Genuine Matrix Quad LP?

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MidiMagic

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I've always felt that full left to right separation was far more important than front to back separation. Quad should be an expansion of stereo, QS tends to narrow the sound field.
I feel just the opposite because I like recordings of classical music with hall ambience. SQ destroys this. They had to cheat in the recording to make the ambience audible.
 

jaybird100

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Well, I did say that
At last one QS track that I know of is a nightmare in mono. Long story short, working in radio, I put on tape the QS version of Steely Dan's Do It Again. Playing it over-the-air and listening on a mono FM radio, the vocals were gone. :oops:
Well, I DID say that QS isn't perfect, either. I've heard a number of SQ recordings that had this anomaly; The Raiders' "Indian Reservation" is a perfect example. When played in mono, the background vocals completely disappear. But realistically, how many people these days are listening to mono FM radios?
 

gvl_guy

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Well, I did say that

Well, I DID say that QS isn't perfect, either. I've heard a number of SQ recordings that had this anomaly; The Raiders' "Indian Reservation" is a perfect example. When played in mono, the background vocals completely disappear. But realistically, how many people these days are listening to mono FM radios?
Agreed. In the case of the Steely Dan tune I mentioned, it was a record company executive in NYC who used to listen to our station on a clock radio at his desk. He alerted me.

I'd be curious what would happen if you were able to listen to them (matrix encoded) on a Google or Alexa product via stream. Think they would cancel out? It's mono, but I think it's carrying the stereo "signal" (for lack of a better term.) I know my Google speaker can be turned into a stereo pair.
 

jaybird100

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Agreed. In the case of the Steely Dan tune I mentioned, it was a record company executive in NYC who used to listen to our station on a clock radio at his desk. He alerted me.

I'd be curious what would happen if you were able to listen to them (matrix encoded) on a Google or Alexa product via stream. Think they would cancel out? It's mono, but I think it's carrying the stereo "signal" (for lack of a better term.) I know my Google speaker can be turned into a stereo pair.
It's certainly worth a shot. I'd be interested in the results.
 

MidiMagic

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FM radio also carries the stereo signal, but a mono radio does not use it.

Whoever mixed those albums apparently wanted "sound in the round" and didn't know that most matrix encoded systems encode center back so it disappears in mono play.

Only UMX, BMX, UD-4, H, and UHJ encode center back so it does not disappear in mono.
 

jaybird100

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FM radio also carries the stereo signal, but a mono radio does not use it.

Whoever mixed those albums apparently wanted "sound in the round" and didn't know that most matrix encoded systems encode center back so it disappears in mono play.

Only UMX, BMX, UD-4, H, and UHJ encode center back so it does not disappear in mono.
You really can't compare FM stereo to a matrix system. FM stereo has more in common with CD-4 than it does QS or SQ. I haven't really experimented with UD-4 and its subsystems (BMX, UMX), so I'm assuming you're correct on your assessment of their mono compatibility.
 

fizzywiggs41

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Considering the type of music genre those Troy Cory/Cinema Prize Records.....
albums are in (swinging hokey Big Band MOR 70's), EV-4 would be quite possible.

Thinking of other EV-4 Record labels with like music , such as : Project 3 , Ovation , Crewe , and Quad Spectrum .
Evolution , Golden Crest , and Owl are probably the exception.
 

jaybird100

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Considering the type of music genre those Troy Cory/Cinema Prize Records.....
albums are in (swinging hokey Big Band MOR 70's), EV-4 would be quite possible.

Thinking of other EV-4 Record labels with like music , such as : Project 3 , Ovation , Crewe , and Quad Spectrum .
Evolution , Golden Crest , and Owl are probably the exception.
Project 3, Ovation, and Quad Spectrum made the transition to QS. Crewe had just the one release in EV. Evolution did just the sampler in EV.Owl, and Golden Crest, went SQ.
 

fizzywiggs41

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Project 3, Ovation, and Quad Spectrum made the transition to QS. Crewe had just the one release in EV. Evolution did just the sampler in EV.Owl, and Golden Crest, went SQ.
FWIW : Evolution made 2 Samplers in EV-4 .

