Is this a recent Atmos release?
Dio "Holy Diver" Atmos Mix
- Thread starter LennonCobain
- Start date
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Will Kennedy & Matt Wallace told me they were working on this back in August, but I didn't know it came out.
The Atmos mix is kind of similar to the 5.1 version of Metallica's black album, there are long stretches of just reverb in the back broken up by the sudden appearance of a guitar or vocal overdub. The title track has Dio's voice isolated in the center speaker SW-style with harmonies in the sides, but all other songs do no use the center at all.
Thanks for the info. It’s hard to keep track of what is new sometimes just because (luckily) the spatial audio dam has broken!
Klaus Rosenthal
Rock Believer
Ugh, sounds like another warner upmix. How disappointing, Dio deserves better.
It’s definitely not an upmix, there are a lot of discrete elements in the side speakers (guitar overdubs, backing vocals, acoustic guitar in “Don’t Talk To Strangers”, keys in “Rainbow In The Dark”, etc).
Klaus Rosenthal
Rock Believer
Mabey upmix is the wrong word. I just listened to the first two tracks with my fronts turned off and there was very little activity in the rears, just the occasional vocal or guitar overdub, with faint ambience well below normal volume. Hardly a quality mix at any rate.
It's far from the best Atmos mix I ever heard, but there aren't enough instruments available to consistently keep all channels busy. Most of this album is drums/bass/rhythm guitar/vocals - you can't really separate the rhythm guitars from the drums in metal, so what does that leave to put in the back speakers? Overdubs.
I'm not sure what they had to work with, but maybe it would've sounded a bit more immersive if they'd made the drum kit wider - move the overheads further out into the room, have the tom rolls move through the sides/back, etc.
For Dio’s Holy Diver, is anyone else hearing what appears to be mistake with the guitar solo in Stand Up and Shot?
I’m listening on Apple Music, the Atmos mix, and on a 7.1 system.
If you go to 1:26 in the song where Dio sings, “Let it out”, it sounds like the guitar solo then starts early for a few seconds and then cuts out before the rest of the guitar solo starts. It’s like the solo is chopped and then misplaced the beginning just a bit early.
Please tell me I’m not the only one hearing something odd.
I’m listening on Apple Music, the Atmos mix, and on a 7.1 system.
If you go to 1:26 in the song where Dio sings, “Let it out”, it sounds like the guitar solo then starts early for a few seconds and then cuts out before the rest of the guitar solo starts. It’s like the solo is chopped and then misplaced the beginning just a bit early.
Please tell me I’m not the only one hearing something odd.
I don't plan on listening to that title, as I know it likely sounds like garbage. Dio just cannot get a break in his wonderful catalogue of music.
I agree, that part of the solo is definitely different than the version I grew up with. Starts too early, pauses, then gets back on track. Strange.
I have a theory that I want to run by people with more experience with Atmos... which is probably everyone here.
My setup again for reference: Apple Music, Denon AVR-S750H (7.1, no heights).
I listed to the whole Dio album tonight. By the fourth song in I thought it was the worst disaster of an Atmos mix I had ever heard in my short time with Atmos.
First song had the broken guitar solo. Caught in the Middle had some vocals in the back speakers that were about a second off from the vocals up front making for a disjointed listen.
By the time I got to Don’t Talk to Strangers, I figured the “demon voice” saying HELL in the early part of the song should sound amazing. Couldn’t even hear it! Maybe it was just ultra quiet in the rears, but that word should have popped out in surround somewhere.
Then I began to wonder. Correct me if I’m wrong, but shouldn’t Atmos kind of morph to your setup. So if there’s something intended the heights, shouldn’t it get moved to a speaker you actually have? Maybe that’s incorrect on my part.
My theory became that this is a mix that is really and seriously intended for a setup with heights. Maybe everything that I heard that was odd (and there was more than I mentioned above) would sound wonderful on a 5.1.4 or 7.1.4 setup.
