HiRez Poll Who, The - WHO'S NEXT [Blu-Ray Audio (Dolby Atmos)]

[halbroome]

Listened a few times now, both the Atmos and the SHM-CD SF Fillmore show (wow! the Who put on a much better concert than their Woodstock gig, and I regret not having seen them live back in the day).

I was leaning toward an 8, like edisonbaggins; however, the CD Japan SHMs, and the fact that I'll definitely listen to the concert SHM-CDs again, unlike the filler in, say, ABBEY ROAD, bumps it up a point.

I thought Entwhistle stood out more than the original, but maybe that's my system now compared to my pathetic turntable in 1971.

The secret to all the sauce is to REALLY CRANK IT. Loud enough for Pete to hear, lol. I have two subwoofers and I wanted two more, haha.

An outstanding album that got a justified deluxe box.

 

[Methuselah’s Grandpa]

I've also voted an 8. I do think some things were out of Steven's control & that score is not a reflection of his effort. If I were to judge the bonus tracks only, ...that would be a 9 or 10.

 

[ted_b]

First of, I was gifted the bluray, so no real big buck justification crept in. The first thing I noticed was the rather large (unusually large) discrepancy in sonics from the Apple Music streaming sound quality to this uncompressed TrueHD version. The bass tightness, impact, Keith's drums, Pete's warm and colorful acoustic guitars (esp on Love Ain't For Keeping)..all of this is quite a bit better than the stream.

The real star of the bluray, IMHO, are the bonus tracks in Atmos.

I give it an 8, with two points lopped off for value (assuming you paid for it) and overall repeatablity. I mean, this album is soooo worn out in my life's soundtrack that I am not sure how many times I'll go back to it monthly. But it's great, so it's important to own. I am not commenting on the rest of the package, as its not applicable for me.

 

[mediumwave13]

(Based on the 5.1 Mix) - I've rated this a "10". This is definitely one of my favourite albums of all time, and to hear it remixed in it's full Steven Wilson glory is an absolute wet dream. They're not a band that I thought he would ever get to mix, given that Townshend and Co. typically like to keep things in-house, like Pink Floyd and Queen. This is, by far and away, the best Who surround title, and honestly, it's up there with my favourite surround mixes of all time. "Won't Get Fooled Again" is worth the price of admission alone, my GOD!! I must have rewound and played that last minute or so about 10 times. Genuine shivers up my spine. The bonus tracks are equally as good. "The Seeker" and "Long Live Rock" are two of my favourite Who tracks, and to hear them in the same fashion is just astounding.

For clarity, my rating is based on the mix alone, and not factoring in the price of the box. To that end, I absolutely get the complaints surrounding the price point - it is well and truly expensive, and not everyone can afford it.

• "Do I think the box is worth the price?" - to be honest, yes. Given the extensive content included in this box, it can't have been cheap to produce and manufacture it. I also can't imagine the production run was that extensive.
• "Should the surround disc have been released separately?" - yes, it should, even if just through Paul Sinclair and the SDE series. However, Universal aren't stupid; they are in this game to make money. They know there are those among us who have done as I have and bought the box when, if the bluray was sold separately, probably wouldn't have. Or worse, they could have followed their earlier lead, gone full "Revolver", and not included a bluray disc at all.

Let's just hope the price of the comes down a bit. I suspect, though, if it is as limited as the other Who boxes were, the value of it is going to just skyrocket once it's out of print.

 

[Clement]

I have given this a few spins now on my modest setup which is 5.0; I have four full-range shelf/stand speakers and a center, but no sub. I find it sounds terrific for vintage quad mixes and I have never felt bass was lacking on those.

