Unknown Quad (?) CD

[Horbus]

I don't know whether this is the right place for my request, if not plse move it to the right Forum.

Yesterday a friend of mine donated a couple of CD's to me. Among these was a CD from a band called 3rd Force playing kind of Smooth Jazz. The Record Label is located in Malibu, CA and known as "Higher Octave Music". The CD itself is mastered as "audiophile 32 bit" and it's stated to be compatible with 4 Channel Surround Sound.
Does anyone know the Record Label and have more info on the recording and whether it's Surround Music similar to some Dolby Surround CD's??
Thanks in advance for your comments.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

https://www.discogs.com/release/1147925-3rd-Force-Force-Field

 

[Horbus]

https://www.discogs.com/release/1147925-3rd-Force-Force-Field

Well, this does Not answer my question. Or ist there any Info on the mastering which I may have overseen???

 

[fizzywiggs41]

I think it's an interesting CD .

Compatible with 4 Channel , well pretty much all stereo cd's are compatible with 4 Channel Sound , in 1999.
It might be an attempt to state its compatibility with other 5 Channel matrix systems on Receivers of the day. Such as Dolby pro , Shure HTS , Circle , and a
small number of others. But without stating a specific matrix , it's impossible to say it's a 4 Channel matrix CD .

 

[somethingcleveridunno]

It's ProLogic compatible.

Wednesday, June 30, 1999
FDS Labs Annoucnes System to Provide 4-Channel Surround for the Standard Audio CD



Waring F.D.S. Labs announces the completion of several years of beta testing for the F.D.S. Surround Sound mastering system for CD and cassette. Surround Sound can now be created from a standard stereo master and is completely compatible with mono, stereo, or Prologic sound. The 4-channel/Prologic button on receivers can now be used for music, as CDs and cassettes will be audio mastered by the F.D.S 4-channel compatible surround sound system.



The system, which works by transferring the 64-bit process into 16-bit, provides what analog fans may rate a richness of sound comparable to a vinyl LP, without the noise. Projects on which the system has already been used include William Aura�s Third Force on Higher Octave, John Lee hooker�s latest offering on Virgin Records, Morgan Creek�s soundtrack albums Wild America and Incognito, and the Sony Classical release of The King and I, in English and four other languages.



For more information, contact FDS Labs at 213-383-2155, visit their Web site and e-mail them at

www.fdslabs.com
[email protected]

https://surroundpro.com/todays_news/archive/6_30_99_2/

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Cool.
Another matrix system , like Dolby etc.

Great work , @somethingcleveridunno .

 

[J. PUPSTER]

Where on the case/CD does it say Prologic encoded anyway?

I don't know, but it seems they may have been trying to dodge some "Dolby" licensing? Also F.D.S. Labs use Prologic (no space in the name) and I believe all Dolby was Pro Logic (with a space.) It's just all very hinky looking to me; but if my assumptions are off base I'm sure someone will correct me

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolby_Pro_Logic

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Where on the case/CD does it say Prologic encoded anyway?

I don't know, but it seems they may have been trying to dodge some "Dolby" licensing? Also F.D.S. Labs use Prologic (no space in the name) and I believe all Dolby was Pro Logic (with a space.) It's just all very hinky looking to me; but if my assumptions are off base I'm sure someone will correct me

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolby_Pro_Logic

No pupsi, not all Dolby was pro logic .
I believe their first iteration was 4 Channel (L,C,R,S) known as the MP Matrix.

IIRC Roger Dressler of Dolby Labs , also said some were just (L,C,R) , but which ones IDK. But they were in the minority.

 

[somethingcleveridunno]

No pupsi, not all Dolby was pro logic .
I believe their first iteration was 4 Channel (L,C,R,S) known as the MP Matrix.

IIRC Roger Dressler of Dolby Labs , also said some were just (L,C,R) , but which ones IDK. But they were in the minority.

"Dolby Stereo" I think was the branding.

 

[kfbkfb]

Interesting that companies feel like they need to reinvent the wheel with matrix type surround sound encoding systems (they could just use a slightly altered version of the old EV Stereo-4 matrix system).

https://www.discogs.com/release/515...eatest-Hits-65-TV-Themes-From-The-50s-And-60s

This CD is the first time I heard about "Waring FDS" processing (nothing in the booklet, only the logo on the CD), some of these old mono TV theme songs do have some surround content when played with (original) DPL, apparently due to the Waring FDS processing.

edit (more about the Waring FDS system):
https://books.google.com/books?id=0...Q6AF6BAgNEAM#v=onepage&q="waring fds"&f=false


Kirk Bayne

 

[Horbus]

It's ProLogic compatible.



https://surroundpro.com/todays_news/archive/6_30_99_2/

Many thanks for this info!! So, yet another but not well known attempt for CD Surround! May I have a little treasure there

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Further to this F.D.S. System I did some digging yesterday.

