How do I get streamed Atmos music to my multichannel setup?

[Coren]

Hey everyone!

I've done a bunch of reading on Atmos for music, and I've come away even more confused than before, so I figured someone here must have cracked the problem and can help create some clarity...

In short: what do I need to be able to use streaming services that support Atmos (TIDAL, Apple Music...) to play multichannel music to my speakers?

The long version:
I am currently religiously buying 5.1 physical releases, which I then rip and store as multichannel FLAC files so I can conveniently play them from my PC (which is connected to my receiver, which is connected to my 5.1 speakers). Imagine my excitement at the idea of being able to use a streaming service to directly cast the full Atmos catalogue to my setup! Except it seems really hard to get that to work in practice, somehow?

- Can you confirm that the Atmos tracks available on TIDAL or Apple Music do contain the orginal number of channels of audio, and they could theoretically support any number of physical speakers? I fear that some services just pre-bake a stereo mix from the original Atmos, which would make it impossible to scale back up to more than 2 channels...
- Are there receivers that support simply "casting" Atmos from any of these services, and that will correctly render the audio to match my speaker configuration?
- If not (or if these receivers are prohibitively expensive), can I just use my Windows PC to bitstream the Atmos from TIDAL/Apple Music to an Atmos-enabled receiver, so the receiver can do the decoding work?
- If not, is there another external device that would be able to do this instead? Like Apple TV or Nvidia Shield? Will they correctly render Atmos on a multichannel setup?

There might be other complications and solutions I'm not thinking of... Any input and experiences will be greatly appreciated!

 

[mrcond]

Apple TV 4K box connected to my AVR with HDMI is what I use to stream Apple Music with full Atmos, and it works great for me. The streaming is not at full bitrates but that doesn’t bother me, it still sounds great on well-produced music.

 

[Coren]

Something that just popped up in my research: would the Apple/Tidal apps that are available on some smart TVs do the trick without having to buy an extra device? Does anyone have experience with those?

 

[edisonbaggins]

Streaming Atmos 101 - Apple Music - Tidal - Amazon Music - Spotify

 

[Coren]

That video was really useful @edisonbaggins, thank you! I had no idea that Dolby Atmos was backward compatible with other Dolby technologies.

I was positively surprised this morning when I installed the Apple Music app on my LG B8 TV, I fired it up, and without any additional steps, it was playing Atmos albums in 5.1 Dolby Digital+ through my old Yamaha HTR-4069. I had no idea that was possible. No additional hardware required, no Apple TV, no Atmos-capable receiver. It just works.

I am super excited and can't wait to explore more, but I'm left with a few questions:

• Why is this information not all over the internet? After spending hours reading up on Atmos on AVR, I was under the impression that only Apple TV 4k/Nvidia Shield Pro would support Atmos streaming, and that I would need a new receiver that supports Atmos. I was ready to spend 1k just to upgrade my hardware. Turns out many TV apps (at least on LG, it does not work on my new Samsung C90) support Atmos streaming, and the backward compatibility means that this might be all you need.
• What am I losing in this downmix (I assume) from Atmos to DD+? Would it make a difference for me to use a real Atmos-capable receiver, given that I only have a 5.1 array?
• I noticed that the rears are more quiet than I would expect. I've tried some albums that i have on Blu-ray, and the 5.1 mixes on disc seem much more aggressive in the rear channels. Does anyone have any idea what this might be due to? Is it because of the way Apple Music downmixes the Atmos?

 

[barturtle]

I'm pretty sure that Tidal, and i think Apple, require that your receiver support Atmos for them to stream Atmos. In other words If you hook up to a non-Atmos receiver, it's going to only give you stereo.

I use a Chromecast With Google TV 4k dongle for Tidal Atmos steaming into an Onkyo Atmos-capable receiver

 

[Coren]

I can 100% confirm that I get Dolby Digital+ through Apple Music LG TV app on my non-Atmos receiver, and it's surround, not stereo. The receiver is obviously not handling Atmos, but it is receiving some multichannel downmix.
You can't fake the ringing clocks in Pink Floyd's Time, they are definitely partially in the rears.

I don't know about Tidal, but Apple Music seems to be aware that my setup supports more than 2 channels and is making good use of it.

