Gnarlywood: the thorn in Rhino's side?

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Should WMG/Rhino dump Gnarlywood and seek a different fulfillment partner?

  • Definitely

    Votes: 20 80.0%

  • Maybe

    Votes: 5 20.0%

  • No opinion

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Maybe not

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Definitely not

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    25
JediJoker

JediJoker

Audio Engineer/Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 13, 2015
Messages
2,850
Location
Portland, OR, USA
As we reach the 4 x 4 Quadio milestone—four batches of four individual releases—one thing has become very clear: many here have had negative experiences with Rhino's fulfillment partner, Gnarlywood LLC. From no shipping notifications to long delays to unnecessary split shipments to cracked cases, reports of customer side issues abound. I believe our own Foraging Rhino—a.k.a. Steel Woole, a.k.a Steve Woolard, Rhino's Director of A&R and Quadio program champion—has even expressed issues from the label's perspective, too. And, it would seem, none of us are alone in this:

Gnarlywood LLC, a.k.a. Livenation Merchandise, has F and 1-star ratings from the Better Business Bureau.

Oof. Search for "Gnarlywood" on Google and one of the top results is a litany of negative Reddit threads going back several years. They've been in business for ten years and don't seem to be improving much, if at all, and may even be getting worse. I can only assume that Warner Music Group and Rhino have a sweetheart fulfillment deal, perhaps stemming from a relationship with Live Nation Entertainment proper (another target of much customer and industry criticism). Even so, I would hope that the level of incompetence on display and myriad customer complaints might sway WMG/Rhino to seek a better partner.

So, where do you stand on this issue?
 
In my opinion: definitely. I've had issues with most of my Rhino Store shipments, notably cracked cases and multiple packages that could have easily been consolidated. If I were WMG, I would be embarrassed to be associated with a BBB F-rated company.
 
Gnarlywood's level of ineptitude ought to be sufficient grounds for WMG to break whatever contract they might have signed. At this point, I'm willing to wait 60-90 days till Rhino "exclusives" are released to other retailers.
 
Rhino has been well aware of these issues for years. Their actions speak loud and clear: they know there's an issue, and they don't care. If they did, they would have done something years ago. The small delays with the quadio batches have been minor inconveniences for me so far, not something I'd normally complain about, but I'm still bitter over the months long battle I had to go through to clear up a pre-Christmas order that resulted in late Christmas gifts, and the insults their twitter account hurled at me when I went public with it. That experience taught me that their operation methods are such:

- We'll ship it when we ship it, if you don't like that, too bad
- If an item is backordered or there is some sort of delay, we will not communicate any of that info to you. See above.
- If you have any questions about your order, any method to contact us will be ignored and responded to by an automated email with the same generic tips you've already tried
- If the order is taking too long and you want a refund, too bad! That would require us to read your emails, and we sure as hell aren't going to start doing that now
- If you want to go public with your situation on twitter, we will do our best to insult you and claim that you're the one that isn't communicating with us

That they operate in a way that they will withhold your funds without any commitment of timeline to render goods, and without any method of cancellation or refund when a significant amount of time has passed without shipment of goods, is beyond unacceptable! The only method of recourse in such situations is to file claims and let some 3rd party sort things out. That is quite shady, and borders on theft.

It's sad that a company that puts out such great product has allowed this reputation ruining bullshit continue like it has. To see update after update of similar issues still occurring really pisses me off.
 
The only issue I have had with the first three batches (I haven't ordered the fourth, yet, and really only want two out of the four), is not necessarily receiving a timely shipping notice. Other than that, the shipments, themselves were timely and no damage. Same with Joni's set.

Doug
 
While I have only ordered five times directly from Rhino, 4 of the 5 have had lengthy shipping delays and/or customer support issues where order numbers were not found in the system but subsequently arrived.

I
 
Chalk it all up to growing pains. RHINO has certainly done us all a valuable service by catering to our surround needs in the last few months...and in some cases beyond the call of duty.

Yes, their shipping department could definitely use some 'revisions' and I'm sure in time these problems will all be alleviated.

The important thing is the quality of their product is first rate, their prices [especially with coupon codes and bundle packaging] more than fair and yeah, I'm sure their service department could use a bit more 'etiquette' but when those discs arrive and we pop them in our players ..... hopefully ALL is FORGIVEN!
 
I’ve liked all of the product I’ve ordered including some vinyl sets. I’ve gotten everything quickly (except two Quadio discs early on which had wrong release dates that they couldn't straighten out), and I can afford the product at the current prices with codes and bundles, and $100+ orders. So I don’t care so much that the tracking numbers seem to arrive so late. I have always quickly gotten an order number and confirmation email right after I paid.

Better packing would be the first thing I would do if in charge. Investing in more bubble wrap should not ruin their bottom line, or bust the budget and should not mean that the free shipping ($100+ purchase) deal becomes a thing of the past.
 
Last edited:
4-earredwonder said:
Chalk it all up to growing pains. RHINO has certainly done us all a valuable service by catering to our surround needs in the last few months...and in some cases beyond the call of duty.

Yes, their shipping department could definitely use some 'revisions' and I'm sure in time these problems will all be alleviated.

The important thing is the quality of their product is first rate, their prices [especially with coupon codes and bundle packaging] more than fair and yeah, I'm sure their service department could use a bit more 'etiquette' but when those discs arrive and we pop them in our players ..... hopefully ALL is FORGIVEN!
Click to expand...
Ralphie
yup. Product is first rate but that does not give them leeway for shoddy shipping. First 3 Quad shipments are running 100 percent. 100 percent meaning every shipment has had damage. Joni did arrive fine - thank goodness.

