Back when I was buying up Q8s, Mahavishnu's Between Nothingness & Eternity was easily one of my favorite scores. Great-sounding tape and a significantly better quad presentation than the SQ LP.
What's the Latest QUAD TAPE Added to Your Pile? Q8, Q4
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I agree, for a live album it's great. I wonder if having a bunch of microphones in an open-air environment like a concert creates unwanted phase information that impairs the SQ encode/decode process? Kind of an ironic thought given how many matrix quad live albums were released!
I always figured it was partially because the drums are mixed in stereo across the front speakers and the audience is in stereo across the rears, so you get lots of front/back crosstalk going in both directions. The SQ LP through my Tate decoder sounds like the drums and audience are in a sort of 'big stereo' hitting all four speakers, but with McLaughlin's guitar mostly in the front and Hammer & Goodman mostly in the back corners.
congrats on a terrific haul of lots of lovely sealed tapes!
my personal faves are Donny Hathaway and Stanley Turrentine, excellent mixes of beautiful music but really there's so many gems there, it's hard to know where to start!
BigBillQuad, I know I'm late to this thread...but congratulations on your find. My understanding is that your are preserving these by recording to new tape?Yes good spotting steelydave......
This is like a Demo tape, the content of music has good movement of sound & instruments going around the room and instruments in each corner..
Mist one 0K ..........................here it is..
View attachment 33668View attachment 33669View attachment 33671
Will you rip lossless digital copies? What's next? 
Hi. RustyM
I have been procrastinating on this matter I have said in the past that I would transfer my collection to the computer, But the digital device Muto I have is too old and does not work on my newish computer this device only works with Windows XP I am in the proses of getting a modern device at the moment'
I will do my rare Qad 8 track then my RtR tapes then my Quad LP`s when I start doing this I know it`s going to take some time to accomplish, time is the factor ....
BBQ...
I have been procrastinating on this matter I have said in the past that I would transfer my collection to the computer, But the digital device Muto I have is too old and does not work on my newish computer this device only works with Windows XP I am in the proses of getting a modern device at the moment'
I will do my rare Qad 8 track then my RtR tapes then my Quad LP`s when I start doing this I know it`s going to take some time to accomplish, time is the factor ....
BBQ...
BBQ! Thanks for your quick reply. I completely understand your situation. Being retired, I can spend a lot of time working on files but understand the limitations of my computer and it is difficult for me to invest in expensive programs. I'll be honest. My dream may be out of reach, but I would really enjoy being part of a group of restorationist dedicated to preserving the history of surround music. Maybe this group already exists? On the other hand, is restoring these early works of art into Atmos Mixes using AI...is that going to far? LOL! I need an intervention.
RustyM.
I am not a computer person as such, but the thing that I have done up till now is to clean my LPs collection and to de-click the record through the software on my computer to a stereo Matrix wave file, so in the near future I can decode it to a multi-channel file.
About AI I think it is being used in some ways in the industry now and will be shortly available to the public to use. ---- GOOD OR BAD ???????
BBQ...
I am not a computer person as such, but the thing that I have done up till now is to clean my LPs collection and to de-click the record through the software on my computer to a stereo Matrix wave file, so in the near future I can decode it to a multi-channel file.
About AI I think it is being used in some ways in the industry now and will be shortly available to the public to use. ---- GOOD OR BAD ???????
BBQ...
Enoch Light & the Light Brigade "Charge" was one of those recordings that was used often to evaluate Quadraphonic decoders. So the discrete version is about the ultimate for demonstrating quad.
They should have edited the cover it says that it can be played on your regular stereo sets which it can not (properly), that and the QD number are obviously holdouts from the LP(s).
They should have edited the cover it says that it can be played on your regular stereo sets which it can not (properly), that and the QD number are obviously holdouts from the LP(s).
kwd kwd
Member
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I always wished that 8 track 1/4 inch tape reel deck could be modified to do 3.75 IPS, and take the tapes out of the cartridges and put them on a reel and do digital transfers of all the Q8 only titles, to get better transfers than could be done using an 8 track cartridge player. I'd love to see a day where ALL quad titles are released on blu ray discs so you don't have to pay an arm and a leg for reels that are nearing EOL and not to mention all the difficulties of 8 tracks.
perhaps an ampex ATR 100 could be modded to do it?
perhaps an ampex ATR 100 could be modded to do it?