 

[zdjh22]

I can 100% confirm that I get Dolby Digital+ through Apple Music LG TV app on my non-Atmos receiver, and it's surround, not stereo. The receiver is obviously not handling Atmos, but it is receiving some multichannel downmix.
You can't fake the ringing clocks in Pink Floyd's Time, they are definitely partially in the rears.

I don't know about Tidal, but Apple Music seems to be aware that my setup supports more than 2 channels and is making good use of it.

Depending on what your non-Atmos receiver can handle and depending on the source material, you’ll get up to either a 5.1 or 7.1 surround “bed” from streaming Atmos. Any overhead speaker info (e.g., 5.1.2, 5.1.4, 7.1.2, 7.1.4, potentially all the way up to 24.1.10) is carried by either metadata (Dolby Mat 2.0 for Apple TV and I would guess by your LG app) or a spatially encoded substream that is ignored by a non-Atmos receiver and is not audible.

The only way to get decoded sound on overhead speakers is to have an Atmos decoder, usually in a home setup in your AVR. The only way to get the data to that receiver for decoding is over HDMI. Otherwise (assuming your AVR can decode Dolby Digital / True HD) you’ll get conventional surround sound, and yes, you’ll hear sounds out of your rear speakers.

If you listen to the first track on the Atmos version of Sgt. Peppers from Apple Music, the overheads carry the separated crowd “noise” at the beginning. I’ll have to listen carefully in a 5.1 or 7.1 Atmos “room” to be sure, but I believe that the crowd noise will just appear (and probably always appears) in the conventional surround channels. The noises are just more distinct on a true Atmos setup with multiple overhead speakers.

If you have an Apple Mac and a bunch of D/A converters, you can use the built-in Atmos renderer (configured via the MIDI setup app in the Utillities folder) and Loopback or Blackhole to send the channel layout you’ve configured (up to 7.1.4) to your speakers. Or to Audacity, where you can listen to one channel at a time if you are curious about what the various channels carry.

 

[darrob104]

I'm pretty sure that Tidal, and i think Apple, require that your receiver support Atmos for them to stream Atmos. In other words If you hook up to a non-Atmos receiver, it's going to only give you stereo.

I use a Chromecast With Google TV 4k dongle for Tidal Atmos steaming into an Onkyo Atmos-capable receiver

I did run into this problem trying to stream multichannel Apple Music using a MacMini connected via HDMI to an older non-Atmos Rotel Pre-amp. I could only get 2-channel, so I went back to a USB connection to a DAC for c-channel.

I use an AppleTV in my home theater for Atmos streaming.

 

[AYanguas]

Tidal server is known to requiere an Atmos capable system. If not, it switches to the stereo version of the song. (5.1 system is NOT Atmos capable).

In my 5.1 system, on the summer house, I use an HDFury Vertex 2 to present an Atmos capable EDID to the FireTV (where I run Tidal App). Then, the Tidal server stream the DD+ Atmos version of the song and I can listen the Atmos 5.1 substream in my 5.1 AVR system.

Apple Music seems to stream always the Atmos version, so a 5.1 System can play the 5.1 substream from the DD+ (or Dolby MAT) Atmos.

I have not checked how Amazon Music behaves.

 

[SomethingAnything]

Hey everyone!

I've done a bunch of reading on Atmos for music, and I've come away even more confused than before, so I figured someone here must have cracked the problem and can help create some clarity...

In short: what do I need to be able to use streaming services that support Atmos (TIDAL, Apple Music...) to play multichannel music to my speakers?

The long version:
I am currently religiously buying 5.1 physical releases, which I then rip and store as multichannel FLAC files so I can conveniently play them from my PC (which is connected to my receiver, which is connected to my 5.1 speakers). Imagine my excitement at the idea of being able to use a streaming service to directly cast the full Atmos catalogue to my setup! Except it seems really hard to get that to work in practice, somehow?

- Can you confirm that the Atmos tracks available on TIDAL or Apple Music do contain the orginal number of channels of audio, and they could theoretically support any number of physical speakers? I fear that some services just pre-bake a stereo mix from the original Atmos, which would make it impossible to scale back up to more than 2 channels...
- Are there receivers that support simply "casting" Atmos from any of these services, and that will correctly render the audio to match my speaker configuration?
- If not (or if these receivers are prohibitively expensive), can I just use my Windows PC to bitstream the Atmos from TIDAL/Apple Music to an Atmos-enabled receiver, so the receiver can do the decoding work?
- If not, is there another external device that would be able to do this instead? Like Apple TV or Nvidia Shield? Will they correctly render Atmos on a multichannel setup?