I really wanted to know which album of John Lee Hooker on Virgin Records used the FDS Encode. Why , well I've been busy lately to get his QS encoded albums .

Album is : John Lee Hooker -The Best Of Friends (98) Compilation
CD Pointblank/Virgin 7243 8 46424 2 6

This was a bit tricky as I only had a reference to Quadtech mastering studios , so I clicked on Quadtech a sure enough Mr Waring runs it and it specializes in 5.1 recording video, film and audio .

This album was recorded all over , each track, but was mastered at Quadtech.

Also there are many copies available on discogs ,super cheap, and I assume elsewhere as well.

 

[Old Quad Guy]

I put “3rd Force – Force Field CD” into eBay and found a bunch of these in the $5.50 - $6.50 range.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=3rd+force+–+force+field+cd&_sop=12&_kwlnd=1

 

[kfbkfb]

(no mention of 4 channel encoding though, sounds pretty good using DPL2 music)


Kirk Bayne

 

[MidiMagic]

Note that all patents for the original matrix systems from the early 1970s had expired by 1999.

This means that a Dynaquad, Hafler diamond, Electro Voice, or QS encoder (or the mixer encoder I made) can be used to encode an RM recording similar to DS. Almost every recording I ever made of live music is RM encoded.
There is no legal reason they would be prohibited from making such a recording. But trademarks last longer and would prevent them from using the names of the old systems as well as using the Dolby Surround name.

The encoding of Dolby Stereo/Dolby Surround did not change during the life of matrixed Dolby. There were three decoders (Dolby Surround, Pro Logic, and Pro-Logic II). All work with the same encoded material.

 

[Horbus]

Further to this F.D.S. System I did some digging yesterday.

I really wanted to know which album of John Lee Hooker on Virgin Records used the FDS Encode. Why , well I've been busy lately to get his QS encoded albums .

Album is : John Lee Hooker -The Best Of Friends (98) Compilation
CD Pointblank/Virgin 7243 8 46424 2 6

This was a bit tricky as I only had a reference to Quadtech mastering studios , so I clicked on Quadtech a sure enough Mr Waring runs it and it specializes in 5.1 recording video, film and audio .

This album was recorded all over , each track, but was mastered at Quadtech.

Also there are many copies available on discogs ,super cheap, and I assume elsewhere as well.

Suuuuper! Many thanks for that! I tried also a search but couldn't figure out how to get to the name of the Album!!! Here in Germany I could find an Album stating Pointblank/EMI with the identical #.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Suuuuper! Many thanks for that! I tried also a search but couldn't figure out how to get to the name of the Album!!! Here in Germany I could find an Album stating Pointblank/EMI with the identical #.

Your welcome, and look what you started . Uncovering a previously unknown matrix....that i would assume is compatible to Dolby Surround .

By 98 , DTS CD was well established, albeit with 100 or so releases , so I guess they went the matrix 4 Channel route as it was their own .

 

[somethingcleveridunno]

Your welcome, and look what you started . Uncovering a previously unknown matrix....that i would assume is compatible to Dolby Surround .

By 98 , DTS CD was well established, albeit with 100 or so releases , so I guess they went the matrix 4 Channel route as it was their own .

Like @MidiMagic said, the patents for the matrix systems were expired by this time... Perhaps the primary interest was avoiding license fees from Dolby or DTS.

 

[Horbus]

Further to this F.D.S. System I did some digging yesterday.

I really wanted to know which album of John Lee Hooker on Virgin Records used the FDS Encode. Why , well I've been busy lately to get his QS encoded albums .

Album is : John Lee Hooker -The Best Of Friends (98) Compilation
CD Pointblank/Virgin 7243 8 46424 2 6

This was a bit tricky as I only had a reference to Quadtech mastering studios , so I clicked on Quadtech a sure enough Mr Waring runs it and it specializes in 5.1 recording video, film and audio .

This album was recorded all over , each track, but was mastered at Quadtech.

Also there are many copies available on discogs ,super cheap, and I assume elsewhere as well.

I got the CD today with the same product code and label but there is no hint on surround music, neither on the CD itself or the case nor on the booklet

p.s.: Found the info on the 2nd last page of the booklet where it stated: Mastered by Hank Waring and David Bard, Quad Teck Digital, Los Angeles, CA.
But no specific hint of quadro sound!

 

[Mark Anderson]

I do not see anything in the links above about an encoding process. It appears that they believe the mastering process of a two channel recording provides a better recording for listening on a matrix 4-channel surround system. To me this is like using the Spatializer process on a two channel recording.

"Surround Sound can now be created from a standard stereo master and is completely compatible with mono, stereo, or Prologic sound. The system, which works by transferring the 64-bit process into 16-bit, provides what analog fans may rate a richness of sound comparable to a vinyl LP, without the noise."