Chicago Transit Authority 50th Anniversary Remix - A Review

[4-earredwonder]

Someone posted this on "The Forum Which Shall Not Be Named":

"News release from Tim Jessup about the new CTA 50th Anniversary issue.

Breaking: confirmed - CTA has experienced manufacturing “issues” and the CD will be re-pressed. The label will be making an official announcement and will offer to exchange CDs for those who want to. The band has also stepped up to see that, not only does the CD reflect the master, but CTA will also be Mastered for iTunes for excellent streaming. As a “make good” to their fans, the band has also ordered a high definition MQA version of the re-mix. Those who have MQA decoders or the software app to decode, will be able to listen to CTA at 192 kHz/24 Bit, the sample rate it was transferred and mixed at. For many, the current CD is a great listen, but it does not sound like the masters the band had approved, which have far more definition and depth, particularly in the high and low frequency range. Many people have been wondering what happened, as the current disc sounds very midrange heavy. I assure you, the master does not sound like this. Chicago is doing everything in our power to correct this problem, and the label is working with us to make good and ensure that everyone is hearing the re-mix as we are hearing it. To all of Terry’s fans, and Chicago fans everywhere, we’ve got your back on this. Stay tuned. I’ll be posting announcements as the record label issues them, including how to exchange your CD if you wish."

So it just gets weirder.

I did fool with the Blu-ray Quadio mix a bit. I took the left rear channel on both Introduction and Questions 67 and 68 and duplicated it at a lower level in the center channel as I wanted the horns to sound a bit bigger in the room.

For consistency sake in light of the wondrous Chicago QUADIO boxset, I don't know why Rhino/Jessup/Chicago would release a 24/192 remaster on RBCD in the first place as the default medium and NOT even offer a Stereo BD~A of both this and Steve Wilson's Chicago II remix which would've done full justice to BOTH remixes.

IMO, even though I'm not equipped for ATMOS, it seems releasing both of these remasters in DOLBY ATMOS would've made MORE sense.

 

[jefe1]

Go read the reviews for this on Amazon they are uniformly bad. You would think instead of insuiting the consumers the engineer might first want to look into a possible msnufacturing error first like that's never happened before. I now know his name and it's not for a good reason.

 

[hwkn]

Could it be[not having listened to this abomination]that what you're hearing on this remix is what Tim Jessup and the members of Chicago are actually hearing after many years of listening to their music at extremely loud volume levels without hearing protection.[just a thought].....and that's why it sounds so good to them.[and so bad to everyone else]

 

[4-earredwonder]

Could it be[not having listened to this abomination]that what you're hearing on this remix is what Tim Jessup and the members of Chicago are actually hearing after many years of listening to their music at extremely loud volume levels without hearing protection.[just a thought].....and that's why it sounds so good to them.[and so bad to everyone else]

I'm afraid the same could be said for the rather abominable Led Zep remasters Jimmy Page has foisted upon us .... insisting on being at the helm when I'm 99% sure his hearing is for sh*t at this late stage of his life. Control is wonderful but at some point those who have perfect hearing and are well versed in remixing should be involved. Imagine viewing a fuzzy out of focus movie for 90 minutes because the Director of Photography is partially blind .........

I've posted this a few times previously .... but in an interview even Steve Wilson has admitted his hearing ain't what it used to be ..... and not surprising since performing live on stage for many years will do that to you .... especially if you've never worn protective ear plugs.

 

[mrcond]

I'm afraid the same could be said for the rather abominable Led Zep remasters Jimmy Page has foisted upon us

Have to disagree with you on that one. The latest Zep remasters sound great to me (and to many others according to that other forum), though admittedly not to everyone. But to compare the vehement opposition on this Chicago release to the Zeppelin remasters is not really a fair comparison, IMHO.

 

[ar surround]

Have to disagree with you on that one. The latest Zep remasters sound great to me (and to many others according to that other forum), though admittedly not to everyone. But to compare the vehement opposition on this Chicago release to the Zeppelin remasters is not really a fair comparison, IMHO.

