King Crimson DVD-A Discussion

[kap'n krunch]

...

At the end of the day Beat is a rushed too-short step-sister of Discipline; Sid Smith's excerpts remind us of this. It can also be seen as predecessor (Heartbeat, etc.) to Adrian's 1983 Twang Bar King album and tour which was great and entirely non-KC in nature. Can Beat be rescued in the new release? I certainly hope so but keeping my expectations very real in this regard.

Three Of A Perfect Pair lands somewhere between the two previous albums; I'll discuss those merits and warts another time near it's 5.1 release.

When a band records SEMINAL albums like In The Court Of The Crimson King and later Discipline, all that follows remain enjoyable for their relative merits but will surely suffer in direct comparison.

"Beat", although VERY similar to Discipline, has incredible moments that its predecessor did not even hint to: "Neurotica", "Requiem", etc. Not my favorite of the 3 albums from that lineup and I've listened to it a billion times (I had it on LP and still have a "West Germany" CD pressing), but , I'm sure I'll enjoy it in its new inception.

3OAPP is different animal, and a natural progression of the first two. The Right and Left side being a great title to differentiate the contents.... "Industry" has always been one of my faves....and man, was I floored when I saw them in that tour ant they played it AND "Dig me" back to back (well, with a little pause in between), I always liked "Man with an open heart" too...one of the best AB songs....
(I later got Abe's "Desire caught by the tail" and was immensely impressed, still on my playing list, "Laughing man" being the classic, but that's another thread!)

As for the Double Trio, I still have mixed feelings about it...can't really connect to it, but ahhhhhh, the next lineup SHAVED MY HEAD OFF!!!! I can't understand why TCOL gets so little love (like a bastard child) , to me it's a powerhouse of an album and as strong as TPTB (even stronger, since they were more intense!!!)..I'll get whatever I can get from that era, even if it's a "bastardization" of TCOL, as they have previously mentioned....

And , again, please let's keep different lineups separate...you can not compare ITCOTCK to Discipline in ANY way, it's a totally different band (remember they were going to be called "Discipline" and not King Crimson?)

 

[timbre4]

There was no direct comparison offered between Court & Discipline. Rather it was about how these albums generally enjoy a special status the other albums do not. The band was called Discipline until Fripp realized the new band had achieved that elusive status that is KC after all. To each his own.


From QQ deep space

 

[kap'n krunch]

....To each his own.
From QQ deep space

Amen, brother!!

 

[rontoon]

King Crimson Venturing Unto Joy Pt 1 NEW MUSIC!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI4LSgqOQmw

 

[timbre4]

Thank you, VERY exciting teaser!!


From QQ deep space

 

[The Rang]

Finally finished my KC DVD-A collection (basic 2 disc releases, no mega box sets).
The catalog number sequence makes sense for the most part except USA.
It's KCSP12.
It was originally released after Red (7) so why isn't it KCSP8?
And there isn't a KCSP11, can't quite figure out what that ought to be.
VROOOM maybe?

 

[François]

Or Earthbound ?! :yikes (Isn't VROOOM included with THRAK ? It is in the big box)

 

[user 1679]

And there isn't a KCSP11, can't quite figure out what that ought to be.
VROOOM maybe?

The Power to Believe I would guess, and I would hope it's still coming.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Curious ?

Did anyone on QQ purchase the King Crimson 40th Anniversay poster, which had the pics showing ALL of the upcoming Anniversary editions. ??

If you can,can you throw up a pic ?

This item was being offered early on from DGM, I'm guesstimating approximately 2009/10, perhaps.

thanks, btw

 

[rtbluray]

VROOM was released as part of the THRAK box set, but it will not be getting a CD/DVDA-V release.
I don't know what KCSP11 would be, but I bet it's not "The Power to Believe" or "The Construkction of Light". (Those will probably be KCSP14 and KCSP15)
It could be "Earthbound", but then again if it is, it certainly won't be in 5.1 surround. It might not even be a high-res release given how it was originally recorded.