That has been done by some with a "Fostex" reel to reel. Or else with another brand player modified with an 8-track head.
kwd kwd
Member
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I would be interested in knowing who could do this, the foxtex deck idea was one I thought I had thought of. Send me a PM if you know someone.
ndiamone
600 Club - QQ All-Star
1. One that never saw the light of day. Nino and April - The White Whale Sessions which basically consisted of whatever remaining stage-tapes were left from the 1966/`67/`68 sessions in question.
Some numbers have all the stages - and various guys over the past 30 years have tried to re-sync them all - which were all recorded ``wild'' after flying the previous set of tracks out (or back) to another 3-track a-la Phil Spector - and others only have a 3-track or 4-track final and maybe one other stage. These basically had to be re-synched with the mono single master with thousands of edits and miniscule shrinking or expanding of dozens of sections like the Beach Boys Good Vibrations people were doing with DAWs from several years ago.
2. Our own Tad Bartel is the most well-known. Most of even the remotely successful projects are those that involve two Q-8 heads - one mounted in the repro position and the other mounted offset in the sync/record position. The 8-pole piece heads are indeed offset as well with odd-and-even - but as previously discussed - the track placements are different and the playback EQ either has to be reset or disconnected and then re-applied in the digital audio workstation post-transfer.
Some numbers have all the stages - and various guys over the past 30 years have tried to re-sync them all - which were all recorded ``wild'' after flying the previous set of tracks out (or back) to another 3-track a-la Phil Spector - and others only have a 3-track or 4-track final and maybe one other stage. These basically had to be re-synched with the mono single master with thousands of edits and miniscule shrinking or expanding of dozens of sections like the Beach Boys Good Vibrations people were doing with DAWs from several years ago.
2. Our own Tad Bartel is the most well-known. Most of even the remotely successful projects are those that involve two Q-8 heads - one mounted in the repro position and the other mounted offset in the sync/record position. The 8-pole piece heads are indeed offset as well with odd-and-even - but as previously discussed - the track placements are different and the playback EQ either has to be reset or disconnected and then re-applied in the digital audio workstation post-transfer.
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quadsearcher
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
- Joined
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You have these tapes? I'm a fan of Nino and April. Not a hard-core fan, but I like their harmony and overall sound. They seem to have progressed in the late 60s but I've barely dug into it.
I just want to point out that this 4ch cassette went on to sell for
30,000 yen about US$ 204.00
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ndiamone
600 Club - QQ All-Star
I have a few of the stage tapes for the promo EP that came out before they were going to remix and cut the album. Some of the other guys have the rest among everybody who was also forever trolling the archives in the basement from Jerry Cubbage in the 80s and 90s when he was selling all his leftover-from-the-studios B-set masters and never wiped `em out beforehand.
A number of these would become invaluable years later after the various record label vault disasters (not that their normal curation situation is any less of a disaster but I regress). when box sets and so on were redone from scratch with modern technology that can sync different stage tapes together to make a multi-track master.
So if some label or other sent out a call - probably the whole 2-album set could be put together officially since all I have is my own syncs of material I have as well as other syncs from other lock-up artists for material they have.
Of course when we were doing it with the Poor Man's Pro Tools 20 and 30 years ago it was a case of
a) start the same way they did with the backing tracks
b) take the first ODs one phrase at a time one track at a time and expand or shrink by milliseconds so it keeps the beat
c) repeat also one overdub session at a time one track at a time and maybe if you are lucky after a year a normal person wouldn't be able to tell if it was recorded on a 1-inch 8-track like e g Buffalo Springfield - For What It's Worth or some of the early Motown - or whether people put it together from multiple half-inch 3-track/4 track.
Anymore you can get CineSync etc type programs that can lock up the post production ADR to the on set dialogue and not have to worry about e g Chinese dubbing on Chinese action movies and do a whole movie in under a weekend.
The same technology is used here to re-sync ``wild'' (no sync tone) overdubs to a basic track that lose all their sync once they are mixed to mono and flown out or flown in.
Two I wish we had more stages to is their Wings of Love and their Lovin' Valentine the former of which was put on the back of any number of other soon-to-be-dead singles because it was their own composition.
No fair Googling to find out where they stole the yodeling from the introduction from seven years earlier. (Hint: A famous 1994 Disney movie had the original song from which it was inspired as one of a few themes).