I find this mix to be very disappointing. Maybe my expectations were too high (I'll admit I was expecting a lot), maybe it's my setup, maybe the Atmos mix is better. But I find it to be a frustrating case of "neither here nor there". It's spread out more, but that dilutes the impact and power. Some details can be heard a little better, but overall the drums sound washy and distant, vocals sometimes also a bit echoey, and where is the bass??? I also find it to be very tepid - very, very little discrete action going on. On Won't Get Fooled Again things are finally starting to happen with some movement in the rear on the synth, but then the handclaps in the rear just jump out and it seems odd compared to the rest of the album which is so conservatively mixed. All in all, this isn't terrible, but it's just not great either and a real missed opportunity to my ears. But what do I know - maybe the source material doesn't allow for a more aggressive mix? I'm voting a 6 for the main album.

Things do get better with the bonus tracks, which suggests to me that it's not the source material but the choice of the mixer (or the artist) to keep closer to the stereo mix. The bonus tracks feature more discrete action, some tracks even sound a bit like vintage Quad mixes (will have to go back to pinpoint which ones). Bonus material is more like an 8 or maybe even 9. Will have to spend more time with those.

I appreciate your thoughtful comments. First, regarding the bonus tracks: i think, if you spend some time with the comprehensive book, you'll see that it is the source material and not "the choice of the mixer . . . to keep closer to the stereo mix":

The main challenge with creating a surround mix from a vintage album like Who's Next comes from the relatively economic fashion in which it was recoded, at least compared to today's computer based recording where there are virtually no limitations. Several tracks, including 'Won't Get Fooled Again' and some of the non-album singles, were recorded on 16-track, but most of Who's Next itself was recorded on 8-track tape using the technique of bouncing down (multiple parts recorded separately but then reduced to a single channel on the tape to free up channels for further overdubs). Sometimes the multi tracks have the drums recorded in stereo, but just as often on a single mono track. Then there might be a track of bass guitar, a couple of guitars, a lead vocal, one or two backing vocal tracks, and an extra channel with piano, synthesiser, brass, or percussion.

Second, the box set is actually titled Who's Next / Life House, indicating to me that the surround tracks should be rated as a whole. I understand your rating of a 6 for the main album. Given your assessment that the bonus material is "an 8 or maybe even 9," and given the fact that the bonus material (14 cuts as opposed to 9) clocks in at 1:05:05 (as opposed to 43:48), might you consider raising your vote for the surround mixes to a 7 or maybe even 8? Thanks for your time and consideration. Stay Surrounded, Comrade!

 

[shakti]

Clement,
I think you're probably right, and my vote is probably colored by (unrealistically?) high expectations. I still stand by my vote for the mix itself, but coupled with the bonus material, and with the overall quality of the music and the presentation I do agree it deserves at least a 7 overall.

I can't help but compare it with Electric Ladyland though, a similarly feted classic rock album. No more than 8 tracks for that one either AFAIK. While there were a few tracks with underwhelming mixes (originally on 4 track), the majority were great and some were flat out stunning. Furthermore, the 2003(?) SACD 5.1 mix of Tommy was a much more discrete and immersive experience IMO, although with that one the departure from the original stereo mix is quite extreme and that, of course, was not what Steven Wilson wanted to do with this one.

 

[sjcorne]

I can't help but compare it with Electric Ladyland though, a similarly feted classic rock album. No more than 8 tracks for that one either AFAIK. While there were a few tracks with underwhelming mixes (originally on 4 track), the majority were great and some were flat out stunning.

I've got to disagree there. Most of Electric Ladyland was recorded on an experimental Scully 12-track machine, but even so I think Eddie Kramer could have gone a lot further with it given the psychedelic nature of the album. I don't dislike what he did there - it sounds appropriately 'big' - but there isn't really that much separation between the front & back soundstages to my ears. Even the passages with sound in motion - like the backing vocals in "Crosstown Traffic" and first guitar solo in "1983" - are executed in kind of a subtle way, as if he was afraid it being labeled as 'gimmicky'. In some ways, running the old stereo LP through your decoder of choice yields a bolder surround experience.