 

[rtbluray]

Curious ?

Did anyone on QQ purchase the King Crimson 40th Anniversay poster, which had the pics showing ALL of the upcoming Anniversary editions. ??

If you can,can you throw up a pic ?

This item was being offered early on from DGM, I'm guesstimating approximately 2009/10, perhaps.

thanks, btw

Here it is:

 

[The Rang]

Would have liked it to be VROOOM because the tracks from that release that made their way to THRAK were apparently different recordings.
Can't afford or justify the box set.

 

[jimfisheye]

FYI, both the Thrak and Discipline box sets are less than half price if you were going to be buying all the albums and videos included anyway. Pretty sure the Red box is almost as good a deal too. USA is included in HD in the Red box now along with HD mixes of the other shows multitracked. The Vrooom EP is part of the Thrak box now as well as mentioned. It is in fact different versions and EP Vrooom is very much the better version than the album version. But the 5.1 mix of Thrak has to be heard to be believed! If this could have been released this way originally in '94 it would have been properly mind blowing. I remember liking the original release but it's about 5% of the scope of the new 5.1 mix.

If you are anywhere close to OCD about this band these box sets are priceless!

Absolutely no one else is releasing anything close to this level for both quality and quantity.

Haha, yeah don't expect to see any 5.1 mixes from Earthbound! You know that came from distorted FOH cassette recordings right?
Only ever reissued on CD so far. Which... pretty much covers the fidelity range on this one.

I'm just dying to finally hear The Construction Of Light in HD and with a Steve Wilson 5.1 mix! (Or 2nd choice, a highly Fripp supervised Jakko Jakszyk mix like Thrak.) And I really hope the Project X album comes along for the ride! I'm actually wanting that more than TCOL I think.

What else...
5.1 mixes of the four ProjeKct One shows would be just about the best thing ever too! (Did I get the K in the right spot there?)

 

[user 1679]

I don't know what KCSP11 would be, but I bet it's not "The Power to Believe" or "The Construkction of Light". (Those will probably be KCSP14 and KCSP15)

IIRC, the original plan did not call for any 40th ConstruKction of Light issue - Fripp mentioned some issues in his diary way back when and I'm sure it's buried in he thread somewhere. So given that there are 11 studio albums in the original plan of which Power to Believe is the 11th....that's why I think it's the "missing" piece. Any numbers after that are perhaps for live stuff (USA, and wasn't there some talk about the "Nightwatch" set getting the full 5.1 treatment at some point?) and any other oddball things they may dig up along the way.

Of course plans change, and Fripp has mentioned the possibility of a "ReKcontruKction of Light" using alternate sources (I guess live recordings)....so perhaps that would make it's catalog number fall outside the studio album chronological path.

 

[rtbluray]

Would have liked it to be VROOOM because the tracks from that release that made their way to THRAK were apparently different recordings.
Can't afford or justify the box set.

The box set had a CD in it called "Maximum VROOM" but other than that, there was no other "VROOM" material in the box set, including nothing on the DVDs or Blu-Rays.

 

[rtbluray]

I'm just dying to finally hear The Construction Of Light in HD and with a Steve Wilson 5.1 mix! (Or 2nd choice, a highly Fripp supervised Jakko Jakszyk mix like Thrak.) And I really hope the Project X album comes along for the ride! I'm actually wanting that more than TCOL I think.

What else...
5.1 mixes of the four ProjeKct One shows would be just about the best thing ever too! (Did I get the K in the right spot there?)

Steven Wilson's involvement in the King Crimson 40th anniversary series is completely finished, so if "The Construkction of Light" were to be remixed in stereo & 5.1 surround, it would definitely be mixed by Jakko.
As for the ProjeKct X album, since it was recorded by the same lineup as TCOL, I could see it being included in remixed form as part of a 2000-2003 box set but not as a separate release.

