Joe Walsh So What

[fizzywiggs41]

Decades ago , maybe in the late 70's. Someone on 4 QUAD , or MCS REVIEW
Swore they saw the Joe Walsh quad album of So What in a quad record bin.

Anyway , you would think by now that if that were true we would have a post of that actual album by now.

Nevertheless I thought I'd post this pic from Billboard of the last ABC COMMAND QS albums to be released or already released.

Anyways , I thought I might spur some thoughts amongst the members of this forum , regarding the above mystery missing album.

 

[4-earredwonder]

View attachment 88586


Decades ago , maybe in the late 70's. Someone on 4 QUAD , or MCS REVIEW
Swore they saw the Joe Walsh quad album of So What in a quad record bin.

Anyway , you would think by now that if that were true we would have a post of that actual album by now.

Nevertheless I thought I'd post this pic from Billboard of the last ABC COMMAND QS albums to be released or already released.

Anyways , I thought I might spur some thoughts amongst the members of this forum , regarding the above mystery missing album.

According to The Quadraphonic Discography this was the ONLY Joe Walsh QS album 'officially' released

JOE WALSH -
The Smoker You Drink, the Player You Get. Command CQD-40016
(QS), Dunhill 7023-50140H (Q8), ABC CTQ-40016 (Q8) [Canada]
The Smoker You Drink, the Player You Get. Command PRO-40016, LLP QD-256
(QSEP)
{Includes-Rocky Mountain Way, Happy Ways, Meadows, Midnight Moodies}

 

[JonUrban]

"So What", "Mack & Mabel", and "3 Dog Night Hits" were the 3 Command QS LPs that were announced in multiple places, Billboard, etc, during the end of the quad era that never appeared. Whether they were readied or not, we'll probably never know.

The Joe Walsh album got the most press exposure, and portions of the title track were included on the Perspectives QS LP from Koss to show off their new Phase 2+2 Quad headphones. That's the only place I know that you can hear that song in real QS. Anything else you find on the web is suspect, no matter what some internet matrix experts may claim.

 

[J. PUPSTER]

I have that Koss Perspectives LP (with the song 'Falling Down' on it) that I decoded with the Involve Surround Master v2.
The decode of that song never sounded that great from a mix perspective IMO. I was going to say, something akin to a poor Baker Bigsby/Ed Michel mix, and then realized -oh right-o

https://www.discogs.com/release/575...e-New-Sound-Of-Koss-A-Psycho-acoustic-Odyssey

 

[furui_suterioo]

After hearing OD's decode I'm convinced there is a real QS quad of So What. Recorded a Q8 with both OD decode of So What and an Involve decode of songs from Smoker from my LP, came out great. Chucky and OD on the same tape!

 

[J. PUPSTER]

I have that Koss Perspectives LP (with the song 'Falling Down' on it) that I decoded with the Involve Surround Master v2.
The decode of that song never sounded that great from a mix perspective IMO. I was going to say, something akin to a poor Baker Bigsby/Ed Michel mix, and then realized -oh right-o

https://www.discogs.com/release/575...e-New-Sound-Of-Koss-A-Psycho-acoustic-Odyssey
View attachment 88589

To follow up some on this, if you look carefully at the insert pic for ‘Falling Down’ it states it’s from the Dunhill – DSD-50171 album which were all stereo IINM; just a reference but no evidence of a separate Quad album (Command Quadraphonic.) Also IIRC, there’s a section of the song ending left off of this version.

Personally I agree with Jon in his last sentence

What really got my juices flowing from this one was a possibility of a Quad in the can for the whole ‘Southern Comfort’ album. But again, not a great mix from my recollection. I need some Southern Comfort right about now

 

[par4ken]

I am quite certain that "so What" was done but just never made final release. Too many bad executive decisions being made at the time likely that someone pulled the plug at the last minute! I believe that OD has a QS copy from an unnamed source. No matter what you think of him I don't believe that he would lie and pass off an upmix as a decode!

 

[Mark Anderson]

The mix on the Koss LP is completely different than the stereo LP. The mix on OD's conversion matches the stereo LP exactly.

 

[par4ken]

I have never directly compared the two but I just don't believe that OD would "release" an upmix!

The mix on the Koss LP is completely different than the stereo LP. The mix on OD's conversion matches the stereo LP exactly.