Steven Wilson had less to work with for Who's Next, and - at least for me - he crafted a far more adventurous and exciting mix. I've heard numerous fan-made upmixes of this album (Specweb, Penteo, my own attempt using a Tate II decoder, etc) and none of them come close to this. Every song is pulled apart in interesting ways, yet it doesn't sound too different from the iconic original stereo presentation. YMMV.

 

[ubertrout]

Wow. Gave this a ten. Listened to Atmos in 7.1. Cranked the volume about 4 db than usual and it all clicked into place for me. Bargain being an upmix was really obvious, I feel like I might be unusually sensitive to that? But you do the best with what you have, and this feels about as good as it could have been.

 

[califcab]

I gave this a ten. Including the bonus tracks in ATMOS to essentially give you all of Life House was fabulous. The ATMOS mixes were better on some cuts than others due to source material - but as a whole a big wow when cranked up. The extra discs, which I often play once and then ignore in box sets - were terrific and all worthy of inclusion. In short - everything I was hoping for.

 

[ar surround]

Steven Wilson had less to work with for Who's Next, and - at least for me - he crafted a far more adventurous and exciting mix. I've heard numerous fan-made upmixes of this album (Specweb, Penteo, my own attempt using a Tate II decoder, etc) and none of them come close to this. Every song is pulled apart in interesting ways, yet it doesn't sound too different from the iconic original stereo presentation. YMMV.

I was going to wait until I listened to the material in all three formats before posting my thoughts, but I simply cannot take it any longer. This new Steven Wilson set is simply MAGNIFICENT. The only other times I've felt so overjoyed upon first hearing a new multichannel release was when I first played The Beatles Love album; and again when I heard SW's 5.1 of Cross-eyed Mary.

And no, Jonathan, my mileage does not vary from yours. You are just so absolutely spot on about how it doesn't sound too different from the original stereo presentation. Yet there is more detail, and the muddiness and other warts of the stereo mix are now gone. I can only imagine how truly difficult it is to make something like this. But hey, if it was easy everyone would be doing it.

Sorry, but none of my old fart friends are going to have much interest in the impressive Atmos mix of TFF The Tipping Point. They will want to hear Who's Next...and they will be in awe of it.

(Side point: I feel that the 5.1 Penteo mix of Bargain sounds superior to the Atmos version. The 5.1 upmix came out quite nice. The Atmos version seems to employ a bit too much additional reverb on a song that already has a lot of it.)

 

[doyscoy]

I voted with a score of 9, based upon the 5.1 mix, as that is what my system is. To my ears, 'Bargain' really did stand out like the upmix it is, but it would have been criminal to not try for the best possible compromise when the original multitrack is not available. I knew of the limitations involved with recording the original drum tracks, and while SW did give the kick drum definition and punch, there wasn't much to work with in creating "space" between the entire drum kit. Keith's cymbal bashings certainly cannot be ignored!

As for the purchase price, I definitely balked for a day or so until my loving wife urged me to just get it and stop second-guessing. I truly appreciate the scope of the entire package, and I kind of like of draining my retirement savings for something awesome, and not leaving money behind for the estate tax to grab.

I'm genetically predisposed to lose my hearing in the next few years, so I prefer to listen today and worry about my deaf years when they come.

 

[shakti]

OK, I’m caving in and upping my vote to an 8. I think the overall disc deserves as much. I am still a little bit underwhelmed by the mix if the original album, just a bit too conservative for my taste, but I find that really (and I mean *really*) cranking it helps to give it the punch and presence it deserves. My system probably doesn’t do it full justice as the mix seems more focused on opening it up and giving the whole thing more ambience. Mine is a rather modest setup which is not the most revealing, but works really great on very discrete mixes like vintage quad mixes. I think that may also explain why I find it lacking in bass whereas others don’t have that complaint at all.

