Pink Floyd - Wish You Were Here - SQ LP issued in the US vs. UK

[quicksrt]

Something I was told a while back about this album, and I found it interesting.

I looked just now for a posting in the "Spotlight SQ/LPs" section of the forum and I could not find a Spotlight matrix LP thread on WYWH, how sad.

Anyway, this album was one of the first quad albums that I bought, actually seeking out the quad version, and I avoided the stereo pressing when I finally scraped up the cash to purchase this title in release year.

I had no quad gear at the time, and I would not have any real quad gear for decades. I've simply liked SQ and CD-4 LPs played back in stereo since about 1975.

So when I finally did hear this SQ album played back in stereo I loved it. The ambiance seemed more spacious, bits of music I heard were different than what I'd heard on my friend's standard copy. I loved it for years and still do. Around 1984 I got a copy of the EMI / Harvest UK SQ quad pressing. Thinking that this UK pressing would be an upgrade above my US pressing, I was thrilled to now have the ultimate of my ultimate favorite SQ album.

Well, the musical differences were still there on the EMI / Harvest UK LP, but the spaciousness that I have grown to love and expected was not the same on this UK Harvest pressing. Not only was the ambiance subdued compared to my US pressing, but the volume level seemed reduced compared to the US pressing.

I simply accepted that the level on the US pressing was hotter (louder), and that the EQ was different enough to account for the US being more spacious sounding. The US quad WYWH became one of my favorite LPs of all time. I would comment about this fact to anyone who would listen. Over at the other forum I stated that the US quad was "the one" for this title.

Then a year or so ago, someone commented back stating that no, the US pressing is not the best, and that it has Front and Rear channels mastered to SQ in reverse. Kind of like the Ten Year After - A Space in Time DVD. How strange that they would screw up such a high profile LP.

Ok, so if that is true, this might account for the wide ambiance I detect on only the US SQ pressings. My question then is, if SQ quad plays back in perfect stereo, and has full front and rear channels folded into 2-chan stereo when played back in stereo, what difference would it make (with reversed F & R chans) if the record is always played back in stereo?

The poster in other forum said that it simply plays back screwed up even in stereo. Oh, this screwed up sound is what I have been digging all these decades? Ok, whatever. The US SQ WYWH is a very high in demand quad LP on the used market. Is it due to being screwed up? Or is it due to being cut loud and sounding rather great?

Does anyone here on QQ have an impression of this LP good or bad? And is anyone else aware of this potential front to back reversed channel assignment?

How odd that this abnormal SQ LP would rate so favorable, at least to me and the buyers spending north of $300 for near mint copies.

 

[fredblue]

Very interesting.. Thanks for starting a neat thread!

I wonder if the U.S SQ LP was quietly withdrawn at the time, due to the alleged channel assignment error.. and that's why its so hard to come by now?

I've never heard any of the SQ versions but I do see the UK SQ LP from time to time, it's pretty low priority since the Quad in the Immersion box set is so good, though I will no doubt try and pick up at least one of the SQ pressings in the fullness of time or if I see it nice and cheap.

I have a suspicion there are more old Quads with wrongly assigned channels than has been previously documented, fwiw..

 

[kap'n krunch]

I got the US SQ version of this (I also have the Stereo US version, albeit a later repressing). I did a DVDA of this -LPCM QUAD a few years ago...and I've never compared it to the immersion box set (the ONLY one I got!)...

If you need any waveforms , let me know.

 

[fredblue]

I got the US SQ version of this (I also have the Stereo US version, albeit a later repressing). I did a DVDA of this -LPCM QUAD a few years ago...and I've never compared it to the immersion box set (the ONLY one I got!)...

If you need any waveforms , let me know.

Thank you Kap! :upthumb I might just take you up on your kind waveform offer one day

 

[quicksrt]

Very interesting.. Thanks for starting a neat thread!

I wonder if the U.S SQ LP was quietly withdrawn at the time, due to the alleged channel assignment error.. and that's why its so hard to come by now?

I've never heard any of the SQ versions but I do see the UK SQ LP from time to time, it's pretty low priority since the Quad in the Immersion box set is so good, though I will no doubt try and pick up at least one of the SQ pressings in the fullness of time or if I see it nice and cheap.

I have a suspicion there are more old Quads with wrongly assigned channels than has been previously documented, fwiw..

