Audio Fidelity Quad SACD Titles Definitely NOT Happening

[Old Quad Guy]

We may not get certain titles now, but we need to keep supporting the titles we do get. Personally, I'm thrilled by the last year of AF titles and we need to keep building momentum.

In an ideal world, everything would get released all at once. But like film restoration, these things take time by those who know what their doing. Perhaps there are tape restoration options to get the best sound out that has not been invented yet. So keep Master Tapes safe. As far as rights go, or when we can a title out, we need to be patient. Things change, and a lot has happened in the last year.

The main thing is we're buying, and getting the word out about the importance of sound recording preservation.

 

[quicksrt]

Hi Adam,

Which tapes are bad? The 1st gen multi-track or the 2nd gen Quad mix master tape(that was made).

The Stereo tapes are not good here iirc. If they can't get really good stereo tapes, AF is out. This is what happened with Wired.

 

[quicksrt]

There was an unreleased DVD-A which had test pressings done. I know, since I have one. Even if the masters and safety copies are missing, the information on this disc could be cloned for a 5.1 SACD.

View attachment 22579

One of the best Quads and one of the best DVD-A's, musically and surround mix(es).

You should email Marshall at AF if you would be willing to share your digital data. This might be the ticket!

 

[quicksrt]

Edgar Winter Group - They Only Come Out At Night

(MFSL released a Stereo SACD 10 years ago.. Can that really mean there is no hope of an AF Surround SACD now?)

Yes, because it was an SACD, it is as they say "off the table" now. There is an SACD or DSD crowd (stereo) that buys everything in the format. Once they buy it in DSD, they do not buy it again in DSD. Had it been a gold CD only, then things would be different.

 

[quicksrt]

Bob Dylan - Desire
Bob Dylan - Planet Waves
Bob Dylan - Nashville Skyline
(MFSL QUADBLOCK)

May as well be complete Fred. I edited your post

 

[skherbeck]

There was an unreleased DVD-A which had test pressings done. I know, since I have one. Even if the masters and safety copies are missing, the information on this disc could be cloned for a 5.1 SACD.

View attachment 22579

One of the best Quads and one of the best DVD-A's, musically and surround mix(es).

Regarding unreleased DVD-As with quad mixes, does anyone know if this occurred with The Eagles "Desperado"?

 

[The Rang]

Multiple Guess Who & Jefferson Airplane & Starship & Hot Tuna titles quadblocked by Iconoclassic.

Definitely see the logic in this statement however Iconoclassic and AF released the Jeff Beck Group, on CD and hybrid MC SACD respectively, virtually simultaneously so you never know

 

[quicksrt]

Definitely see the logic in this statement however Iconoclassic and AF released the Jeff Beck Group, on CD and hybrid MC SACD respectively, virtually simultaneously so you never know

It's the SACD format issue which creates a permanent block, not CD reissues concerning AF product.

So these titles are not off limits, but simply lower on the priority list.

 

[Larry Geller]

OK then, let's see a quad Rough & Ready SACD.

 

[quicksrt]

Regarding unreleased DVD-As with quad mixes, does anyone know if this occurred with The Eagles "Desperado"?

The Eagles are off limits for AF. Band and management do not approve.

 

[Q-Eight]

The Eagles are off limits for AF. Band and management do not approve.

Nice to have this finally settled with a definitive answer. Still, what the hell is wrong with them? They've been so surround-friendly in the past. They must not be able to get their usual dump-truck full of money out of AF. I suddenly don't like the Eagles anymore.

I bet it's probably something stupid like they don't want Bernie Leadon, Randy Meisner or Don Felder receiving any royalty money from the release of old albums.

Regarding unreleased DVD-As with quad mixes, does anyone know if this occurred with The Eagles "Desperado"?

Their self-titled '72 debut and Desperado were advertised as being available in a 1975 Schwann's tape catalog but, as we all know, these two titles were never produced. I'd never heard of the possibility of a DVD-A of Desperado, but there was an awful lot of speculation about their entire catalog being remixed to 5.1 by Elliot Scheiner. But that too, has not come to fruition.

 

[quicksrt]

My three or four disappointments - titles that we won't see from this series - are not coming, but for each it's getting artist's or management approval. Things could change you never know.