What are the latest Zep remasters to which you are referring? I would be willing to give some of them a try.

Once I heard the fan-based made-from-stems 5.1 of Whole Lotta Love I understood the excellent fidelity of those Led Zep multi-tracks. It makes what I have on that boxed set (September 1990) sound ragged. I don't know if any kind of remastering of the stereo masters could get anywhere near the fidelity of the multi-tracks. It would probably take a complete remixing of the albums to get there. (Imagine the response on this QQ site if those Led Zep albums were released in 5.1?)

 

[mrcond]

What are the latest Zep remasters to which you are referring? I would be willing to give some of them a try.

Once I heard the fan-based made-from-stems 5.1 of Whole Lotta Love I understood the excellent fidelity of those Led Zep multi-tracks. It makes what I have on that boxed set (September 1990) sound ragged. I don't know if any kind of remastering of the stereo masters could get anywhere near the fidelity of the multi-tracks. It would probably take a complete remixing of the albums to get there. (Imagine the response on this QQ site if those Led Zep albums were released in 5.1?)

The entire Zep catalog has been remastered by John Davis, supervised by Jimmy Page, starting with the studio albums in 2014-2016 I believe, which included bonus tracks, hi-Rez, etc., and then they remastered the 2 live albums, which included 5.1 on Blu-ray audio, and the BBC set that added bonus tracks too. These are my current go-to versions of the catalog and are currently widely available (Amazon, etc.).

I also have that 1990 box set, and most people prefer this new remastering over that one, although many prefer the original 1980s CDs mastered (mostly) by Barry

I agree that if a campaign was announced to remix the studio catalog in surround, minds would be blown (Steven Wilson once told Mike Mettler, I recall, that he would be up to the task), but alas, I don’t ever see it happening. Page has hinted at being open to it but never seems to be willing to take the next step.

 

[sjcorne]

(Steven Wilson once told Mike Mettler, I recall, that he would be up to the task)

Yep - just found that article. Can you even imagine?

Wilson: ...And I was a bit disappointed I wasn’t involved in the Led Zeppelin reissues last year.

Mettler: Oh yeah. Jimmy Page seemed to be open to the concept some years ago, when he and [producer] Kevin Shirley did the 5.1 DVD-A mix for How the West Was Won (2003), but I guess it just fell off the map after that — and that’s a shame.

Wilson: Yeah, I think that’s a shame, because that’s another one that could be a game-changer. People would have gone out of their way to buy a surround sound system just to hear “Stairway to Heaven” [from 1971’s Led Zeppelin IV] or “Achilles Last Stand” [from 1976’s Presence] or “Kashmir” [from 1975’s Physical Graffiti] in surround. Those kind of records are the ones that are the Holy Grails, really, for surround, as well as things like So (1986), by Peter Gabriel.

 

[The56Kid]

Yep - just found that article. Can you even imagine?

Holy shit, Jonathan! Thanks for sharing. Never knew that was even a possibility!!!

 

[ar surround]

It's remarkable that one stray comment on Led Zep can change the whole subject of a thread. Isn't this about CTA 50th?

Anyway, I stopped procrastinating and ordered the Steven Wilson remix of Chicago II. I'm saturated with releases of that album...stereo, quad, 5.1, 5.1 folded down into stereo, but I'm really interested in what Wilson came up with for his stereo remix of this title.

 

[JediJoker]

Anyway, I stopped procrastinating and ordered the Steven Wilson remix of Chicago II. I'm saturated with releases of that album...stereo, quad, 5.1, 5.1 folded down into stereo, but I'm really interested in what Wilson came up with for his stereo remix of this title.

True to form for SW, it sounds just like the original stereo mix, but better.

 

[sjcorne]

True to form for SW, it sounds just like the original stereo mix, but better.

I’ve often wondered if he did a 5.1 mix at the same time that was shelved for some reason (maybe to avoid competition with the Quadio set?).

 

[The56Kid]

It's remarkable that one stray comment on Led Zep can change the whole subject of a thread. Isn't this about CTA 50th?

