HiRez Poll Emerson Lake & Palmer - BRAIN SALAD SURGERY [DVD-A/BDA] [2014 MIX]

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Rate the DVD-A/BDA of Emerson Lake & Palmer - BRAIN SALAD SURGERY [2014 Mix]


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JonUrban

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Please post your thoughts and comments on the 2014 Release of this classic album, containing a new 5.1 remix from Jakko Jakszyk. (n):phones(y)

This release is only available on DVDA-V in the deluxe box set version of the album.

2017 ADDENDUM: The same 2014 5.1 mix is now available on Blu-Ray as part of the "Fanfare" box set.

Pictures below courtesy of Fredblue! (y)
 

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DennisMoore Jr.

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I received my box yesterday from BurningShed. Without further ado, my thoughts:

ELP - BSS is one of my top 5(perhaps top 3) recordings of all time so I consider that I am quite fortunate to have this mixed into surround twice now in high resolution 5.1.

The box was a must buy for me personally and I'm glad I bought it, but I will try to rate it objectively.

I didn't like the box set design considering the price. It feels too "paper-ish" or cardboard like. The design is bad frankly. I was expecting a die cut LP sleeve and record. Instead the whole double sided LP cover houses the 4 papers disc cases and they throw in disc 5 where the LP record is:mad:@: This is simply an amateur design and Sony should not have accepted it from the art dept.(considering the price, IMHO). And no Die Cut opening design.

About the 5.1 mix:

It is very different than my original 2000ish DVD-A. Yes, you can hear instrument tid bits and gongs that I don't recall hearing from the 1st 5.1 mix. Jakko has done a great job trying to present a really sonically deep & layered presentation. I enjoyed Jersalem & Still.. & Benny & KE9 1st imp. The mix is a bit thinner than the 2000 DVD-A but that seems to be Jakko's style. For example: He will hard pan an instrument so it sounds more directed but at the price of sonic depth.

One thing for sure. He went too far on KE9 3rd impression. The vocals are too low in the beginning and he put too much distortion on the bass guitar(briefly), I suppose to create an effect. It did not work at all for me.

But the great news is: Benny The Bouncer now has the correct vocal takes! :banana: :banana: :banana:

For sure I will also be buying the 3CD set when it comes out to better match with the wonderful paper-sleeve ELP & Tarkus I already have.

Jakko's mix has many things to like and I think I might enjoy a few tracks better than on the 2000 DVD-A. But I am so glad I have the original 5.1 mix for KE9 3rd impression.

I took off a point for the amateur art design of the box set and I took off a point for the mess on KE9 3rd...

I voted an 8.

I hope that Trilogy is a more faithful 5.1. remix. I think that Jakko was a bit too creative on Brain Salad Surgery.

For me I was going to buy the box, regardless. For many people though, I do think the more economic 3CD set is a better value.

Please see my update posted down a few frames.
 
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colsky

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For me I was going to buy the box, regardless. For many people though, I do think the more economic 3CD set is a better value.
Thanks for the review. As you will see, the 3 disc set may not now be better value, as it appears that the contents of this set have recently changed to not now include a 5.1 mix! So we might well have another bloody Aqualung/Transatlantic situation on our hands.
 

quattroatl

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Thanks for the review. As you will see, the 3 disc set may not now be better value, as it appears that the contents of this set have recently changed to not now include a 5.1 mix! So we might well have another bloody Aqualung/Transatlantic situation on our hands.
How would the 3 disc set not include the 5.1 dvda mix? It's listed as cd + dvd on amazon uk. I canceled my pre order based on your comment, and now will wait and see.
 

colsky

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How would the 3 disc set not include the 5.1 dvda mix? It's listed as cd + dvd on amazon uk. I canceled my pre order based on your comment, and now will wait and see.
Neil Wilkes posted this this morning:

"This is incorrect.
The *only* way to get the 5.1 version is in the Box Set.
The 2CD/DVD version contains 24/96 stereo (Original Mix Remastered & New Jakko Mix) only. "

on this other thread:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/showthread.php?15301-ELP-Emerson-Lake-amp-Palmer-Cataloge-in-5-1-Surround/page73
 

DennisMoore Jr.

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Thanks for the review. As you will see, the 3 disc set may not now be better value, as it appears that the contents of this set have recently changed to not now include a 5.1 mix! So we might well have another bloody Aqualung/Transatlantic situation on our hands.
Well... whatever happens with the 3CD set... You are still a cheap bastard! :yikes :cool:


Update to my initial review
============================================

@Group: Beware of the box set. The 5.1 mix gets worse each time I play it.

KarnEvil9 3rd Impression is unplayable and is an unmitigated disaster. Its almost like Jakko got the wrong bass track and its some fan playing bass along with the track. It is that bad.

Jersulam has different reverb on the vocals a few seconds after the original vocals. It sounds very unprofessional and not natural.

But Benny The Bouncer kicks ass on the original DVD-A!

You guys might be better off passing on this whole mess until Sony fixes the 5.1 mix. Trust me(or don't trust me, I don't care), this mix will go down in history as one of the most controversial and least desired. I gave it an eight in my vote because I, like most of here, bend over backwards to support multi-channel. BUT, the more I play the 5.1 mix the more I want to blow up small countries in anger. Now, I give it a 6. Maybe that is being too kind.