Quad Spectrum had 4 , but Project 3 and Ovation each made at least 20 (or more ) in EV-4. My point still stands with the particular genre of music those labels chose for EV-4 . Which fits quite well with the Cinema Prize Record label.
 

MidiMagic

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You really can't compare FM stereo to a matrix system. FM stereo has more in common with CD-4 than it does QS or SQ. I haven't really experimented with UD-4 and its subsystems (BMX, UMX), so I'm assuming you're correct on your assessment of their mono compatibility.
FM stereo works like CD-4 but for only two channels.

Like CD-4 has the baseband LF+LB and carrier LF-LB (and an identical system on the right), FM stereo has baseband L+R and subcarrier L-R.

When you use a mono FM radio, you get only the L+R. The stereo radio dematrixes the baseband and carrier to give you separate L and R channels.

The center back signals of most encoded matrix systems appear in only the L-R signal of a stereo FM signal. The mono radio throws this away.

Likewise, the mono mode of a Google or Alexa probably uses an L+R signal while a stereo mode separates them into L and R signals. So the mono version would also throw L-R away.

It is impossible to create a single mono signal that can contain all of the possible modulations of a stereo sound source. At least one kind of modulation would be cancelled out.
 

quadtrade

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Grabbed the Christmas one and will run it thru the various decoders. I Still have an EV. That's a good guess, having lived thru that era. Plus the other Cinema Prize i had decoded in EV.
 

fizzywiggs41

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Isn't it next to impossible to get a radio station with mono transmission nowadays ?

I'm no expert but I would have guessed by now most if not all AM and FM stations are in stereo. And are using stereo exciters .




Sorry @Flaquad

This quad mystery thread is taking on a variety of issues.


I'll have to check out used record stores (and the like ) for records on the Cinema Prize Record label.
 

MidiMagic

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Isn't it next to impossible to get a radio station with mono transmission nowadays ?

I'm no expert but I would have guessed by now most if not all AM and FM stations are in stereo. And are using stereo exciters .
Almost all FM stations are in stereo.
Many AM stations still do not have stereo (there is no single standard, and many are only news).

The baseband is the L+R. The subcarrier is the L-R part.

It is the mono radio the listener has that throws away the subcarrier (the stereo part of the signal). Without the L-R part of the signal, the listener does not hear the center back part of any recording in the following matrix systems:

Dynaco diamond
Dynaquad (DQ)
Electro-Voice (EV)
Sansui (QS)
RM (generic QS)
QM (generic EV)
Stereo-Quad (SQ)
PM (generic SQ)
EV Universal (EV-U)
Dolby Surround (DS)

I do have several mono FM radios I bought two years ago. I use them to keep critters out of outbuildings.
 
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par4ken

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Isn't it next to impossible to get a radio station with mono transmission nowadays ?

I'm no expert but I would have guessed by now most if not all AM and FM stations are in stereo. And are using stereo exciters .




Sorry @Flaquad

This quad mystery thread is taking on a variety of issues.


I'll have to check out used record stores (and the like ) for records on the Cinema Prize Record label.
Just the CBC!
 

Bonzodog

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For the United States, there are very few AM stereo stations left.

There used to be several in Los Angeles. Now there are none in California.

Most of the stations were talk radio, so the only thing one heard in stereo was the bumper music and the ads.


If you want to check out a "blast from the past" ‘90’s web page about AM Stereo, check out


Same thing in Los Angeles for HD Radio. Many stations adopted it when it was introduced, but now there are fewer every year.
 

par4ken

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AM stereo was approved too late in the game. When it first came out the stations were promoting it heavily, advertising hype really. Almost no one had an AM stereo radio. I don't recall seeing any for sale anywhere either.
When I purchased a used Plymouth Voyager it came with AM stereo! Even though the chosen system (C QAUM) was inferior to the Kahn system, it actually worked very well indeed. When I sold the van I lamented not keeping the radio. A few years later I bought a Sony tuner with AM stereo on fleaBay but sadly by that time all the AM stereo stations were gone so I've never heard AM stereo through it.
 
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Bonzodog

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I bought the Denon Tu-680NAB tuner at a NAB convention.

It was designed by engineers from NAB and sold by NAB to be the “official” NAB monitor tuner, meeting the NAB standards.

Even without AM stereo, it is the best AM tuner I have heard.
 
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