I want my cake and I want to eat it too.
Afterall, I bought that damn cake !
 
quicksrt said:
Well Rhino is getting the product out there faster than Japan is with their quad SACDs. And lately faster than DV is bringing out pop and rock titles. I can live with late tracking info if it means product is coming this consistently.
Click to expand...
But what I do LOVE about Dutton Vocalion. When ordering from them it seems within minutes [or maybe a few hours] they email you that the order is being processed and in some cases SHIPPED! And I'm sure they're not a large company with copious staff members!

Why do you think I refer to Michael J. Dutton as THE WIZARD OF WATFORD? 🧙‍♂️
 
4-earredwonder said:
But what I do LOVE about Dutton Vocalion. When ordering from them it seems within minutes [or maybe a few hours] they email you that the order is being processed and in some cases SHIPPED! And I'm sure they're not a large company with copious staff members!

Why do you think I refer to Michael J. Dutton as THE WIZARD OF WATFORD? 🧙‍♂️
Click to expand...
I'm waiting for the next batch hoping for some rock, as it seems like it's been 15 months since REO and Nugent. I have two DV titles on my list and am waiting for the next installment to order. I know they will announce new titles right the day after I place an order if I order now.
 
Here’s a story that some might find interesting- From 1997 to 2002 Rhino had an annual trivia contest called the RMAT. The grand prize every year was the winner would get every Rhino CD released going forward for as long as the company exists.

I won the competition one year, and about 18 years everything went smoothly, and I received boxes of Rhino CDs every couple of weeks. Then all of a sudden the deliveries stopped. I contacted different people within the company for years, and the problem was was not really fixed. I was told that it was an “issue with their distributors “. Now I get an occasional package, but it’s not consistent, and I only seem to get about 25% of the releases instead of all of them as stipulated by the prize
 
JediJoker said:
As we reach the 4 x 4 Quadio milestone—four batches of four individual releases—one thing has become very clear: many here have had negative experiences with Rhino's fulfillment partner, Gnarlywood LLC. From no shipping notifications to long delays to unnecessary split shipments to cracked cases, reports of customer side issues abound. I believe our own Foraging Rhino—a.k.a. Steel Woole, a.k.a Steve Woolard, Rhino's Director of A&R and Quadio program champion—has even expressed issues from the label's perspective, too. And, it would seem, none of us are alone in this:

Gnarlywood LLC, a.k.a. Livenation Merchandise, has F and 1-star ratings from the Better Business Bureau.

Oof. Search for "Gnarlywood" on Google and one of the top results is a litany of negative Reddit threads going back several years. They've been in business for ten years and don't seem to be improving much, if at all, and may even be getting worse. I can only assume that Warner Music Group and Rhino have a sweetheart fulfillment deal, perhaps stemming from a relationship with Live Nation Entertainment proper (another target of much customer and industry criticism). Even so, I would hope that the level of incompetence on display and myriad customer complaints might sway WMG/Rhino to seek a better partner.

So, where do you stand on this issue?
Click to expand...
I've commented on "some" good experiences I've had in the last 12 months mainly. But the ratings from the BBB are just unacceptable and can't be ignored by a company using them. Why would the heads of Live Nation put up with the long term poor management over in that div. Maybe they are paying horrible hourly rates for the work expected and they are getting what they pay for?
 
quicksrt said:
I’ve liked all of the product I’ve ordered including some vinyl sets. I’ve gotten everything quickly (except two Quadio discs early on which had wrong release dates that they couldn't straighten out), and I can afford the product at the current prices with codes and bundles, and $100+ orders. So I don’t care so much that the tracking numbers seem to arrive so late. I have always quickly gotten an order number and confirmation email right after I paid.

Better packing would be the first thing I would do if in charge. Investing in more bubble wrap should not ruin their bottom line, or bust the budget and should not mean that the free shipping ($100+ purchase) deal becomes a thing of the past.
Click to expand...

I've bought many vinyl pieces too and all of the Quadio's offered. Comparing the shipping packaging between the 2 is night and day.
Every piece of vinyl is in perfect condition when it arrives at my doorstep. And I have never recieved a Quadio set that the cases arrived in perfect condition. I mean, how much more could it cost to double box the Quadios? I would gladly pay $5.00 more for a set shipped with double boxing
Ive been hesitant to tell my story of contacting Rhino customer service, as it was easier to purchase extra cases, AND I love and appreciate the Quadio releases. (Iam secretly hoping for some classic rock in the upcoming sets). I will be purchasing every set offered.......

BUT..........I thought maybe Rhino wasn't aware of the damaged products, so I contacted them and explained I have never received a Quadio set that wasn't damage. Myself and Rhino CS went thru a handful of email exchanges. I sent the requested pics of damaged cases. Rhino agreed to replace the sets damaged, but wanted the damaged case and disc returned for a replacement. I didn't want to return a perfectly good disc and then take a chance of getting a damaged case in the returned shipment. When asked what I wanted, I explained all I was looking for is to let them know their shipping cardboard needs to be improved..........and that was last year.
So basically it was a waste of time and effort on my part. I bought a dozed extra cases and now just shrug my shoulders, roll my eyes and throw the cracked case in the trash.

I waited a week to order the last batch of Quadios letting the push at the release die down a bit, in hoping that may make the shipping easier. We'll see if that makes a difference
IF they all arrive undamaged, it will be the first time for me. But if not, Iam prepared and looking forward to every Quadio release
 
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