HiRez Poll Wilson, Steven - THE RAVEN THAT REFUSED TO SING [Blu-Ray Audio]

OFF

@warp2600, welcome on board my fellow-countrymate. Considering the cost/benefit ratio of universal players in Hungary I can recommend you Pioneer BDP-150. Afaik it plays BD 2D/3D, DVDA / DVDA-R, SACD / SACD-R and as I've heard there can be a possibility that the player might be modified to play ISO's (including SACD-R ISO!) from HDD.

ON

@grill, Hi there. I have already checked all the Pioneer players as I have a Pioneer DV600 universal player. Unfortunately the cheaper BDP150 excludes dvd-a playback.
But I don't want to highjack the thread.
I forgot to say how much I like the high res stereo mix of The Raven as well. Very airy, three dimensional and lifelike.
My fingers are crossed for the Grammy. This is how I anticipate it:
Best surround album (obviously)
Best rock album
Best rock performance - Luminol
Best rock song - Holy Drinker

grill said:

OFF

@warp2600, welcome on board my fellow-countrymate. Considering the cost/benefit ratio of universal players in Hungary I can recommend you Pioneer BDP-150. Afaik it plays BD 2D/3D, DVDA / DVDA-R, SACD / SACD-R and as I've heard there can be a possibility that the player might be modified to play ISO's (including SACD-R ISO!) from HDD.

ON

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I'd be interested to have it confirmed that it can in fact play SACD isos from HDD.... (in addition to SACD-Rs)

Guy Robinson said:

Excellent album! Incredible how much more detail (and bass) is in this 5.1 version in comparison to the MP3 stereo versions I have been listening to for the past few weeks. MP3's really are crap aren't they? Anyway, a 10! Don't miss it.

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Your logic is faulty here.

zfox said:

Using foobar2000 v1.2.3, Audiomuxer v0.9.4.8, ArcSoft DTS-MA decoder v1.1.0.7.

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Those peak differences (0.01dB) are far too small to matter

Full frequency range content in the LFE would not make as big a difference as duplicate bass in LFE vs other channels. IIRC Dolby specifies LFE content can be up to 120Hz. And subwoofer output above that is likely to be drastically falling off anyway (if it's truly a subwoofer). Duplicate bass on the other hand will all be routed to the sub, in a bass-managed system, likely leading to exaggerated bass output.

ssully said:

Full frequency range content in the LFE would not make as big a difference as duplicate bass in LFE vs other channels. IIRC Dolby specifies LFE content can be up to 120Hz. And subwoofer output above that is likely to be drastically falling off anyway (if it's truly a subwoofer). Duplicate bass on the other hand will all be routed to the sub, in a bass-managed system, likely leading to exaggerated bass output.

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Here's a look at the Blu-Ray wav files. You can see the LFE (4th Channel down) is full range. If solo'd in a full range speaker, you can hear drums in with the base. It's like having a 6th channel, not an LFE. Like I said earlier, the systems I've played it on have no issue (to my ear) with this. It sounds great, and I've played this disc a lot since it keeps growing on me. I still have yet to play anything from the limited book edition. I supposed it's about time I did!

Is there anything on the limited book edition that is not included on the Bluray? I suppose you are talking about the cd/dvd-v set.

warp2600 said:

Is there anything on the limited book edition that is not included on the Bluray? I suppose you are talking about the cd/dvd-v set.

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Yes - there is a second CD with 7 demo versions.

neil wilkes said:

Yes - there is a second CD with 7 demo versions.

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Oh, ok. It is in the deluxe box set. I thought you were talking about the media box set with 1 cd + 1 dvd (which I have got).

I have to say I didnt have great expectatations for this album, since Im not very fond of previous SW solo efforts.
I still bought the Limited Edition with book and everything cause I thought It would be al least cool to show off in the living room.


I will have to swallow my thoughts.


This album is great. sonically, surroundly, musically.

Its an album I could listen a lot, there are no moments that are bad in the entire album, and it is still growing on me on every listen.

Ok, I wont be my favourite album of all times, or has the greatest songs in the world (that one is from Tenacious D) but it is very enjoyable as a whole and the surround immerses you in the album greatly, its like when your listening to it, the rest of the world stopped.

I loved it in surround (still have to listen in stereo in the car so I can see if the same happens)

a 10. solid 10.

JonUrban said:

Here's a look at the Blu-Ray wav files. You can see the LFE (4th Channel down) is full range. If solo'd in a full range speaker, you can hear drums in with the base. It's like having a 6th channel, not an LFE. Like I said earlier, the systems I've played it on have no issue (to my ear) with this. It sounds great, and I've played this disc a lot since it keeps growing on me. I still have yet to play anything from the limited book edition. I supposed it's about time I did!

