Sound card for recording 4-channel audio

[Brett_Crossley]

Dear All,

I have recently set up a Pentium 4 PC, with a view to dumping my quad vinyl collection (SQ, QS, CD-4) to hard disk and then to DTS or Dolby Digital CD-R. I'm sure that many on this list are aware of the techniques involved

I'm now at the point where I need to buy a cost-effective sound card with at least 4 channels of Analog I/O. Those who've done this before: any recommendations?

I have scanned the Web and am aware of issues such as Latency - normally this means delay between input and output, however this is not an issue in this application. However _inter-channel_ latency is a concern and I gather that this can be a problem with older cards (also that it is less likely on a Mac where the PCI buss timing is tighter).

I'm also aware that, rather than go with an internally-mounted PCI card, many prefer to use "outboard" A/D converters (to minimize problems with RF etc), however it seems that internal cards can now be purchased with specs well in excess of that required for a vinyl source..

M-Audio seem to have a good solution with the "Delta 44", which provides four balanced / unbalanced I/Os on a 1/4" breakout box. It's US$200 - see http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta44-main.html for details.

I would be grateful for any thoughts or other suggestions. Thanks in advance -

Brett Crossley
Sydney, Australia.

 

[JonUrban]

I tried an M-Audio card once. It seemed to work fine, however it would not output a DTS Stream without screwing it up. I tried everything, but the digital out would never trip my DTS decoder. I ended up sending it back.

If you search here on M-Audio, you will find a few other threads on this topic.

 

[Brett_Crossley]

Thanks Jon, much appreciated. Tab Patterson and Cai Campbell also provided much useful information. I have now located:

M-Audio "Delta 44" - http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta44-main.html
Terratec "Phase 88" - http://audioen.terratec.net/product.php?pid=4
Aardvark "LX6" - http://www.aardvarkaudio.com/products/2496/

The dialog following this post on [email protected] has really opened my eyes as to the many ways in which quad enthusiasts like to experience their music - for example, I was not aware of the strong interest in using authentic "vintage" equipment (dumping quad to 4-track tape etc).

My own aim is to experience, as definitively as possible, what the artist and producer intended the listener to hear. Note that this does not preclude using today's technology to achieve a "cleaner", lower-distortion signal; however it does mandate that original localization is preserved; therefore the original speaker layout etc.

So for CD-4, no problem: I'll sample the quad signal from my (almost-rebuilt) 4DD-5 to hard disk, and use SurCode to create a DTS stream which I'll burn to CD-R for replay via a contemporary DVD player / receiver to a quad speaker layout. [For my purposes, any minor losses in A/D or DTS encoding are outweighed by the fact that the resulting disc can be played without further degradation.]

However for SQ and QS vinyl there is an issue, as there is no "definitive" decoding scheme, merely a choice between passive matrix or one of several logic-enhanced systems. Therefore in light of the comments received it seems the best approach might be to sample the 2-channel matrixed signal, burn to CD-R then play back via a system with switchable matrix decoding options.

Thanks again to all for your feedback.

BC.

 

[bayards]

Just going down the homemade route too. Have a CD4 demodulator from e-bay, another UD4/CD4/SQ/QS box (ebay again) on its way, a new turntable and new Shibata stylus.

Also courtesy of ebay an M-audio 1010LT (8 channels in) and Wavelab. Ebay is proving a wonderhouse of Quadradiscs, LPs and such. Even have a strange 2 x CD thing coming from Argentina of Pink Floyd's "WYWH" coming - CD 1 has the front channels and CD 2 the rear channels of the quad mix. Should be easy to stitch together.

Just wish EMI would do the job for me!

H :sun

 

[Malcolm2010]

Just going down the homemade route too. Have a CD4 demodulator from e-bay, another UD4/CD4/SQ/QS box (ebay again) on its way, a new turntable and new Shibata stylus.

Also courtesy of ebay an M-audio 1010LT (8 channels in) and Wavelab. Ebay is proving a wonderhouse of Quadradiscs, LPs and such. Even have a strange 2 x CD thing coming from Argentina of Pink Floyd's "WYWH" coming - CD 1 has the front channels and CD 2 the rear channels of the quad mix. Should be easy to stitch together.

Just wish EMI would do the job for me!

H :sun

I too have the Denon UDA-100, and was also bidding on the one you won. It may not be as good a bargain as you think. The seller did not have the original set up disc, you absolutely need this to set up CD-4 or UD-4. You can play it by ear, but the results are disappointing. No other disc will do. Also the matrix side SQ/QS are not logic enhanced, just the basic 3-6 dB separation between channels. I wish you luck!!

Malcolm

 

[bayards]

I too have the Denon UDA-100, and was also bidding on the one you won. It may not be as good a bargain as you think. The seller did not have the original set up disc, you absolutely need this to set up CD-4 or UD-4. You can play it by ear, but the results are disappointing. No other disc will do. Also the matrix side SQ/QS are not logic enhanced, just the basic 3-6 dB separation between channels. I wish you luck!!

Malcolm

Hi Malcom

Oops - always awkward moment when 2 ebayers meet! I do have an original CD4 test record 45rpm from JVC - which for some strange reason I didn't throw away.

I had SQ/QS way back in the 70's as I started work - and was never really happy with either matrix system - but if pressed would prefer QS. I lost out on an ebay bid for some Sansui gear last week - by one Euro. Dear old ebay.

Regards

Howard

 

[Malcolm2010]

Hi Malcom

Oops - always awkward moment when 2 ebayers meet! I do have an original CD4 test record 45rpm from JVC - which for some strange reason I didn't throw away.

I had SQ/QS way back in the 70's as I started work - and was never really happy with either matrix system - but if pressed would prefer QS. I lost out on an ebay bid for some Sansui gear last week - by one Euro. Dear old ebay.

Regards

Howard

Hi Howard,
Don't worry about Ebay, this happens all the time, many of the members of this board have done the same thing. Your JVC Cd-4 test record will not work, the UDA-100 requires set up to be done in the UD-4 mode with a special UD-4 test LP, then it will work for CD-4. Believe me I have tried on my UDA-100 and the results are underwhelming. Set up for this unit does not follow the same sequence as a normal CD-4 demodulator would. When you get the unit, check out the user manual.

Cheers

Malcolm