I highly doubt you will feel happy with the 5.1 mix after paying the high price of the box.

I guess every 5.1 mix can not be a Steven Wilson special.

It is a real possibility the 5.1 mix was withdrawn from all the other versions because it was auditioned by insiders and they concluded it was better leaving it out. I am not joking about this.

If I didn't own the first BSS DVD-A 5.1 remix, I would be near suicidal at this moment.
 
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rusinurbe

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IMachine

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Well... whatever happens with the 3CD set... You are still a cheap bastard! :yikes :cool:


@IMachine: Love ya baby, glad you are back to help keep the haters away. (y) As requested, my Top 3-5 (in no particular order).

ELP - Brain salad Surgery
Gentle Giant - Power & Glory/Free hand(they are perfect brother & sister albums...)
YES - Going For The One (I love all classic YES so I can't pick, but GFTO was the first YES LP I bought when it actually was released.)
The WHO - Quadrophenia (certainly the greatest double LP of all time!)
Pink Floyd - Dark Side Of The Moon.
I will remember ;)
 

rtbluray

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I voted a '9' for this.

Overall, I definitely prefer this 5.1 mix compared to the original 5.1 mix, and the new stereo mix is MILES better than the original stereo mix.

With all of that being said, I will now discuss my main gripe with the set, and that is the 5.1 mix of "Karn Evil 9 3rd Impression".

Like Dennis Moore Jr alluded to in his post, something is clearly not right with this mix as the bass is way too loud!! It's excruciatingly painful when the bass is in distortion mode like at the very beginning! I don't know what the hell happened, but that's not an issue in his new stereo mix. The bass is perfectly balanced with the rest of the instruments in that mix. I may message him to ask him if that was his clear intention, cause it clearly doesn't sound like it…

I would buy this set if you can afford it. The new stereo mix, alternate tracks, and (most) of the 5.1 mix makes this set worth it.

One final note: The Manticore Documentary on Disc 5 (DVD) looks like crap! I've seen a better source of it on YouTube...
 

doppelbock

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Okay, picked up my copy this morning at the post office (was not in when they tried to drop it off yesterday, signature required) and just finished the first play of the new 5.1 mix.

A few initial thoughts...final score later after another spin or two, hopefully I'll find the time to do a little marathon of both 5.1 mixes and the stereo mixes really compare all the differences.

Jerusalem is well, Jerusalem. Nice mix but not sure it's any better (or worse) than the old DVD-A mix. Toccata is an improvement though - seems to be a lot cleaner and clearer to my old ears and I heard little things with all the synths that I never noticed before. Still You Turn Me On - see Jerusalem...another no better but no worse, just a slightly different approach. Benny...nice to have the old vocal back! KE9 overall is better I think but while I like the enhanced clarity of the mix I do think the keyboards might be a tab too low in the mix much of the time, and after all that's the main focus of the music. As mentioned by others, 3rd Impression is a bit of a mess, and not just the fuzz bass but *all* the bass guitar - yeah, I can hear exactly what Greg is playing maybe for the first time ever but with the synths way back and reverberated the bass just seems even more in your face than it maybe is....it's like I'm listening to an early Stranglers album (not that that is a bad thing, in its proper place!).

Got to dig into the rest of the box and play the other bits that are new to me but I'm glad I got this one at a decent price, and once I'm used to the new mix I think I'm going to really like it. Initial score is a 7/10, most deductions for 3rd Impression and overall low mix of some keyboards. More plays might bump it up a notch.
 

rtbluray

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For whatever reason he decided to put that bass guitar in "Karn Evil 9 3rd Impression" in ALL 5 speakers at full blast… So it's not like you can just turn down some of the channels and then the problem is solved…no it's everywhere…

I sent him a Facebook message asking him about this and he has yet to respond...
 

ssully

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Okay, picked up my copy this morning at the post office (was not in when they tried to drop it off yesterday, signature required) and just finished the first play of the new 5.1 mix.

A few initial thoughts...final score later after another spin or two, hopefully I'll find the time to do a little marathon of both 5.1 mixes and the stereo mixes really compare all the differences.

Jerusalem is well, Jerusalem. Nice mix but not sure it's any better (or worse) than the old DVD-A mix. Toccata is an improvement though - seems to be a lot cleaner and clearer to my old ears and I heard little things with all the synths that I never noticed before. Still You Turn Me On - see Jerusalem...another no better but no worse, just a slightly different approach. Benny...nice to have the old vocal back! KE9 overall is better I think but while I like the enhanced clarity of the mix I do think the keyboards might be a tab too low in the mix much of the time, and after all that's the main focus of the music. As mentioned by others, 3rd Impression is a bit of a mess, and not just the fuzz bass but *all* the bass guitar - yeah, I can hear exactly what Greg is playing maybe for the first time ever but with the synths way back and reverberated the bass just seems even more in your face than it maybe is....it's like I'm listening to an early Stranglers album (not that that is a bad thing, in its proper place!).