Anyway, I stopped procrastinating and ordered the Steven Wilson remix of Chicago II. I'm saturated with releases of that album...stereo, quad, 5.1, 5.1 folded down into stereo, but I'm really interested in what Wilson came up with for his stereo remix of this title.

When Jonathan speaks, people listen!

 

[JediJoker]

I’ve often wondered if he did a 5.1 mix at the same time that was shelved for some reason (maybe to avoid competition with the Quadio set?).

He's on record stating that he did not mix it in surround, and given his busy schedule, I can believe it.

 

[ar surround]

When Jonathan speaks, people listen!

Actually, it was @4-earredwonder Ralph that first stirred up the pot. See post #21. He likes to do that.

But yes, it is true that Jonathan speaks, people listen!!!

 

[humprof]

I’ve often wondered if he did a 5.1 mix at the same time that was shelved for some reason (maybe to avoid competition with the Quadio set?).

Like @JediJoker, I too think I remember seeing an interview or a promo video with him when it came out, where he said that his remit was to do stereo, period. Of course that doesn't mean he might not have done a little something extra for himself, on the sly.

B/t/w, Jonathan: could you fix or repost the link to the interview you found? It's not working for me...

Finally: I'm not a Zep fan--heresy, I know--but the tantalizing thing for me in what you quoted is SW's interest in doing Peter Gabriel's So...

 

[sjcorne]

Could you fix or repost the link to the interview you found? It's not working for me...

I'm not a Zep fan--heresy, I know--but the tantalizing thing for me in what you quoted is SW's interest in doing Peter Gabriel's So...

Should be fixed

 

[J. PUPSTER]

All I know is, I'm happy with the CTA mix in the Quadio set.

 

[humprof]

...the tantalizing thing for me in what you quoted is SW's interest in doing Peter Gabriel's So...

And (now that I've read the full interview): Talk Talk's Colour of Spring. What is it with these guys who don't want their precious work meddled with by outsiders, reimagined for 5.1, etc.? I'm actually not that big on Talk Talk, but I'll bet a good Steven Wilson mix could raise my opinion of them significantly.

A lot of times, it’s the artists. They find out the label has commissioned a 5.1 mix, and because it’s been done without their approval, they take a stand on principle, without actually having heard it. I know that’s the case with some other mixes I’ve done that we won’t name. For one of them, a certain artist found out it had been done and he hadn’t been asked about it, and he basically said, “I’m not allowing that out.” He didn’t hear it, but I would be the same — if I found out someone I’d never heard of had done a surround mix of one of my albums, I’d say, “No, I’m not allowing that out.” So, I totally understand it.

Wilson is being too generous. For the love of god, you obstructionist prima donnas: Google Steven Wilson! Email him! Get your people to send you examples of some of his work!

Finally: Kate Bush. (I know her cold shoulder to EW has come up on other threads.) And Brian Eno: Holy Cats...YES, PLEASE! Mr. Eno--what are you waiting for?!?

 

[4-earredwonder]

And (now that I've read the full interview): Talk Talk's Colour of Spring. What is it with these guys who don't want their precious work meddled with by outsiders, reimagined for 5.1, etc.? I'm actually not that big on Talk Talk, but I'll bet a good Steven Wilson mix could raise my opinion of them significantly.



Wilson is being too generous. For the love of god, you obstructionist prima donnas: Google Steven Wilson! Email him! Get your people to send you examples of some of his work!

Finally: Kate Bush. (I know her cold shoulder to EW has come up on other threads.) And Brian Eno: Holy Cats...YES, PLEASE! Mr. Eno--what are you waiting for?!?

Yes....WHY all these hold outs? I was shocked when Chicago after their well received and magnifico QUADIO box set even saw fit to revisit Chicago II and CTA and even more perplexed they DID NOT Commission NEW 5.1 or Dolby Atmos remixes.....and even more chagrined that they only saw fit to release them on physical disc on RBCD and VINYL. I would've sprung for the SW remix of II if it was offered as a stand alone BD~A in STEREO.

I'll be interested in hearing ar surround's review of Chicago II when he receives it.