The fact that the Koss version differs from the stereo is proof positive that the QS (at least in part) was done. Those QS tapes must exist, unless all copies were destroyed in the fire, along with the masters. It is also possible that the Koss version was done separately maybe tweaked for headphone use. Multiple encodes could have been done, perhaps someone wasn't totally happy with them and blocked release? Sad that we just have to speculate!

I suggested long ago that OD include the "undecoded" versions along with his decodes. Sadly he rejected that idea.

 

[Colin London]

That Former USA Firm only put it out Stereo
SACD - I was so angry
it was not Multi Channel.

I hope Joe Walsh in Muiti Channel SACD 1975 comes out in UK or Japan.

 

[steelydave]

Sadly, I think all the ABC quad masters were destroyed in the UMG vault fire. Audio Fidelity tried to find the quad mix of So What when they put out (what ended up being) their stereo-only SACD of the title. It's possible that safety copies of some of the other ABC quad mixes exist elsewhere, ie for Q8 releases internationally (Canada, UK, Japan, etc.) but for unreleased mixes like So What I think the only copies were the ones in the now-incinerated US vault.

The mix for the one track on the Koss Perspectives sampler is credited to John Stronach, who also did the excellent quad mixes of Donald Byrd's Street Lady and Sly and the Family Stone's Small Talk. Given how good (and discrete) those mixes are, the fact that the one track on the Koss sampler ('Falling Down') decodes somewhat poorly makes me wonder if they shelved the quad mix of So What in favour of The Smoker You Drink, the Player You Get which despite being kind of a mess compared to the stereo version (omitting or burying key parts) gives you a pretty whizz-bang result through a QS decoder.

It's also possible that (presumably being done by Stronach at the Record Plant and not at ABC's in-house studios under their supervision) that the other tracks on the discrete quad mix either broke some kind of QS matrix encoding rules, or exposed some limitation of the encoding process rendering the album unsuitable for matrix quad release - something they probably wouldn't have noticed until months after the mix was done and too late for them to go back and do it again, if that was the case. It just seems weird to me that ABC would be averse to putting out two Joe Walsh albums in quad in less than a year when they did exactly that with Three Dog Night (Hard Labor, Comin' Down Your Way) and Rufus (Rufusized, Rags to Rufus) right around the same time.

Like Jon and Mark, I concur that whatever circulates as a supposed matrix decode of the unreleased mix of So What isn't what it purports to be - if it was, the mix would match the Koss Perspectives version of Falling Down and not the stereo version.

 

[jaybird100]

Sadly, I think all the ABC quad masters were destroyed in the UMG vault fire. Audio Fidelity tried to find the quad mix of So What when they put out (what ended up being) their stereo-only SACD of the title. It's possible that safety copies of some of the other ABC quad mixes exist elsewhere, ie for Q8 releases internationally (Canada, UK, Japan, etc.) but for unreleased mixes like So What I think the only copies were the ones in the now-incinerated US vault.

The mix for the one track on the Koss Perspectives sampler is credited to John Stronach, who also did the excellent quad mixes of Donald Byrd's Street Lady and Sly and the Family Stone's Small Talk. Given how good (and discrete) those mixes are, the fact that the one track on the Koss sampler ('Falling Down') decodes somewhat poorly makes me wonder if they shelved the quad mix of So What in favour of The Smoker You Drink, the Player You Get which despite being kind of a mess compared to the stereo version (omitting or burying key parts) gives you a pretty whizz-bang result through a QS decoder.

It's also possible that (presumably being done by Stronach at the Record Plant and not at ABC's in-house studios under their supervision) that the other tracks on the discrete quad mix either broke some kind of QS matrix encoding rules, or exposed some limitation of the encoding process rendering the album unsuitable for matrix quad release - something they probably wouldn't have noticed until months after the mix was done and too late for them to go back and do it again, if that was the case. It just seems weird to me that ABC would be averse to putting out two Joe Walsh albums in quad in less than a year when they did exactly that with Three Dog Night (Hard Labor, Comin' Down Your Way) and Rufus (Rufusized, Rags to Rufus) right around the same time.

Like Jon and Mark, I concur that whatever circulates as a supposed matrix decode of the unreleased mix of So What isn't what it purports to be - if it was, the mix would match the Koss Perspectives version of Falling Down and not the stereo version.

I was supposed to get a copy of this album for free, after buying a set of the Koss K2+2 headphones. I sent in the coupon, but never got the record. I was glad to find it on Discogs. I remember reading that all tracks on this LP were QS-encoded, some of which were done especially for this record.