 

[BillTubes]

What a great release. I am reviewing the 5.1 mix. The mix is better then I expected given the age of the original tapes. This is an iconic rock album so we have heard it many times. The fidelity of the bluray is far better then any other release I have heard. The surround mix at times blows me away. Blue Eyes and Won’t get fooled Again brings tears. The bonus tracks are awesome. I was never a fan of Join Together. I thought it as a weak commercial radio release. Was I wrong, the surround mix revivals it as a masterwork. Probably my favorite track.

 

[ar surround]

The surround mix at times blows me away. Blue Eyes and Won’t get fooled Again brings tears.

Glad I wasn't the only one.

I was never a fan of Join Together. I thought it as a weak commercial radio release. Was I wrong, the surround mix revivals it as a masterwork.

That was my impression of Join Together as well. And as you said, what a revelation the new multi-channel version is. Ditto Long Live Rock!

 

[omnipotent1]

Solid 7 for me.I took some points off for the rather tame mix and sound quality.Tommy on SACD which was recorded a couple years before this sounds much better and the mix is far better than Next as well IMHO.I also find the vocals a little too loud and too much anchored in the center channel(Atmos and 5.1)
But overall a really nice worthwhile package but I'm grading just on the Bluray content.

 

[ar surround]

and sound quality.Tommy on SACD which was recorded a couple years before this sounds much better

Tommy, in all of its incarnations, has always had noticeably better sound quality than Who's Next and material prior to then. I noticed the rather excellent sound quality of Tommy going way back to the LP days. But the Who's Next sound quality is far better than Quadrophenia, which has a low-fi sound to it especially the really smeared cymbals.

 

[marpow]

I voted 9.
Listening to The Atmos, I just wanted to hear Quadrophenia in ATMOS, go figure.
My intention was to do one of my super reviews, but just too overwhelmed with all the surround being released this year.
CD's: My favorite was Disc's 1&2. Super cool. Collectively between all CD's I loved between the tracks, the talking of band members.
Blu Ray: Who's Next original Dolby Atmos, super great, the 14 Bonus Tracks, no big deal.
My purchase was the Japanese edition with SHM CD's.
Why not a 10? Sonically super good, I loved the drums and bass as I have never heard them so good. I think as my surround hobby is now 10 years old, this release was not my favorite of the year 2023, Too much hype and anticipation?
The two books: another overwhelming thing to do, maybe later I will do?

Keep poll threads pure. Please post your thoughts to your personal listening experience only.

 

[Larry Geller]

I voted 9.
Listening to The Atmos, I just wanted to hear Quadrophenia in ATMOS, go figure.
My intention was to do one of my super reviews, but just too overwhelmed with all the surround being released this year.
CD's: My favorite was Disc's 1&2. Super cool. Collectively between all CD's I loved between the tracks, the talking of band members.
Blu Ray: Who's Next original Dolby Atmos, super great, the 14 Bonus Tracks, no big deal.
My purchase was the Japanese edition with SHM CD's.
Why not a 10? Sonically super good, I loved the drums and bass as I have never heard them so good. I think as my surround hobby is now 10 years old, this release was not my favorite of the year 2023, Too much hype and anticipation?
The two books: another overwhelming thing to do, maybe later I will do?

Keep poll threads pure. Please post your thoughts to your personal listening experience only.

Quadrophenia??

 

[Titch]

I voted 9.
Listening to The Atmos, I just wanted to hear Quadrophenia in ATMOS, go figure.

Keep poll threads pure.

 

[originalsnuffy]

I voted 9. The bluray is superb. Steve Wilson is THE man. Love the low end (e.g. John E.).

As noted well on Steve Hoffman forums, SF Civic sounds a bit off in the mix. And some audience material was flown in without a positive benefit.

But overall I am happy with this set. I sold off quite a few titles that I don't play much to pay for this one.

I hope that Floyd's DSOTM at $20 sets a new direction for the industry. I would buy a ton of releases in Atmos at prices like that.