Dutton Vocalion April 2018 Surround Sound SACDs (Guess Who, Rick Derringer & The Hues Corporation)

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Better than the Q8? Really?

for my money, the Q8 in its' own right is fine.

pit the Q8 up against the SACD and the tape sounds poor by comparison.

the SQ is bright without the separation and the Q8 is dull with separation.

the SACD is warm sounding with full rich bass and has all the separation of the Q8.

the SACD has a more relaxed more natural treble than the SQ mastering and the SACD has more detail than the Q8 with much less hiss/noise.

also, not something that should be overlooked, the SACD has none of the speed stability issues of the Q8.

i should qualify, that is when the Q8 is played back on a consumer Q8 deck. most people (myself included) don't have a modified Fostex or other such reel to reel machine to play their Q8 tapes through and use a regular Q8 player. wow and flutter (etc) inherent in the 8-track cartridge format when played under those circumstances are in evidence, the Q8 of this Quad is no different in that regard, its an 8-track.

i could go on and on in this vein but i hope what i have said, qualified by having compared both a Q8 transfer and decoded SQ needledrop to the SACD, should leave you in no doubt that, yes, the SACD is, to me, better than the SQ and Q8, really and truly it is.
 
for my money, the Q8 in its' own right is fine.

pit the Q8 up against the SACD and the tape sounds poor by comparison.

the SQ is bright without the separation and the Q8 is dull with separation.

the SACD is warm sounding with full rich bass and has all the separation of the Q8.

the SACD has a more relaxed more natural treble than the SQ mastering and the SACD has more detail than the Q8 with much less hiss/noise.

also, not something that should be overlooked, the SACD has none of the speed stability issues of the Q8.

i should qualify, that is when the Q8 is played back on a consumer Q8 deck. most people (myself included) don't have a modified Fostex or other such reel to reel machine to play their Q8 tapes through and use a regular Q8 player. wow and flutter (etc) inherent in the 8-track cartridge format when played under those circumstances are in evidence, the Q8 of this Quad is no different in that regard, its an 8-track.

i could go on and on in this vein but i hope what i have said, qualified by having compared both a Q8 transfer and decoded SQ needledrop to the SACD, should leave you in no doubt that, yes, the SACD is, to me, better than the SQ and Q8, really and truly it is.
Shows how lucky we are to get these SACDs. Let's hope DV can continue this for a long time.
 
There is a moderator here that has posted a comment about a AF SACD stating that it's "an improvement over the Q8!" I about blew my coffee all over my keyboard and monitor when I read that so-called "review" of the new product.

I kept quiet and didn't say anything but I kept it in mind that if I ever heard that one again I was going to just agree, agree with "yeah right" or "no kidding really".

So, really, you don't say!!!!
:p
 
I was being facetious

Saying an SACD is (sounds) better than the Q8 is like saying a Mercedes is a nicer ride than a Ford Pinto.

And we keep telling the labels that we want to by the Mercedes but they won't sell us one. So the Pinto is often the only game in town. :mad::mad::mad: Yet most Q8's are a more enjoyable listen than the 2-channel CD versions...even the Q8's that suffer from a tad of flutter and other maladies of the system.
 
There is a moderator here that has posted a comment about a AF SACD stating that it's "an improvement over the Q8!" I about blew my coffee all over my keyboard and monitor when I read that so-called "review" of the new product.

I kept quiet and didn't say anything but I kept it in mind that if I ever heard that one again I was going to just agree, agree with "yeah right" or "no kidding really".

So, really, you don't say!!!!
:p

i don't know the instance with the moderator you're referring to but i don't find it blindingly obvious or a foregone conclusion (or even remotely funny) that every new release of a Quad on a modern format would be a no-brainer dead cert 100% guaranteed improvement on a Quad tape or Quad LP.

there are a number of examples of Quad releases on modern formats where sources other than the Quad mastertapes and/or sources deemed inferior to our own records and tapes have been used including;

Rick Wakeman Six Wives DVD-A = decoded SQ, Rick Wakeman King Arthur DVD-A = demodulated CD-4, Airto/Deodato Live = DV SACD decoded SQ, Santana Abraxas DTS = quite what they used who can say? but the Robin Reel pisses all over it!, Firesign Theatre Everything You Know Is Wrong DVD = decoded SQ, Judy Collins Best Of = AF SACD has distortion not evident on the old Quad disc, Black Sabbath Paranoid DVD = presumably a trashed copy of the CD-4 run through God only knows what!
 
Amen to that! So if Q8s are the Pinto, what does that make SQ? LOL.


The FORD EDSEL, Jonathan ....one of THE most expensive Fiascos in Ford Motor Company's HISTORY:


See the source image
 
i don't know the instance with the moderator you're referring to but i don't find it blindingly obvious or a foregone conclusion (or even remotely funny) that every new release of a Quad on a modern format would be a no-brainer dead cert 100% guaranteed improvement on a Quad tape or Quad LP.

there are a number of examples of Quad releases on modern formats where sources other than the Quad mastertapes and/or sources deemed inferior to our own records and tapes have been used including;

Rick Wakeman Six Wives DVD-A = decoded SQ, Rick Wakeman King Arthur DVD-A = demodulated CD-4, Airto/Deodato Live = DV SACD decoded SQ, Santana Abraxas DTS = quite what they used who can say? but the Robin Reel pisses all over it!, Firesign Theatre Everything You Know Is Wrong DVD = decoded SQ, Judy Collins Best Of = AF SACD has distortion not evident on the old Quad disc, Black Sabbath Paranoid DVD = presumably a trashed copy of the CD-4 run through God only knows what!
I am an INTJ personality type. If you've never heard of the MBIT and/or INTJ, not to worry. But we notice things (for better or worse, but mostly for the better) that others simply do not see nor notice even up close. Small differences we see because we record in our brains patterns, and when something stands out against those zillions of patterns we have stored away, we call the B.S.

