Akai 630dss has flutter issue. Help!

[westgate]

hello, i have above 30 year old 4 track/4 channel direct drive reel to reel recorder. works fine/sounds great but for the flutter.

back ~'85 it took 2 ~4 ' falls but worked ok after. in '90 machine was stored in old barn for next 18 years where it was exposed to temps from -10f to 90f every year. i 're-found' it 3 months ago and am in process of resurrecting. i cleaned/degaussed heads, tape path.

when i play it now there is slight flutter at 3.75/7.5 ips. there is also a very faint vibrato like sound from capstan motor, ~5 times/sec @ 3.75 ips and ~10 times/sec @ 7.5 ips; i think it's associated with flutter.
i removed some small panels off back of unplugged machine, stuck my hand in to turn capstan motor but couldnt spin it fast enough to recreate vibrato like sound. i was gonna open it up but i decided it's too much for my tech/repair experience level.

based on what i've written, anyone got some ideas for a cheap, easy fix?
otherwise it's off to 'approved audio services' in ct. for repairs.

thanks!

 

[JonUrban]

This is the same model machine I use, and I can tell you that it would be well worth fixing. Mine has been functioning since I bought it new in 1977 and has never failed me. It's hard to say what's causing your problem, but sending it to CD might not be a bad idea. Actually, you might want to drive it down there. Shipping these things is a real chore!

 

[westgate]

thanks for encouragement!
i sent an email similar to my op to 'approved'; they responded saying "no guarantees, they'll do their best, send it in".

they rehabbed my nakamichi 600 4 years ago, had to make a part and it's still running strong. so i guess i'll 'send it in'.
or maybe drive it down-~130 miles.

 

[westgate]

won an akai gx-630dss last pm off of ebay. this'll make 2!
it can keep the one i've had for 30 years (still waiting for rehab) company along with my gx 230d 7"er.:banana:

 

[westgate]

my 'new to me' and second gx-630dss arrived tues, 12/9 via ups. i cleaned up exterior, cleaned/degaussed heads, etc, loaded tape-

plays and sounds great!!

as i spent some of the repair $ for original, for this one, original will have to wait 'til jan '09 to go to 'interface' in keene nh for rehab.

 

[braver]

Just got my gx630 today. What's the best way to clean the heads? Some sites recommend qtips -- are they lint-free? With what do you degauss the heads? What other care should one take first thing?

Also -- I have some old tapes recorded at 1 7/8 IPS. I've heard that you can have an adapter on the capstan to slow the tape down for that speed -- any info on that?

 

[zabble]

Just got my gx630 today. What's the best way to clean the heads? Some sites recommend qtips -- are they lint-free? With what do you degauss the heads? What other care should one take first thing?

Also -- I have some old tapes recorded at 1 7/8 IPS. I've heard that you can have an adapter on the capstan to slow the tape down for that speed -- any info on that?

Q-tips are fine. My old sound engineering teacher Malcolm Chisholm used to use gun patches to clean his tape heads. I use them on reel-to-reel decks, and they work great.

Make sure to buy a head cleaner made specifically for tape heads. Isopropyl alcohol will work in a pinch (it's better than nothing), but it doesn't dissolve tape emulsion like the real thing.

Also, don't use alcohol on the rubber pinch rollers. Instead use--you guessed it--rubber pinch roller cleaner. Alcohol over time will dry up the pinch rollers, rendering them useless.

 

[braver]

OK, here's an interesting problem. I have family tapes recorded on a 1960s Soviet mono reel to reel tape recorder. Each tape is two-sided -- you turn it over and listen to the other side.

When I play it on the Akai, I hear backward recording from the left front channel, and a regular recording form the right front. I connected the 1-3 outputs to a TAPE1 input of my amp, and the 2-4 output to a TAPE2 input of the amp. I don't hear anything on the TAPE2. The VU meters on 2-4 move though, and 1-3. My rectangle labeling the inputs and outputs on the Akai is unglued however and sits separately. BTW, what's the best way to glue it -- sone gentle glue in little amount? I assume that the orientation is up the same way as the front, then 1-3 are on the right when we look at the back from the back.

Anyways, I was pondering connecting 1 and 2 to two neighboring inputs on the amp, horizontally, and same for 3-4, but I guess that's not the way the current goes? I could also disconnect one speaker, but that's annoying to do every time... What the multi-channel experts advice would be to get the old mono back?

 

[The Quadfather]

Since the tapes are mono, just take the best sounding channel and dub the tapes off to another machine. Split the signal with a wye, and record it as a stereo signal. The other machine could be another recorder or a CD burner. Play the discs, and keep the tapes as masters.

 

[jdmack]

Also, don't use alcohol on the rubber pinch rollers. Instead use--you guessed it--rubber pinch roller cleaner. Alcohol over time will dry up the pinch rollers, rendering them useless.

Are there any cons to using a cleaner such as 409 or Fantastic on pinch rollers? I've been doing that for sometime without any issues, but I don't have reason to clean pinch rollers that often, so I don't know what the long term effects might be.