This one should remain somewhat in demand at least to the Floyd fanatics as there are a couple areas where there is small bits additional music on the SQ LP, and they have been trimmed off on the Immersion set. That is right, when the album finishes, it comes back with more music, like another short section of SOYCD no bs.

 

[fredblue]

This one should remain somewhat in demand at least to the Floyd fanatics as there are a couple areas where there is small bits additional music on the SQ LP, and they have been trimmed off on the Immersion set. That is right, when the album finishes, it comes back with more music, like another short section of SOYCD no bs.

Oh jeez..

and you mean the plonkers who put together the Immersion set actually cut music out of the Quad mix but they took the trouble to include coasters, scarves and marbles..!?

What a load of useless articles..!!

I guess I need that SQ LP more than ever.. no small wonder its still in high demand. Thank you for the info, much appreciated as ever :upthumb

 

[DuncanS]

This one should remain somewhat in demand at least to the Floyd fanatics as there are a couple areas where there is small bits additional music on the SQ LP, and they have been trimmed off on the Immersion set. That is right, when the album finishes, it comes back with more music, like another short section of SOYCD no bs.

I'll have to fire up my SQ LP (UK) which I bought when it was released and compare the two.

 

[Neb-Maat-Re]

The US version had a short reprise of Shine On tacked on the end for no readily apparent reason. It was just a cut and paste repeat, not any new additional music. It was not part of the original album configuration including the UK quad release.

The Immersion version is how the album should be heard.

 

[Quad Linda]

Guess I have some a/b'ing to do. I have Immersion, US Q8 and UK SQ. I also have a CD, but don't recall which one it is.

I'll have to fire up my SQ LP (UK) which I bought when it was released and compare the two.

 

[fredblue]

The US version had a short reprise of Shine On tacked on the end for no readily apparent reason. It was just a cut and paste repeat, not any new additional music. It was not part of the original album configuration including the UK quad release.

The Immersion version is how the album should be heard.

Oh! Phew! I take it all back about the Immersion set producers losing their marbles..

 

[quicksrt]

Guess I have some a/b'ing to do. I have Immersion, US Q8 and UK SQ. I also have a CD, but don't recall which one it is.

Well, I think for sound comparisons you'll need a US SQ pressing.

 

[DuncanS]

Oh! Phew! I take it all back about the Immersion set producers losing their marbles..

Would "The Wall" have a scarf by Scarfe?

 

[quicksrt]

I got the US SQ version of this (I also have the Stereo US version, albeit a later repressing). I did a DVDA of this -LPCM QUAD a few years ago...and I've never compared it to the immersion box set (the ONLY one I got!)...

If you need any waveforms , let me know.

I think we need some waveforms indeed.

 

[atrocity]

The US version had a short reprise of Shine On tacked on the end for no readily apparent reason. It was just a cut and paste repeat, not any new additional music. It was not part of the original album configuration including the UK quad release.

The Immersion version is how the album should be heard.

Yes, the extra stuff at the end of side one of the US pressing is clearly an error (and a really annoying one at that!), but that's not the only thing missing from the Immersion quad. There are also a few bars snipped from the second half of SOYCD. It's possible that they were always there in error (though that error exists on the US SQ, US 8-track and UK SQ!) but I've also read a suggestion that the edit was made simply to keep the multiple streams more or less in sync. It's really annoying to me as that extra little bit was always fun!

As for US vs. UK SQ pressings, all I know is that after getting my third consecutive CRAP UK pressing I just gave up and lived with the noise. For some reason, I've never had good luck with UK Pink Floyd vinyl. My worst is probably "Animals", which is an unusually thick record but by the end of the second side is just a pointless sea of crackling.

 

[jimfisheye]

The repeated bit on the end of side one is as though the production master tape had side 2 of the album recorded to it first, then side 1 recorded over it - but the longer side 2 program is still at the end of the reel after the side 1 program ends.

I don't know if that exact scenario is what happened but that is the effect.

Man, those original quad releases for this one...
Worst of the worst I've ever heard! Awful vinyl pressing quality that reduced the SQ encoded quad to basically mono. Q8 tapes with barely any music program behind the wall of hiss!

Still bummed that they stopped releasing the Floyd HD masters after only DSOTM & WYWH but it's really a blessing that we have the quad WYWH to listen to now on the bluray. The consumer copies are just destroyed.

