a maybe, then. I've been trying to do some research on this, but I've had no breakthroughs. The prototype 3M digital recording system that Sound 80 used was definitely multitrack (32-track recorder and 4-track mastering deck), but I've found no report of how many tracks they actually used and/or how many were kept. I reached out to Sound 80, which is still in operation as a recording studio, but they sold the record label in the 80s and didn't keep any session logs. The producer, Tom Voegeli, is still around--I heard him on a podcast last year--but he hasn't answered my email query. And I can't find any recent traces of the engineer, Tom Jung. The surround remixer listed in the CD booklet is "Gary B. Rice," but Google isn't helping me find him, either.

 

[Sonik Wiz]

I love it when an old thread with Disclord's avatar pops up. If y'all just go to what's new latest posts it's easy to overlook the collection of links on the QQ front page. One of them is the Disclord archives. Some great info there including a paper on the Shure Acra-Vector decoding:

https://issuu.com/disclord/
you said:

Did Stereosound work from multitracks and transform them into "encoded" stereo? Or was it a system for "synthesizing" surround sound from an existing stereo recording? Or both?

One thing to remember is there was a period of time that basic Dolby matrix surround was the movie standard & the home units were quite poor. Units such as the Aphex, Proton, and even the Fosgate 101A (with it's "cinema" mode) did not qualify for Dolby approval. Their goal was to provide something better thanDolby offered at the time. Anything to do with Shure Stereosurround or Acra-Vector decoding falls into this camp as well.

The earlier post by @jaybird100 is exactly correct. I reviewed some Shure patents & it's obvious the Sure encode/decode is pretty unique. With out getting into math consider this for the encoding side:

Front left/right has no encode blending like SQ or Dolby matrix surround.

Center front is equal level matching phase like SQ/QS/Dolby.

Center back is equal level opposite phase (or polarity) like SQ/QS/Dolby

But the kicker is they represented left back/right back like Scheiber's original encode which is opposite phase (polarity) and mixing those rear corner signals by about -7dB.

So with stereo play back it would have a wide front stage, capable of good center front/back separation & the potential for good separation between the rear speakers.

I can't tell ya about any discs recorded in this Shure system but the basic concept is very unique. @gene_stl has a couple of Shure units & if he ever gets them hooked up I will be very interested in what he might say about them.

 

[humprof]

I love it when an old thread with Disclord's avatar pops up. If y'all just go to what's new latest posts it's easy to overlook the collection of links on the QQ front page. One of them is the Disclord archives. Some great info there including a paper on the Shure Acra-Vector decoding:

https://issuu.com/disclord/
you said:


One thing to remember is there was a period of time that basic Dolby matrix surround was the movie standard & the home units were quite poor. Units such as the Aphex, Proton, and even the Fosgate 101A (with it's "cinema" mode) did not qualify for Dolby approval. Their goal was to provide something better thanDolby offered at the time. Anything to do with Shure Stereosurround or Acra-Vector decoding falls into this camp as well.

The earlier post by @jaybird100 is exactly correct. I reviewed some Shure patents & it's obvious the Sure encode/decode is pretty unique. With out getting into math consider this for the encoding side:

Front left/right has no encode blending like SQ or Dolby matrix surround.

Center front is equal level matching phase like SQ/QS/Dolby.

Center back is equal level opposite phase (or polarity) like SQ/QS/Dolby

But the kicker is they represented left back/right back like Scheiber's original encode which is opposite phase (polarity) and mixing those rear corner signals by about -7dB.

So with stereo play back it would have a wide front stage, capable of good center front/back separation & the potential for good separation between the rear speakers.

I can't tell ya about any discs recorded in this Shure system but the basic concept is very unique. @gene_stl has a couple of Shure units & if he ever gets them hooked up I will be very interested in what he might say about them.

Google actually led me to the AES paper about the Stereosurround process--although to be honest, I didn't take the time to read it carefully (or feel like I had the technical understanding to fully "get" it). But I didn't realize it was part of an entire archive. That's a great resource!

In the end, whether the Stereosurround version of "Appalachian Spring" was synthesized from stereo or encoded from multitracks is all the same to me; the end result sounds pretty good either way. But I'd still love to know if there are multis sitting out there somewhere, waiting (theoretically) to be remixed in a modern format....

 

[Sonik Wiz]

In the end, whether the Stereosurround version of "Appalachian Spring" was synthesized from stereo or encoded from multitracks is all the same to me; the end result sounds pretty good either way. But I'd still love to know if there are multis sitting out there somewhere, waiting (theoretically) to be remixed in a modern format....

In post#5 @Bonzodog said:

Yes, we did supply encoders to music studios. I have a dozen or so StereoSurround CD's in a box somewhere. Mostly classical, but some pop and country. A couple of what we now call World Music.

He used to work for Shure. Perhaps if he reads this he could answer your question.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

I would certainly like to know what country and pop artists cds are encoded with HTS .

I know that Intersound/Pro Arte might be considered as pop ,but I have their listings from way back when. Like When they were in the process of issuing their HTS Catalogue.

@ J. PUPSTER

Cool find on the Organ Works cd on the RBW Record Label. That's a new one .