Like for instance, reading your post, what strikes an INTJ type is that is it missing the term Q8 (how very odd). Q8 vs SACD from master tapes is what the INTJ is being focused on here, he thinks it's the meat of the conversation. So when someone comes along comments on these comparisons (just mentioned), yet fails to mention Q8 in their weak defense, only saying quad tape (which can mean anything from a Red Robin reel to a Q4), we take 20 points off of their credibility right there. Sorry, it's just the way we look at things. We often excel and finish with the gold, it just tales longer for us. It's also fine to not like that kind of attention to detail. We always meet someone who does. And that just takes longer as well.
 
I am an INTJ personality type. If you've never heard of the MBIT and/or INTJ, not to worry. But we notice things (for better or worse, but mostly for the better) that others simply do not see nor notice even up close. Small differences we see because we record in our brains patterns, and when something stands out against those zillions of patterns we have stored away, we call the B.S.

Like for instance, reading your post, what strikes an INTJ type is that is it missing the term Q8 (how very odd). Q8 vs SACD from master tapes is what the INTJ is being focused on here, he thinks it's the meat of the conversation. So when someone comes along comments on these comparisons (just mentioned), yet fails to mention Q8 in their weak defense, only saying quad tape (which can mean anything from a Red Robin reel to a Q4), we take 20 points off of their credibility right there. Sorry, it's just the way we look at things. We often excel and finish with the gold, it just tales longer for us. It's also fine to not like that kind of attention to detail. We always meet someone who does. And that just takes longer as well.

I find comparing Q8 which at 3 3/4 ips is a full 1/4 of what's on a 15 ips QUAD master tape or Matrix Vinyl [take your pick] which IS dependent on your Turntable/tonearm/cartridge combo set~up {as we all know some are WAY better than others], I find comparing any of the above to an original QUAD master a moot point......

Even QR Open Reel [dolby b or non dolby] constitutes 1/2 of what is contained on a 15 ips master ....... a step up, to be sure from Q8.......but still NOT THE REAL DEAL.

But until all the Q8s, Matrix Vinyl and QRs are released [IF EVER] on a high res digital medium from those masters ...... one must be content with the reduction in quality inherent in these formats. Something IS better than NOTHING!
 
I am an INTJ personality type. If you've never heard of the MBIT and/or INTJ, not to worry. But we notice things (for better or worse, but mostly for the better) that others simply do not see nor notice even up close. Small differences we see because we record in our brains patterns, and when something stands out against those zillions of patterns we have stored away, we call the B.S.

Like for instance, reading your post, what strikes an INTJ type is that is it missing the term Q8 (how very odd). Q8 vs SACD from master tapes is what the INTJ is being focused on here, he thinks it's the meat of the conversation. So when someone comes along comments on these comparisons (just mentioned), yet fails to mention Q8 in their weak defense, only saying quad tape (which can mean anything from a Red Robin reel to a Q4), we take 20 points off of their credibility right there. Sorry, it's just the way we look at things. We often excel and finish with the gold, it just tales longer for us. It's also fine to not like that kind of attention to detail. We always meet someone who does. And that just takes longer as well.

ah now i see where your INTJ wiring has led you to that conclusion, however i used "Quad tape" as a catch all including = Q4, Robin Reel and Q8, just as in the same sentence i used the term "Quad LP" to be all-encompassing for QS, SQ, CD-4, you name it.

i'll say it again, with all the details, especially for the INTJ among the community = it doesn't necessarily follow that a new SACD, BD or DVD release of a Quad will sound better than one of our old Q8's, Q4's, Robin Reel conversions, demodulated CD-4 LPs, decoded SQ or QS LPs.

as you can see, no BS here; i've given facts with actual examples to back up a strong case. all i see in response is rambling cod psychology and car analogies. hope this clears things up.
 
I find comparing Q8 which at 3 3/4 ips is a full 1/4 of what's on a 15 ips QUAD master tape or Matrix Vinyl [take your pick] which IS dependent on your Turntable/tonearm/cartridge combo set~up {as we all know some are WAY better than others], I find comparing any of the above to an original QUAD master a moot point......

Even QR Open Reel [dolby b or non dolby] constitutes 1/2 of what is contained on a 15 ips master ....... a step up, to be sure from Q8.......but still NOT THE REAL DEAL.

But until all the Q8s, Matrix Vinyl and QRs are released [IF EVER] on a high res digital medium from those masters ...... one must be content with the reduction in quality inherent in these formats. Something IS better than NOTHING!

i wholeheartedly agree with you Ralph, however if you look through the examples i cited previously, there have been numerous instances where official releases on SACD/DVD/DTS CD have turned out worse or used inferior sources compared to our old Q8s, Q4s, Robin Reel conversions, CD-4, QS & SQ LPs. this is not merely my opinion, it is a matter of fact.
 
I hope to dear god D/V never issues an SACD that sounds like a Q8. AF never did. Even if they considered it for a split second (like Jon said of Joe Cocker's S/T album).

That's right I am speaking of Q8 here, in case anyone gets confused about tape formats.
 
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