I'm not sure if any of the other ProjeKct material will ever make its way to 5.1 however…

 

[rtbluray]

IIRC, the original plan did not call for any 40th ConstruKction of Light issue - Fripp mentioned some issues in his diary way back when and I'm sure it's buried in he thread somewhere. So given that there are 11 studio albums in the original plan of which Power to Believe is the 11th....that's why I think it's the "missing" piece. Any numbers after that are perhaps for live stuff (USA, and wasn't there some talk about the "Nightwatch" set getting the full 5.1 treatment at some point?) and any other oddball things they may dig up along the way.

Of course plans change, and Fripp has mentioned the possibility of a "ReKcontruKction of Light" using alternate sources (I guess live recordings)....so perhaps that would make it's catalog number fall outside the studio album chronological path.

Look at the poster I just posted in this thread. There were twelve studio albums in the original plan as it was always planned for Jakko to remix "THRAK" so I don't buy your reasoning that "The Power to Believe" is KCSP11.
You are right however that Fripp originally said that "The ConstruKction of Light" was not going to be a part of the 40th anniversary series, but I'm pretty sure he changed his mind on that somewhere along the way as it's now listed amongst the 'coming soon' section of the 40th anniversary series in the 2014 King Crimson tour box.
Plus a month or so ago, Jakko mentioned on Twitter that he was mixing two albums but could not say what they were.
I think he was remixing both "The Construkction of Light" and "The Power to Believe", especially since David Singleton has already confirmed there will be another giant King Crimson box of sorts out in the Fall, which I think will cover the 2000-2003 era of the band.

In all honesty though, what I really want is an "Islands" box set (with Blu-Ray) but maybe we'll have to wait until 2018 for that to become a reality.

 

[jimfisheye]

Steven Wilson's involvement in the King Crimson 40th anniversary series is completely finished, so if "The Construkction of Light" were to be remixed in stereo & 5.1 surround, it would definitely be mixed by Jakko.
As for the ProjeKct X album, since it was recorded by the same lineup as TCOL, I could see it being included in remixed form as part of a 2000-2003 box set but not as a separate release.

I'm not sure if any of the other ProjeKct material will ever make its way to 5.1 however…

The Fripp/Jakszyk mix of Thrak is right on point. (And I'm pretty sure Fripp's name is properly listed first there. Heard any of Jakszyk's unsupervised mixes? That live Tull mix and the shockingly half started scratch mix of ELP Brain Salad Surgery come to mind. BSS is obviously messed up and they pulled it. A better example would be the awkward mix of Trilogy.)
Thrak really does have to be heard to be believed so the same treatment on TCOL would be truly wonderful!

I'm aware of Fripp's opinion of preferring live material mixed in stereo over surround.
This was talked about in the Starless box with the Amsterdam '73 show and why Steven only mixed half of that show in 5.1 (as experimental work). Personally I really like the live surround mixes. I really like the insanely dynamic live stereo mixes too! Actual proper use of 24 bit HD format. Zero to complain about there honestly. (Notice how Steven still went after at least all the improvs specifically for the 5.1 mixes? He's one of us!)

But I can still dream about the Project One shows!
That was the closest King Crimson came to being King Crimson again since 1974.
Maybe we'll at least get 24 bit releases one of these years?

 

[fizzywiggs41]

I love what Jakszyk's done with ANY live Tull . Keep em coming.

Also I quite enjoy what he's done with Trilogy surroundwise . My only bone to pick might be the title track, but that could have been the band's late bassist's decision, to make that track with a strange ,dominant, out of sync bass as opposed to the original mix/take.

 

[ssully]

Not surround-related (alas) but are there really *FOUR* different stereo mixes/masterings of USA available now? (This is the listing from the Road to Red DVD/BluRay tracklist)


LPCM Stereo (24/96)


Casino Arena, Asbury Park, NJ (2013 Mix)


Casino Arena, Asbury Park, NJ (2005 Mix)


LPCM Stereo (24/48)


USA – 30th Anniversary Remaster


LPCM Stereo (24/96)


USA – Original UK Vinyl Transfer



is the '30th anniversary remaster ' version just the '2005 mix' with a different sample rate?