 

[gvl_guy]

Sadly, I think all the ABC quad masters were destroyed in the UMG vault fire. Audio Fidelity tried to find the quad mix of So What when they put out (what ended up being) their stereo-only SACD of the title. It's possible that safety copies of some of the other ABC quad mixes exist elsewhere, ie for Q8 releases internationally (Canada, UK, Japan, etc.) but for unreleased mixes like So What I think the only copies were the ones in the now-incinerated US vault.

The mix for the one track on the Koss Perspectives sampler is credited to John Stronach, who also did the excellent quad mixes of Donald Byrd's Street Lady and Sly and the Family Stone's Small Talk. Given how good (and discrete) those mixes are, the fact that the one track on the Koss sampler ('Falling Down') decodes somewhat poorly makes me wonder if they shelved the quad mix of So What in favour of The Smoker You Drink, the Player You Get which despite being kind of a mess compared to the stereo version (omitting or burying key parts) gives you a pretty whizz-bang result through a QS decoder.

It's also possible that (presumably being done by Stronach at the Record Plant and not at ABC's in-house studios under their supervision) that the other tracks on the discrete quad mix either broke some kind of QS matrix encoding rules, or exposed some limitation of the encoding process rendering the album unsuitable for matrix quad release - something they probably wouldn't have noticed until months after the mix was done and too late for them to go back and do it again, if that was the case. It just seems weird to me that ABC would be averse to putting out two Joe Walsh albums in quad in less than a year when they did exactly that with Three Dog Night (Hard Labor, Comin' Down Your Way) and Rufus (Rufusized, Rags to Rufus) right around the same time.

Like Jon and Mark, I concur that whatever circulates as a supposed matrix decode of the unreleased mix of So What isn't what it purports to be - if it was, the mix would match the Koss Perspectives version of Falling Down and not the stereo version.

Oh no! I guess that means no quad early Steely Dan!! .

 

[fizzywiggs41]

To follow up some on this, if you look carefully at the insert pic for ‘Falling Down’ it states it’s from the Dunhill – DSD-50171 album which were all stereo IINM; just a reference but no evidence of a separate Quad album (Command Quadraphonic.) Also IIRC, there’s a section of the song ending left off of this version.

BB KING had albums in QS on ABC/Dunhill,

Here's one.

And I think L.A. Midnight as well.

 

[par4ken]

BB KING had albums in QS on ABC/Dunhill,

Here's one.

View attachment 88638View attachment 88639View attachment 88640


And I think L.A. Midnight as well.

I used to scan every new release that I purchased in the early seventies for notation such as that. I had expected that all new releases would be coming out in quad. Sadly very few (almost none) were. Despite that statement on the cover has it been verified to actually be quad?

 

[fizzywiggs41]

And here's more controversy.

This from Jan 1976 , a British audio publication .

When I read it I said ..Oh Ya sure , why not...but very sarcastically (or cynical).


(But of course many albums work with a Hafler synth)

 

[4-earredwonder]

BB KING had albums in QS on ABC/Dunhill,

Here's one.

View attachment 88638View attachment 88639View attachment 88640


And I think L.A. Midnight as well.

Unusual for RCA to press this disc in QS since RCA was strictly CD~4 discrete...unless it was only in Canada!

 

[fizzywiggs41]

I used to scan every new release that I purchased in the early seventies for notation such as that. I had expected that all new releases would be coming out in quad. Sadly very few (almost none) were. Despite that statement on the cover has it been verified to actually be quad?

Yes it is , and I think there is a Q8 for comparison . Note : that's a Canadian copy as to it's association with RCA.


Yes I too checked out the back of many disc's upon their release.
That's how I found Synergy ELECTRONIC REALIZATIONS, and Fire ballet were QS , and the big surprise was the Matrix H Quad from David Bedford...ie now WTF is that ?
(Oh yes and many Impulse titles as well as, Paul Anka )

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Unusual for RCA to press this disc in QS since RCA was strictly CD~4 discrete...unless it was only in Canada!

Bingo !
Q8 on ABC COMMAND as well were distributed by ....RCA.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Bingo !
Q8 on ABC COMMAND as well were distributed by ....RCA.

Oh and RCA Canada also pressed records in SQ , on the CTI/KUDU label.

Now how's that for a format war .