On another thread here (and a few other places) I discuss the track layout on the original sound report for all five stages of which only the three stages discussed remain.
In the case of the former, somebody would have to take those three and sync them up to the mono single mix because you can't do an effective fold down of the heavy pan-pot result of the ``stereo'' found here due to too many out of phase artifacts - you need the mono single mix/mono LP mix (different).
In the case of Lovin' Valentine we only have the final 3 track from which the mono single was remixed including the mutes that were neglected to be applied.
All that's around for that is the mono band track and the two mono iso vocal tracks - so somebody w a lot of time on their hands could line both vocals back up in places other than the chorus where they sync naturally.
Another one from there is pure 1959 lounge/exotica for all you wannabe-Martin Denny fans - Don Ralke's B-side to Teen Beat is Four Paces East.
'
Nobody's been able to tell in 60 yrs whether it's two completely different but closely related takes entirely with a totally different electric guitar solo or whether the backing track is the same and two different ODs of the electric guitar.
My ears tell me the former because if you lay them up one against the other like some guy did when he mistakenly called it ``Teen Beat Synched with Four Paces East'' even if you do the best sync imaginable - there's still slight differences enough in the backing track that will give it a not-even-very-narrow-as-expected stereo stage without the stereo image wandering back and forth (how you tell if it's in sync - whatever the common element is will stay in the center).
Another oddity on that one is the electric guitar overdubs have their parts reversed - beginning section and later section is vice versa on the other take. But if you sync them up - they DO sync well enough to be removed in a Center Channel Extractor digital audio workstation leaving you with now-out-of-sync xylophone and acoustic guitar backing track - which if you re-sync THAT makes a not-very weird stereo.
Which makes me wonder if both takes were put out months apart - one on the back of Teen Beat and the other one on the back of Walkin' and Rockin'.
There's also one by late composer Jeremy Slate of his hit track for Tex Ritter Just Beyond the Moon.
Remaining is again 3 of the 5 stages made -
a 3-channel backing track with bass guitar and steel
then one overdub with that mixed to mono and him speaking it on one track and singing on the other track and then a 2nd OD with chorus girls in the background.
Since the ODs have the whole reel outtakes included, people with more patience than me could lift e g more than one dobro track, more than one bass track etc and come up with something really strange for stereo or quad.
The dobro track from Take 3 I think has a counterpoint kind of thing going on, and a couple other takes of the choir (all mono of course) so somebody could make a remix out of all that and put the alternates in the rear and make one of those bouncing arcade ball animation videos out of it.
In the case of the Motown, you have to remember - the recorder was 8-track the console was still 3-track so the only thing that happened was instead of having to fly the ODs out to another deck and then fly it back in again - they could just rewind and lay the second set of 3 tracks under the first and then do the backing singers and lead.
So when you see these ``quadraphonic'' Motown - in the best of cases that's the only way they could remix - and why there's no alternates left of any of the earlier stages because only when they got one they liked would they move on to the next stage even tho they were on on the same tape in the same place.
And there's plenty of others where that came from.
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ndiamone
600 Club - QQ All-Star
Trouble with that is - as stated - he got in trouble for selling home-brewed re-creations on e g home-encoded from an earlier source or for the discrete-one-direction versions - done on a Tascam 237 4-track cassette deck made out of either QRs Q8s or LPs ran thru a noise eraser.
The latter you can tell from little buttons over the cassette reels so you can't put them in the wrong way.
Guy I know bought his 2 tape set in the butterfly case for Jesus Christ Superstar concept album (1970) sent it to me to evaluate - I ran my 2-reel-set of 7-1/2 IPS 2-channel stereo copy thru a period QS decoder - ran that onto a half-inch 15 IPS 4-track and got the same result - so if he's pulling that on other people it's no wonder he got banned.
Yes he got his money back and didn't have to send the tape back. Now he just peeled the (stuck on/adhesive) labels off liberated the tape out and put it into a chrome shell and just used it for his own (AEI (3/4 speed) mastered) cassettes for his garage.
He should have known better.
Chrome tape was very rare in 1972.
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I just got these, still sealed.
Hello evel!
Looking good. Do you know what title XA-1502Z is?
From a purely music appreciation standpoint, I’d like your impressions of the Count Buffalo, as I have that one on my discogs want list (non discrete QM LP version though for me.)
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