Again, I’m relatively new to this, so I might be way off base. But I can’t believe a mix would be so bad unless it’s not actually bad, it just requires a certain setup to hear it the way it’s intended.
If feels obvious to me that there was a lot of intention with this mix... it wasn’t thrown together just to rush it out the door.
I’ve made a note to return to this one once I get my new receiver and get the two heights set up. Like I said, though... I could be way off here.
My setup again for reference: Apple Music, Denon AVR-S750H (7.1, no heights).
I listed to the whole Dio album tonight. By the fourth song in I thought it was the worst disaster of an Atmos mix I had ever heard in my short time with Atmos.
First song had the broken guitar solo. Caught in the Middle had some vocals in the back speakers that were about a second off from the vocals up front making for a disjointed listen.
By the time I got to Don’t Talk to Strangers, I figured the “demon voice” saying HELL in the early part of the song should sound amazing. Couldn’t even hear it! Maybe it was just ultra quiet in the rears, but that word should have popped out in surround somewhere.
Then I began to wonder. Correct me if I’m wrong, but shouldn’t Atmos kind of morph to your setup. So if there’s something intended the heights, shouldn’t it get moved to a speaker you actually have? Maybe that’s incorrect on my part.
My theory became that this is a mix that is really and seriously intended for a setup with heights. Maybe everything that I heard that was odd (and there was more than I mentioned above) would sound wonderful on a 5.1.4 or 7.1.4 setup.
Again, I’m relatively new to this, so I might be way off base. But I can’t believe a mix would be so bad unless it’s not actually bad, it just requires a certain setup to hear it the way it’s intended.
If feels obvious to me that there was a lot of intention with this mix... it wasn’t thrown together just to rush it out the door.
I’ve made a note to return to this one once I get my new receiver and get the two heights set up. Like I said, though... I could be way off here.
If you want to listen to Atmos as intended, get an Atmos setup, preferably in 7.1.4.
If you are referring to the line “Don’t go to heaven cuz it’s really only hell”, on the stereo cd (original mix), when he sings the word “hell”, there’s an added effect that sounds like a guitar slide that gives it that extra growl. On the Atmos mix, that effect is simply not there. I have a 7.1.4 setup, so the problem isn’t your setup, it’s the that mix is missing that element entirely. Either the mixers missed it or couldn’t find it and decided to skip it. So at least you know your setup isn’t the problem.
splinter7
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
Perhaps we can refer to a poor Atmos mix that isn't "Warnerized" as "Silverline Style" or "Silverline Grade"?
Just as soon as the new Denon receiver I want switches from Coming Soon to Buy Now.If you want to listen to Atmos as intended, get an Atmos setup, preferably in 7.1.4.
Another general note on the Dio release that I forgot to mention last night. Some of the song credits are listed as Black Sabbath. Go figure.
Nice, the other day I saw a book format edition of Holy Diver with a new 2022 stereo mix (by Andy Wallace if I recall correctly), but had no idea an Atmos mix was done.
splinter7
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
You would know better than I .... but could this have originally been intended for the Super Deluxe Edition released last May (2022)?
Which Denon are you waiting on?
X4800H. It was announced a few weeks ago as Coming Soon. Before that I was going to get the X4700H, but since this will be a Christmas gift from my wife to me (although she doesn’t know she’s getting this for me yet), I figured I could wait for the new model.
I bookmarked a page for that model on the Denon site and even downloaded the manual. But this week the page went dead. It’s still available on the Denon UK site, but not U.S. And it’s not listed with all the other Denon receivers currently available. Best Buy still has a page for it, but it’s not available for sale yet.
I’m guessing it’s a temporary issue and will pop back up soon.
Even more interested in getting it now to hook up height speakers and give Holy Diver another try, along with a load of other stuff that will hopefully sound even better than it does now with my current system.
Back to the album itself... others in this thread have mentioned the recent bookset for Holy Diver. I passed because I was happy with what I already had. But if an Atmos version had been included, it would have been an easy buy. A classic album. And the bookset format looks really nice on the shelf.
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