J. D.

 

[westgate]

Are there any cons to using a cleaner such as 409 or Fantastic on pinch rollers? I've been doing that for sometime without any issues, but I don't have reason to clean pinch rollers that often, so I don't know what the long term effects might be.

J. D.

terry witt (see quote below), the guy who rebuilds p-rollers, says to just use warm water and soap to clean them. i use those and and a soft bristled toothbrush to scrub the rollers. seems to work very well.
======================================================================================================
"What to use for cleaning pinch rollers and other rubber items

Many people ask me what to clean their pinch rollers with. I wish I had a good super secret formula I used and could tell you about, but I don't. I see daily and heard what chemicals do to rubber, and it isn't good. Sooner or later the rubber will be ruined. Some types of rubber dry out, crack, and get hard, while others get soft and gooey.

My advise and its only my opinion, and I know this doesn't clean as good as some high octaine chemical, but I suggest just plain old dish soap and water, then rinse good."

http://www.terrysrubberrollers.com/

 

[westgate]

3 weeks later...

original gx630dss (and a replacement capstan motor i got from rolph @ vintage tx) was picked up last wed, 2-11-09,by scott f., a local tech repair guy. if he cant save old motor/capstan, he'll install 'new' one. also a few more minor things to fix.

about 2 weeks ago, i determined that the capstan was bent about 1/16" or less, causing the flutter issue. the bend was determined by looking carefully headon at the spinning (wobbling!) capstan. i hadn't noticed the bend/wobble previously.

be nice to hear the old girl sing properly again.

edit-re cleaning pinch rollers and other rubber parts- windex, unscented, applied with q-tip, recommended by rolf at vintage tx.

 

[westgate]

sorry for posting this in more than one place, at one time. i'm excited!
edit-mods, if you want to delete my other 2 identical posts, please leave this one and delete the other two.
or leave them all. thanks.

re gx-630d-ss:
today, i talked to scott, the tech who's fixing bent capstan issue. he had tried a replacement motor, it didnt fit (same part #, different mounting configuration ??).
so betwixt yesterday and today, he went back in, cleaned the mounting brackets, a bb-like bearing and some teflon parts, remounted original motor, wired it back up, put on a tape and...

it sounded great!, he said.

i specifically asked him about the flutter, he said he didn't hear any. (he's also a working musician and knows if something doesn't sound right.)
I, still being a little doubtful, asked him to play a tape with piano music on it to be sure there is no flutter. he said he will.
(note-he doesn't work on all that many r2rs so he doesn't yet have alignment and/or flutter tapes or whatever).
i think he said he has some sort of Kenwood flutter meter-?

anyhoo, if the flutter turns out to really be gone, then all will be well.

 

[westgate]

It's back home and singing like a boid!!!
update to all the updates:
AKAI GX-630D-SS REHABBED AND BACK HOME AGAIN!

scott frye of audio fixation in springfield, vt was the tech on this. he ended up switching out the rotor (the capstan is one end) of the replacement motor, and inserted it into the body of the old motor and remounted it, wired it back up and

VOILA!!

it works! no more flutter!
i brought it back home about 45 minustes ago, and played a tape. SWEET!
for a 30 year old machine it's now in great shape.

put it in its own new rack right next to the other gx-630d-ss in its own rack.
the new racks have the recorders poised about 45 inches off the floor, just the right height for head cleaning, light maintanance, etc without having to bend over, etc. which is hard for me to do cuz of my c.o.p.d.

thurs, 4/23/09 is the delivery date for gx-630d-ss #3. guess i'm a collector of them now.
:banana::banana::banana:

hope to get a camera very soon for pics.

 

[JonUrban]

Great news! Grab some photos and let us have a look.

 

[westgate]

thanks!
re camera-
soon, i hope.
gotta learn how to use it after i get one.

 

[westgate]

from post #14, re akai gx-630d-ss #3-

"thurs, 4/23/09 is the delivery date for gx-630d-ss #3. guess i'm a collector of them now."

just checked UPS tracking # and package is out for delivery as of this am.
A WHOLE DAY EARLY!:banana:

 

[westgate]

Akai gx-630d-ss #3 has arrived!
well, AKAI GX-630D-SS #3 was just dropped off by ups about an hour ago. it took me that long to open the flimsy outer box, shovel out the noodles and then i'm staring at a 'whirlwind' road case' encasing the deck, 2 nab hubs, a 10.5" reel of sony tape, and an empty akai 10.5" take up reel, and a users manual.
(those accessories are worth maybe $150 if 'parted out', based on ebay prices i've seen recently.)

so i finally get the deck out of the case, clean the heads, etc, load a tape on and let her rip. sounds very nice, really nice in fact! a couple of switches could use a shot of deoxit but that's to be expected. may need a few minor adjustments re hubs or 10" reels very lightly rubbing on front panel of machine.
may need a little brake work also, not sure yet.

for under $240 + $60 shipping, not a bad deal at all. i think someone may have made a few extra sheckels on the shipping but what the hey...
still a darn good deal!
:banana::banana::banana:

 

[westgate]

this is my akai gx-630d-ss 'collection'.
the one on the left has the 'new' capstan motor.

 

[JonUrban]

Now THAT's impressive!