I believe they edited the cough out of the beginning of WYWH title track though or so I'm told. The sniff is still there (or is that the other way around?) I never went back and studied and compared the trash copies I had of the original before throwing them all away.

At least the AHM quad Q8 was salvageable to a very high level. And of course we unearthed Pompeii unbelievably intact. WYWH was the big missing hole in the Floyd surround catalog before the bluray release IMHO.

 

[steelydave]

There are two issues raised here I think I can answer...


1. The extra/repeated music on the quad versions of the album - this was done so that the Q8 version of the album wouldn't have any silence. Let's say side A was 22 minutes and side B was 23 minutes...this would mean that at the end of side A there'd be a minute of silence before the program selector on the 8-Track deck clicked over and started playing side B. They got around this by adding some (repeated) music at the end of one of the sides to even them up. I think for Floyd, making the music fit the medium was part of the artistic challenge for them in making the music they were selling a total package of both audio, visual and packaging design. They actually went a step further on the 8-Track version of the following album, Animals, by having Snowy White record a guitar solo that linked the end of side B to the beginning of side A, allowing the album to (theoretically) play on an infinite loop without any interruption. I think it's a pretty cool idea, actually.

I assume when the US record cutting engineers got the discrete 4 channel master tape to feed the SQ encoder, they didn't realise that the extra music at the end of one side was to equalise the running times for the Q8 version and thus didn't omit it when they cut the SQ vinyl. I suppose though, by the same token it's not really within the remit of the guy doing the vinyl cutting to decide which music does and doesn't make it on to the album.


2. The 20 (or so) seconds snipped out of the quad mix of the 2nd half of SOYCD on the Immersion Blu-Ray. I'm pretty sure this was done so that the track markers would line up for all the various audio streams (stereo/quad/5.1). You can't have separate sets of track markers for each audio stream on BluRay, so you need to make your audio length conform to your track markers. The only way they could do this is to cut out the extra music from the quad mix so it would run the same length as the stereo and 5.1 mixes. Since those 20 seconds are obviously on the multitrack master tape, you'd have to assume that they were just excised from the stereo master tape via a razor-blade edit after the stereo mix was completed.

The quad mix is also a missing synth overdub on one of the songs (I can't remember which now) that isn't even on the multitrack master tape. I think there's a video on Youtube somewhere promoting the WYWH Immersion set with an interview with James Guthrie (I think?) explaining it, but basically they think the synth overdub was done after the stereo mix was complete by playing back the stereo mix whilst having Rick Wright play the synth part and recording both of those things on to another piece of stereo tape, and then splicing that piece of tape in to the master tape. When Guthrie came to do the 5.1 mix he couldn't find that overdub anywhere, so he actually got Rick in the studio to play it again in the early/mid 2000's before his untimely death, which allowed him to complete the 5.1 mix.

 

[LizardKing]

Something I was told a while back about this album, and I found it interesting.

I looked just now for a posting in the "Spotlight SQ/LPs" section of the forum and I could not find a Spotlight matrix LP thread on WYWH, how sad.

FYI - The Poll for the Q8 and SQ LP is here:
https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/showthread.php?15216-Pink-Floyd-WISH-YOU-WERE-HERE-SQ-Q8

 

[winopener]

There are two issues raised here I think I can answer...


1. The extra/repeated music on the quad versions of the album - this was done so that the Q8 version of the album wouldn't have any silence....
I assume when the US record cutting engineers got the discrete 4 channel master tape to feed the SQ encoder, they didn't realise that the extra music at the end of one side was to equalise the running times for the Q8 version and thus didn't omit it when they cut the SQ vinyl. I suppose though, by the same token it's not really within the remit of the guy doing the vinyl cutting to decide which music does and doesn't make it on to the album.

Same thing i was thinking, also because Harvest for AHM/DSOTM release sent out stampers - not tapes - to any country who was going to press the SQ LP (matrix numbers and run-out grooves does match) and USA were the only one that required quad for Q8 tape. Minding all the SQ-encoded snafu of the two previous albums, Harvest sent out a quad master already prepared with the extra music at the end of program 1 - and this time that was OK for Q8... but Columbia decided to press also LP (which Capitol didn't) so they ran the Q8 discrete master thru the SQ encoder, and possibly missed the correct channel configuration.

So... Capitol got the good quad master for SQ LP, and they did SQ-decoded Q8 only; Columbia got the good quad master for Q8, and they got the SQ version wrong. So much for quality control!