Got to dig into the rest of the box and play the other bits that are new to me but I'm glad I got this one at a decent price, and once I'm used to the new mix I think I'm going to really like it. Initial score is a 7/10, most deductions for 3rd Impression and overall low mix of some keyboards. More plays might bump it up a notch.

If you want to hear Greg's part on the old DVD-A 5.1 mix, just turn off everything but the center channel. That's where 99% of the bass guitar is. Great help for learning the bass part. ;>
 

blue.monk

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I’ve finally waded through the whole box set and, at best, it’s a mixed bag. No, the surround mix is not bad, in fact it’s rather good at times. But other times I’m finding the overall balance lacking. Perhaps we are spoiled by Mr. Wilson’s work where all the musical pieces just seem to fit better. However, the biggest issue I have is the overwhelming bass in the 3rd Impression. I won’t go so far to use the Hoffman Forum cliché that it is ‘unlistenable’ but it sure ain’t pleasing to these ears.

I like the new stereo mix. It is clear and powerful with plenty of little sonic surprises. I find it more cohesive than the surround mix.

The bonus tracks are, for the most part, a big yawn. Almost all are either alternate mixes of the LP tracks or previously released material. If I remember correctly only the final track consists of an alternate performance - an early run through of the 3rd Impression. This is great stuff. I would have loved to hear more of these early, scaled-down versions.

The vinyl seems to be a very decent mastering of the original mix although my copy was marred by an awful lot of surface noise. It’s not a huge issue for me due to the hi-res original mix included on the DVD. We do get the fold-out poster (yea!) but not the original die-cut cover (boo!).

The booklet and overall packaging are OK but lack the wealth of information, detail and care found in other deluxe packages such as the recent McCartney and Jethro Tull issues.

The Manticore documentary is enjoyable despite it coming from a lousy source. It covers rehearsals and part of the Italian leg of the ’73 tour.

So all in all a rather disappointing set considering the price. (I see it is currently selling for $125 on the official ELP site. Good lord. I should be happy that I only paid $78 on Amazon UK.) Regardless it sure has been fun revisiting this brilliant LP, far and away my favorite of theirs.

A “7” for the surround mix.
 

d0zer

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I have to admit I like the "old" dvd-a a lot more than this one. First of all, the surround mix of KE9 3rd impression for my ears is just noise, I can't distinguish any instrument from the other, even the singing is buried in the noise pollution. The rest is sometimes good (best, when it's mixed similar to the 2000 dvd-a), but I'm really missing the "punch". And the super-duper-deluxe package in my eyes is really a letdown. So it's a 6 from me - and I'm generous. And now I'm going back to the "real" thing, being the year 2000 dvd-a.
 

kap'n krunch

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A solid 9.
The mix- Jakko has actually managed to capture the essence of the stereo mix.
Every MCH mix is the mixer's interpretation of the LP, and he took the "dark" aura the original one had and stuck with it.
Of course , we are all used to the 2000 mix.
Again, apples and oranges.
This is one of the few cases that the latter mix actually would REPRESENT faithfully the original one.
The 1st time I heard the 2000 mix I went "WHAT IS THIS????"; EQ, compression and all kinds of things that were NOT BSS, but an "over the top" version of it. I'm NOT trashing it, but it was another beast and very enjoyable, but it was NOT BSS, it was a modern mix of a 1973 LP.

Yes, the bass on the last track is WAY over the top but, in my system I can still hear the other instruments, and I think it works out great.

AND, at least he got closer to the original mix in the "we got thrills and SHOCKS" -mute all instruments for a half a second- part than the 2000 mix , which was waaaayyy off.

-1 point because of:
*Them not offering the MCH in the 3 disc set
*the SHODDY transfer/litho reproduction of Giger's eerie cover (it looks like an overblown jpg with extra saturation and less contrast)

I have a BEAUTIFUL Japanese pressing of the LP with posters and all and THAT is really the real artwork.

The thing is that this is one of those OVERPLAYED LPs I have had for a LONG time ...and MY fave is Trilogy, which looks like is never going to be released.
I'll elaborate further , but that's it in a nutshell.
 

ssully

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A solid 9.
The mix- Jakko has actually managed to capture the essence of the stereo mix.
Every MCH mix is the mixer's interpretation of the LP, and he took the "dark" aura the original one had and stuck with it.
Of course , we are all used to the 2000 mix.
Again, apples and oranges.
This is one of the few cases that the latter mix actually would REPRESENT faithfully the original one.
The 1st time I heard the 2000 mix I went "WHAT IS THIS????"; EQ, compression and all kinds of things that were NOT BSS, but an "over the top" version of it. I'm NOT trashing it, but it was another beast and very enjoyable, but it was NOT BSS, it was a modern mix of a 1973 LP.

Yes, the bass on the last track is WAY over the top but, in my system I can still hear the other instruments, and I think it works out great.

AND, at least he got closer to the original mix in the "we got thrills and SHOCKS" -mute all instruments for a half a second- part than the 2000 mix , which was waaaayyy off.
How so? The instrumental mute, with vocals solo, is there in the 2000 mix.
 
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