Two of them came out on QR format - thank god for those.

Jackson Browne - Late for the Sky
Joni Mitchell - Court and Spark
Black Sabbath - Paranoid
ZZ Top - Tres Hombres

 

[Q-Eight]

My three or four disappointments - titles that we won't see from this series:

Jackson Browne - Late for the Sky
Joni Mitchell - Court and Spark
Black Sabbath - Paranoid
ZZ Top - Tres Hombres

That is VERY disappointing, though I can understand Sabbath as that one was recently attempted (poorly). As much as I hate to admit it, the ZZTop title is wonky with cross-channel drums. Jackson Browne and Joni Mitchell are really upsetting as not only are those both great mixes, but GREAT albums too.

That is an absolute shame. Guess those "artists" really don't care about their fans.

 

[quicksrt]

That is VERY disappointing, though I can understand Sabbath as that one was recently attempted (poorly). As much as I hate to admit it, the ZZTop title is wonky with cross-channel drums. Jackson Browne and Joni Mitchell are really upsetting as not only are those both great mixes, but GREAT albums too.

That is an absolute shame. Guess those "artists" really don't care about their fans.

It's for different reasons for each of these albums. It's not as simple as it seems.

But yeah it's a bummer. I actually like the ZZ Top mix fine enough, a good reel to reel of that title is almost good enough to master an SACD off of, at least once one fixes the channel assignment problem.

 

[steelydave]

It's for different reasons for each of these albums. It's not as simple as it seems.

But yeah it's a bummer. I actually like the ZZ Top mix fine enough, a good reel to reel of that title is almost good enough to master an SACD off of, at least once one fixes the channel assignment problem.

You can't fix the problems with the ZZ Top mix because they're not a channel assignment error, they're a mixing error. If you swap the channels so the drums are fixed, the guitars become diagonally panned as a result. The quad mix of Larry Coryell & The Eleventh House's 'Introducing' album has the same problem unfortunately.

 

[quicksrt]

You can't fix the problems with the ZZ Top mix because they're not a channel assignment error, they're a mixing error. If you swap the channels so the drums are fixed, the guitars become diagonally panned as a result. The quad mix of Larry Coryell & The Eleventh House's 'Introducing' album has the same problem unfortunately.

Thanks for your further clarification on the ZZ mix. I'm actually ok with the instrumental layout once the drums are set right. Guitars can come out of any area that they will and I'm ok with it. Drums on the other hand must be set up and anchor it from F or R, but not one of each.

 

[steelydave]

I agree with you generally speaking, but on this release the guitars are spread so that before channel remapping one guitar is in front left and rear left (so stereo imaging across the left side) and the other is in front right and rear right (stereo imaging across the right). So if you swap the rear channels to fix the drums (ie so the drum mix in the front speakers is identical to the drum mix in the rear speakers) the guitars are now panned diagonally across the soundfield (one guitar is in FL and RR and the other is in FR and RL) which makes even less sense sonically than the way they (incorrectly) mixed the album initially.

 

[Fourplay]

MFSL also released BS&T, but that still got out.....while it seems past reissues works against things, it doesn't rule things out completely. I don't really like the concept of this thread, I don't consider anything off the table. Licenses change, policies change, time passes making reissues more desirable, tapes are found, safety copies turn up.....I give up on nothing.

I totally agree that we should not give up on any title if there is a chance of seeing an official release. The intent of this thread is more to identify the difficulties encountered with a given title. The good news is that thanks to many fans like yourself, good conversions are made of many or most quad titles in existence. I am so grateful to you and them all for those efforts. That said, getting professional transfers from the discrete master reels is obviously the ideal, as the AF series is demonstrating so well.

Please don't take this thread as a discouragement, but rather as a summary of known obstacles between us and official quad goodness. Perhaps by identifying the obstacles it will become more clear as to how they can be overcome. I will start work on the 1st summary.

 

[Fourplay]

Post 1 updated:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...-NOT-Happening&p=267517&viewfull=1#post267517

 

[fredblue]

Hi Adam,

Which tapes are bad? The 1st gen multi-track or the 2nd gen Quad mix master tape(that was made).

Fook knows! Its just what was said by bmoura in some thread here that the tapes weren't in good enough nick, no idea which ones or anything else you'd have to ask them