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A waveform tells you nothing about the *frequency* range of a channel -- you'd need a spectral view to investigate that. (and if you meant , full dynamic range, you'd still have to measure that.)

LFE content ,by industry standard, can range up to 120 Hz -- but I've heard of some hi-rez multichannel releases that go beyond that and are truly 'full range'; whether that's due to incompetence or 'artistic choice' is impossible to say without testimony from the engineers. A spectral view would tell what's happening here -- is it high-level content up to 120, or beyond? "Doubling" the bass is also known to happen and can account for loud LFE.

Any crossovers still apply though, and if the upper bass frequency content in the LFE of this bothers anyone , they can try lowering the crossover point.

ssully said:

A waveform tells you nothing about the *frequency* range of a channel -- you'd need a spectral view to investigate that. (and if you meant , full dynamic range, you'd still have to measure that.)

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Here you go:

FYI
The DR analysis:
foobar2000 1.1.15 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
log date: 2013-03-25 23:41:55

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Statistics for: 01-
Number of samples: 315075840
Duration: 54:42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Channel 1 Channel 2 Channel 3 Channel 4 Channel 5 Channel 6

Peak Value: -0.10 dB --- -0.10 dB --- -3.02 dB --- -2.54 dB --- -0.10 dB --- -0.10 dB
Avg RMS: -16.25 dB --- -16.21 dB --- -21.27 dB --- -24.24 dB --- -18.95 dB --- -18.73 dB
DR channel: 12.14 dB --- 11.93 dB --- 12.52 dB --- 15.35 dB --- 14.19 dB --- 13.73 dB
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Official DR Value: DR13

Samplerate: 96000 Hz
Channels: 6
Bits per sample: 24
Bitrate: 6948 kbps
Codec: FLAC
================================================================================

Now take a spectrum/FR graph of a front channel. And if you can, an LFE channel from a different disc that sounds like it has 'normal' (not full range) LFE, for comparison.

(I don't really get your FR graph ...it's hard to read the axes but it doesn't seem to logarithmic scale, nor quite linear scale either...though it looks more linear. Try plotting it on a logarithmic scale)

Well-recorded surround album both musically and technically. Frequency response up to 29 kHz, high dynamic range, no clipping. The surround album of 2013 (I hope I'll be wrong at the latter though :sun )

Fell in love with this album on travel trip! Listened to it, then the demos, then the album again. Just amazing. More cogent thoughts soon.

F the graphs, enjoy the music.

Finally voted after a lot of listens. I ended up giving it a 7.

The sonics and mix are a very solid 10 - give it 11 if I were Spinal Tap. The content however brings up a few issues with me and that's why I tried to play the disc a lot and try to let it grow a bit before I voted. Most of the content is actually pretty good, some superb (like the title track) but it's the execution that bugs me. What I like(d) about PT was the unique sound and I think that is something that's missing on this recording. For a guy that has said he didn't want a "generic" sound it seems that is just what he's done here. I've the utmost respect for musicians and their instruments but if there ever was one I wanted to take the sledgehammer to it's the blasted Rhodes fake piano..hate it with a passion and anything more than a very small dose sends me reeling.

The musicianship on the record can't be questioned - they're all superb players and that's what he wanted I assume. But being technically good is not the be all and end all. Marco is an awesome drummer, but I think he doesn't know when to step back and keep it simple as well as Gavin does. Adam for me is almost everything I don't like - technically super but nary an original thing to offer. Again, all my personal taste and opinion...it's like a band of guys that want to show off but don't know when to shut up - like having 5 Jordan Rudess' in your band when 1 is more than enough.

I couldn't disagree with you more - but you have the strength of your convictions and a rational explanation for why your willing to vote out of the norm - respect!

elmer said:

I couldn't disagree with you more - but you have the strength of your convictions and a rational explanation for why your willing to vote out of the norm - respect!

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Well, he's still one of my fave guys out there, and I'm not that well off that I'd spend close to $100 for a deluxe set that I expect I'm going to hate - he still gets the benefit of the doubt for me though I gotta say it may be waning a touch...if he continues with this band and direction I may not buy the next deluxe set.

I know why people love it. And given the era and music I grew up with I feel like I should love it too, so it bugs me just a little that I don't. I suppose it's that so much of the stuff of his I like looks forward with some nods to the influences from the past whereas GfD and The Raven look a little too much to the past and don't have the newer innovative feel I enjoyed so much.

Makes me wonder a bit if these 5.1 remixes of KC Lizard, J Tull, Caravan etc don't have a bit of a double-edged sword to them - great to get refreshing takes on these but did they take his own music down a path that I don't like?