There might be other complications and solutions I'm not thinking of... Any input and experiences will be greatly appreciated!

Thank you for starting this thread. I was asking similar (but different) questions re how to go about Atmos, only to discover later (to my mortification) I'd been asking on what I think might have been an Allman Brothers thread. (If there's a mod watching, sorry about that!)

I've been a bit anti-Atmos streaming for a variety of reasons that a lot of us probably share (less audio quality being a big one, I don't know how to do it being another and haven't been motivated enough -- due to lesser audio quality -- to try and figure it out, being another). But bet being egged on by edisonbaggins recent video overview (which I've yet to actually watch), I've realised I need to re-evaluate my thoughts.

There are probably three good reasons to access streamed Atmos (I love it when things turn out to be in three):

1. I can't own everything - releases are accelerating and I don't have the room at home or the money
2. a lot of stuff is increasingly only available on streamed services. edisonbaggins Life in Surround video overview is about Atmos stuff exclusively available via streaming. (I'm very keen to listen to last year's The National albums. I love that band)
3. it seems like streaming Atmos could be a good way to check out something before you buy the physical release (if it's available). Too many times, in this game, surround remixing can be frustratingly conservative. It's quite ironic when an artist one may admire for their creativity turns out to be narrow in their view when it comes to creatively presenting their work.

Anyway, I've yet to read properly read through the other above comments (and watch related videos), but as I said I just wanted to thank you for starting up this thread. At the very least, I think I'm going to have to trial streaming Atmos (once I've figured out how to).

 

[newslane]

I am personally at an intersection when it comes to streaming ATMOS releases on Tidal. My Marantz AVR supports it, and the Amazon FireStick I have supported it, but for some reason Tidal keeps changing the rules.

Apparently Tidal no longer supports the Fire software. This makes me wonder what other changes may be coming. Will the new devices I buy that Tidal approves always work, or will they change the rules again, making the new devices useless?

 

[newslane]

In my last post, I wrote that apparently Tidal no longer supports Fire software. At least it looked that way to me after reading the Tidal website, and the fact that I could no longer get my Firestick to play ATMOS Tidal files. Essentially, I gave up even trying.

I needed a new TV, and I bought a Fire Smart TV. After installing it and updating the software, I found that it played Tidal ATMOS files with no trouble at all. I hope this result is not temporary.......

 

[barturtle]

In my last post, I wrote that apparently Tidal no longer supports Fire software. At least it looked that way to me after reading the Tidal website, and the fact that I could no longer get my Firestick to play ATMOS Tidal files. Essentially, I gave up even trying.

I needed a new TV, and I bought a Fire Smart TV. After installing it and updating the software, I found that it played Tidal ATMOS files with no trouble at all. I hope this result is not temporary.......

I picked up a google TV chromecast 4k and it works better for Tidal Atmos than my fireTV stick ever did.

 

[selaimutiara]

Just to add to the discussion, I have been using my Smart TCL TV for streaming atmos from Tidal, yes the TV support Dolby Atmos natively and would play atmos without external receiver, although the experience will not be immersive considering the limited amount and speaker type built in this TV. So I need to connect the TCL TV with either my Atmos AVR or my Samsung Atmos soundbar. Apple Music is not outputting atmos on this TV, as it only can be play by apple devices. Only recently LG gave support to some of their TV to play Dolby Atmos from Apple Music.

Another way, and a convenient one, to enjoy tidal dolby atmos is by using hardware that are embedded with "Tidal Connect" feature. Basically you play Tidal Atmos on your Mobile phone, and cast it to your AVR or Soundbar with Tidal Connect support. My Samsung Soundbar support this, so I just use my phone as a remote, and the Atmos sound come from my soundbar streamed directly from Tidal server, not from my phone.

 

[H.A.L.]

I have a 2023 Sony Bravia with eARC that plays YouTube clips that are in Atmos -- there are several
that are actually Atmos tests (!) -- and with my AVR that decodes Atmos you can experience it.
Being YouTube, though, it would be lossy, so I don't really listen to YouTube for music. To be honest,
I do not know if any Atmos for popular music is available on YouTube, but there are some very nice 4K, iK,
even 12K pic clips that are mainly to demonstrate the visuals, but they also have Atmos sound.